Obama and Dems to go it alone on health-care reform, if GOP refuses to compromise

[WildCat]

If it's done under budget reconciliation, the legislation can't add to the deficit.

The only time that was done for a bill that wasn't paid for was for the giant tax cuts in 2001.

I love it when tax cuts have to be "paid for" as if it was the same as building an aircraft carrier...

 

[dudalb]

true. But I hope we have politicians who have broader vision than reelection.

The problem is if the GOP gets control of congress, they can repeal the bill.
The Practical relalties of politics just slip by some people.

 

[WildCat]

The problem is if the GOP gets control of congress, they can repeal the bill.

And Obama can veto the repeal.

 

[dudalb]

Even attempting that "achievement" cost the Dems a seat in Massachusetts. Especially the blue dogs, and as Brown's election showed even Dems from liberal districts should be careful.

I predict the Dems will let this one fade away after it become clear the votes aren't there.

And come up with another even less effective Health Care bill which will change nothing but they will pass in order to have something to campaign on in November.
The only thing that makes me hope the Dems keep control of congress is that the GOP in control would be even worse,with nothing being done for the next 2 years on any problem.
I have come to agree with a poster a few months ago who predicted that nothing would be done about Health Care for another Ten Years, and by that time the problem would have become so dire that the GOP would be forced to support a bill that makes the present bills look moderate in comparasion.
Health Care is a huge problem, and pretending the problem does not exist will not work, even if the Insurance Companies love you for it.
God, I hate BOTH parties.

 

[dudalb]

And Obama can veto the repeal.

True, but still, the suggesstion that the Dems pass the bill and reelection be damned is pretty silly .

 

[joobz]

The problem is if the GOP gets control of congress, they can repeal the bill.
The Practical relalties of politics just slip by some people.

And you are perfectly catering to why it was thought democracy could never work, because you are limited by the lowest common denominator. It is why we have the checks and balances in place.

If the democrats truly believe in the health care bill, they should stand by their convictions. If all they worry about is next election cycle, than they are useless to us.

 

[joobz]

True, but still, the suggesstion that the Dems pass the bill and reelection be damned is pretty silly .

No, it isn't. It's called leadership.

 

[willhaven]

I love it when tax cuts have to be "paid for" as if it was the same as building an aircraft carrier...

If the health care bill goes through the reconciliation process, it will be held to a higher financial standard than both the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts. The rules since 2007 are more strict.

 

[WildCat]

If the health care bill goes through the reconciliation process, it will be held to a higher financial standard than both the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts. The rules since 2007 are more strict.

Rules are made to be broken will.

Or in the case where you get to actually make the rules, rewritten.

In any case, I stand by my prediction that the Dems no longer have the votes to pass this bill.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Looks to me like the stage is being set for 1994 all over again.

wanna make a bet?

I bet you $20 that the Dems WILL pass a health-care reform bill...this year.

If they do, so much the better. If they pass anything that bears even the faintest resemblance to the bloated, incomprehensible, expensive, destructive mess that they are currently trying to shove on to a nation that does not want it, then I predict it will take them much longer to recover from 2010 and 2012 than it took them to recover from 1994. In the mean time, the Republicans will be sufficiently in charge to clean up the mess that they've made, and mitigate the harm that it otherwise would have caused to the nation and its people.

Remember, it was the Clintons' attempt to push a similar scam on the American people that was a major factor in 1994.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

I guess you would have preferred we let GM go under and put 50,000 Americans out of work.

Do you think this would be the first time that's happened, that a major American automobile manufacturer has gone bankrupt? Do you think it would be the last?

This nation has survived many such events. It will survive many more. If a company is so horrendously mismanaged as General Motors was, then it needs to die, for the good of the economy as a whole. Yes, it will hurt, but some illnesses don't have easy, comfortable cures. I had a tooth pulled a few weeks ago. It hurt, but the tooth was sick, it was damaging my health as a whole, and so it had to go. Perhaps the same is true of General Motors.

The answer is not to turn this nation into a clone of the failed Союз Советских Социалистических Республик by putting government in charge of industry. It didn't work for the Союз Советских Социалистических Республик, and it won't work here either.

 

[Grizzly Bear]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100218/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_health_care_overhaul_14

Good for Obama. Time to show some balls. Good to have you back.

If the GOP chooses politics over the American people, then we will do what needs to be done..without you.

This should come as no surprise, an ideologically driven bill draws partisanship from the get go. History's repeating itself.

 

[willhaven]

Rules are made to be broken will.

Or in the case where you get to actually make the rules, rewritten.

So what rules are they planning to rewrite in order to pass health care under reconciliation?

In any case, I stand by my prediction that the Dems no longer have the votes to pass this bill.

They've already got the votes if they're willing to put the Republicans on a state and endure a filibuster to see who caves first and what the public perception of congress is at that point.

Whether by reconciliation or allowing a filibuster to go on and on, both would probably bode well for Dems. What wouldn't go over well is doing nothing at all.

Honestly, I'm surprised health care reform has come this far given the summer and early fall insanity with the town halls.

 

[novice skeptic]

The GOP is afraid of a confident Obama and Democratic party. Such a move would show confidence.

And once the American people become familiar with the TRUE details of the plan, and not the fear-mongering right-wing extremist Conservative lies, the American people will support the plan and give the GOP few if any advances on November 4th.

I can't pretend to speak for a movement of people (and I don't know how you can either) but I don't think the GOP is afraid of a confident Obama. I think a confident Obama who steamrolls through an unpopular massive program (if that's what the public thinks it is, and right now I'd say that's what they think) plays right into their hands.

Obama scores best when he is seen as transcending race and politics and divisions. When he's partisan he scores big time with the left, but that's not going to win him any elections.

 

[novice skeptic]

i have no doubt the final bill will be revealed online before the House passes it and the Senate amends it.

The Dems will act. The GOP will look obstructionist. And Obama will have saved his legacy.

That's not what he promised and you seem to be avoiding the other poster's question. Full coverage of the negotiation WHILE the bill is being hammered out, not when a final bill comes to the floor. There's a difference, not that many people will watch either.

 

[novice skeptic]

in order to know my enemy.

That's funny. I consider all Americans to be my fellow citizens and brothers/sisters whether they belong to one party, a different one, or no party. Enemy status is reserved for, you know, our enemies.

 

[Thunder]

So what rules are they planning to rewrite in order to pass health care under reconciliation?

um...none. no Congressional rules will be broken. no new precedent will be set.

 

[novice skeptic]

Nevermind, someone posted links to the other legislation. I will read them over.

 

[daenku32]

I can't pretend to speak for a movement of people (and I don't know how you can either) but I don't think the GOP is afraid of a confident Obama. I think a confident Obama who steamrolls through an unpopular massive program (if that's what the public thinks it is, and right now I'd say that's what they think) plays right into their hands.

Obama scores best when he is seen as transcending race and politics and divisions. When he's partisan he scores big time with the left, but that's not going to win him any elections.

The Public Option is popular, so I don't see where the opposition comes from, except from the right. The left would be ecstatic and energized.

Obama had a lot of support in the beginning of his term because of the hope and change stuff. It has been his desire to "transcend" political divisions that have cost him because the effort hasn't been fruitful.

 

[dudalb]

um...none. no Congressional rules will be broken. no new precedent will be set.

And that it is going to look as if the Dems used a obscure parliamentary maneuver to force a bill this important down the American's people's throat had no meaning to you.
Talk about Partisan Blinders.