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Michael Flynn charged

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...l-flynns-statement-his-guilty-plea/913350001/

After over 33 years of military service to our country, including nearly five years in combat away from my family, and then my decision to continue to serve the United States, it has been extraordinarily painful to endure these many months of false accusations of "treason" and other outrageous acts. Such false accusations are contrary to everything I have ever done and stood for. But I recognize that the actions I acknowledged in court today were wrong, and, through my faith in God, I am working to set things right. My guilty plea and agreement to cooperate with the Special Counsel's Office reflect a decision I made in the best interests of my family and of our country. I accept full responsibility for my actions.
 
BobTheCoward said:
If it was the extent of what they were able to charge him with, what would be the different external hallmarks?
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A non plea deal would be more likely to plead not guilty.
Lots of things can happen at trial, even for a man who knows he is guilty.
This is of course speculative, and not proof, but there is some weight to the idea.
 
TheL8Elvis said:
okay.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/mich...se-statements-fbi-documents/story?id=50849354

ABC’s Brian Ross says a source familiar with the matter says Flynn is prepared to testify against Trump, members of his family, Trump staff, & that Trump ordered him to contact the Russians. Ross says Flynn made the decision to cooperate 24 hours ago

Probably just "overblown and overhyped in the minds of progressives." though. :rolleyes:
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Flynn doesn't appear to be testifying to anything illegal outside his own behavior.
 
Seth Abramson has been twittering nonstop about this.

My takeaways of his feed:

1) For Flynn to receive a single charge, his information must have been extremely good.

2) Mueller called in Kushner last week to catch him in lies re: Flynn.
 
WilliamSeger said:
I think it's very much a part of the battle to remove Trump from office with an obstruction of justice impeachment. There is a reason that Trump tried so hard to protect Flynn, and why so many Trump people lied about so many Russian contacts, and if it turns out to be because Trump was aware of illegal activities, I do believe he will be impeached.
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The problem is that impeachment is, in the final analysis, a political process. An impeachable offense is something that a majority of the House of Representatives believes is an impeachable offense. Convicting and removing a president requires 2/3 of the Senate. I have doubts that there is anything that will convince enough Republicans in either body to get rid of Trump. The mid-terms will probably change the makeup of Congress, but it seems likely that getting 2/3 of the Senate to convict will be next to impossible. I'm afraid we are stuck with Trump until 2021.

When Nixon resigned, there were enough Republicans who cared about the integrity of the presidency to convince Nixon to resign rather than be impeached and removed. I don't think there are enough Republicans now who care about the integrity of the presidency to make resignation or removal happen. I will be pleasantly surprised if I am wrong.
 
theprestige said:
I think part of it is that his actual activities have been overblown and overhyped in the minds of progressives. They probably include a lot of speculation, a lot of supposition, and a lot of wishful thinking.

And I think part of it is that it's not what you know, it's what you can prove. As a great man might have said, you go to trial with the charges you have, not the charges you wish to have or plan to have at a later date.

But hey, look on the bright side: They got Martha Stewart for the same thing. They got Al Capone for tax evasion. They almost got Bill Clinton for perjury.
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I don't think he would have plead guilty to anything if you were right.

If all they have a chance to prove is this minor charge, make them prove it. There is very little downside to a not-guilty plea if they have nothing more.

At the very least, it appears that Flynn and his attorneys think they are avoiding more serious charges that have actual evidence behind them by pleading guilty to this one.
 
CORed said:
The problem is that impeachment is, in the final analysis, a political process. An impeachable offense is something that a majority of the House of Representatives believes is an impeachable offense. Convicting and removing a president requires 2/3 of the Senate. I have doubts that there is anything that will convince enough Republicans in either body to get rid of Trump. The mid-terms will probably change the makeup of Congress, but it seems likely that getting 2/3 of the Senate to convict will be next to impossible. I'm afraid we are stuck with Trump until 2021.

When Nixon resigned, there were enough Republicans who cared about the integrity of the presidency to convince Nixon to resign rather than be impeached and removed. I don't think there are enough Republicans now who care about the integrity of the presidency to make resignation or removal happen. I will be pleasantly surprised if I am wrong.
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If they pass their tax "reform" what more use do they have for Trump? Pence will fit in just fine for their evil agenda.
 
chrispy said:
According to 'sources' and person labeled a 'Flynn confidant', Flynn to testify that Trump asked him to contact Russians.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/12/01/flynn-to-testify-trump-ordered-him-to-contact-russians-reports.html
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Which isn't illegal or even unusual.

But I don't think it was Trump.

Most pundits think it was Kushner.

Part of Flynn's testimony would naturally include the reason he contacted Russia.

Jim Sciutto‏Verified account @jimsciutto

Important - Flynn says he was told to contact Russians: According the FBI statement, Flynn communicated with Kislyak after being asked by a senior Trump transition official to find out how foreign governments stood on the coming UN Security Council resolution about Israel.
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LTC8K6 said:
Contacting Russia about the sanctions during the transition seems normal to me.
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May have been illegal.

Someone might correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the U.S. has laws against non-government people negotiating with foreign governments on its behalf. Since Trump hadn't been sworn in yet, he had no legal authority to initiate any contacts with Russia about sanctions, military cooperation, or any sort of economic or diplomatic matters.
 
They've already prepared a meme that it was to initiate discussions on what to do about Syria, and that this was the kind of thing done all the time.
 
Segnosaur said:
May have been illegal.

Someone might correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the U.S. has laws against non-government people negotiating with foreign governments on its behalf. Since Trump hadn't been sworn in yet, he had no legal authority to initiate any contacts with Russia about sanctions, military cooperation, or any sort of economic or diplomatic matters.
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Sounds weak to me, he was the incoming NSA and would be expected to be contacting foreign governments.
 
Dr. Keith said:
I don't think he would have plead guilty to anything if you were right.

If all they have a chance to prove is this minor charge, make them prove it. There is very little downside to a not-guilty plea if they have nothing more.

At the very least, it appears that Flynn and his attorneys think they are avoiding more serious charges that have actual evidence behind them by pleading guilty to this one.
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It's kind of like poker, though, isn't it? Everybody has incomplete information. You know what cards you hold. You know what cards are on the table. You may have some idea of the cards the other guy holds, but without knowing for sure, you have to weigh risk and reward.
 
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