Michael Brown shooting II

[Mumbles]

Takes a big hole to bury a tank but by George, I think he's up to it.

Heh.

Anyway, I think we're done now. The folks claiming that "thug" can't be a slur have offered no credible reason for why it should apply to whoever black person gains the media eye, and really, they've had decades to come up with an answer.

So it's a slur for black people, no reasonable objections. Let's move on.

I'd like to go back to another question: how do we know that there were 11 shots fired? The reason I'm asking is that it's entirely possible that every shot that Wilson took, was captured in that guy's recording. We're assuming that the first shot was taken before the recording started, and that could be correct, but it's also possible that Wilson's first shot was the one in the audio - the one that has the short pause before the 5-shot volley.

 

[Fudbucker]

Heh.

Anyway, I think we're done now. The folks claiming that "thug" can't be a slur have offered no credible reason for why it should apply to whoever black person gains the media eye, and really, they've had decades to come up with an answer.

So it's a slur for black people, no reasonable objections. Let's move on.

I'd like to go back to another question: how do we know that there were 11 shots fired? The reason I'm asking is that it's entirely possible that every shot that Wilson took, was captured in that guy's recording. We're assuming that the first shot was taken before the recording started, and that could be correct, but it's also possible that Wilson's first shot was the one in the audio - the one that has the short pause before the 5-shot volley.

We don't because we don't know for sure the recording is an actual recording of what happened. Once again, when you're talking to someone, and a volley of nearby gunshots happens, do you obliviously continue on with your conversation as if nothing has happened? That alone, and the lateness of when the recording was turned over to CNN, should raise all sorts of red flags.

 

[Cain]

Good, I take it you concede then that Wilson could have had a temper problem and there are some indicators.

Let me see if I understand this. When I asked if there was any history of Wilson having a temper problem, you somehow took that to mean: "No, you said there was no evidence Wilson was a jerk."

Who said he fired a warning shot?

Well, in your last post, you wrote: "I think if that was the case then the police chief giving the first news conference would have said, 'fired a single warning shot.'"

Re: Were the six shots fired when Brown's back was turned?

I've never said they were. I said when Wilson started firing, Brown stopped and turned around.

I'm not sure why you insist on being as clear as mud. Are you suggesting that sometime during the volley of six Brown was turning around?? I wanna say you can't believe that because it's mentally-handicapped, but... maybe you do.

Are you saying he shot at Brown for the simple reason Brown was moving forward? Shouldn't Wilson be yelling at Brown to get on the ground? Did he shoot because he didn't like Brown taunting him?

For the nth time, I'm saying what could have happened, and seems like a better explanation than whatever it is you're groping for, is that Wilson and Brown struggled at the car, and a round went off. Brown and Johnson ran, and Wilson fired one or two "warning" shots. Brown eventually stops, turns around, possibly taunts, and charges/"bum-rushes"/"comes at" Wilson.

So when you say "the simple reason Brown was moving forward," you're sort of B.S.ing because here's a guy who very well could have assaulted a police officer, certainly just robbed a store, possibly struggled to gain control of said officer's weapon, and now he's coming at a man with a gun.

So... Wilson fires six shots, probably striking Brown's right side. Big Mike doesn't stop, so Wilson dumps four more.

Now if Brown did charge after taunting "What're you gonna do about it?" I'd understand they're not going to have a conversation. People only exchange banter in romantic adventure movies while reluctantly teaming up to fight nameless bad guys: "This is why I would never go out with a pig like you -- duck" (clunks a baddie) "Well honey, you're way too high-strung for me anyway -- jump!" (stomps a baddie).

The time frame makes it very hard to match up Wilson's story with the last recorded 10 shots.

You're not the first person to say something like this, and by "something like this" I mean use "Wilson's story" interchangeably with "Josie's account," while in other posts denigrating Josie's account as "third-hand." As I've said a half-dozen times already, the Josie account is compelling because it correctly predicted the ballistics will not show any bullets to the back, as well as mentioning the approximate location of the fatal shot. This is then corroborated in an overheard conversation with someone who presumably witnessed it the event, and used similar language "he just kept comin.'"

 

[Unabogie]

We don't because we don't know for sure the recording is an actual recording of what happened. Once again, when you're talking to someone, and a volley of nearby gunshots happens, do you obliviously continue on with your conversation as if nothing has happened? That alone, and the lateness of when the recording was turned over to CNN, should raise all sorts of red flags.

I hope you realize that you're the only person left on earth who hasn't accepted the obvious fact that the recording is authentic. I've already explained the technology to you. How is it that you cannot understand that "edited" or "faked" are impossible?

 

[Unabogie]

Let's move on.

I'd like to go back to another question: how do we know that there were 11 shots fired? The reason I'm asking is that it's entirely possible that every shot that Wilson took, was captured in that guy's recording. We're assuming that the first shot was taken before the recording started, and that could be correct, but it's also possible that Wilson's first shot was the one in the audio - the one that has the short pause before the 5-shot volley.

I think that based on the audio, we've now narrowed it down to between 10-13 shots. We think there are 11 because of the natural pause that would have occurred as Wilson exited his SUV before shooting again. Some people have speculated that there could have been 2 more shots before the audio begins. As I've said before, if the police report more than 11 shells, then we'll have to revise our understanding. If there are only eleven shells, and the audio captures the last 11, then Darren Wilson's account is called into serious doubt.

We shall see.

 

[Fudbucker]

I hope you realize that you're the only person left on earth who hasn't accepted the obvious fact that the recording is authentic. I've already explained the technology to you. How is it that you cannot understand that "edited" or "faked" are impossible?

Well, me and the FBI, and CNN commentators, and the Ferguson PD, and audio experts, and the head of Glide communications...

But other than that, yeah. I'm the only one.

 

[Mumbles]

I think that based on the audio, we've now narrowed it down to between 10-13 shots. We think there are 11 because of the natural pause that would have occurred as Wilson exited his SUV before shooting again. Some people have speculated that there could have been 2 more shots before the audio begins. As I've said before, if the police report more than 11 shells, then we'll have to revise our understanding. If there are only eleven shells, and the audio captures the last 11, then Darren Wilson's account is called into serious doubt.

We shall see.

Indeed. This would be much easier if the local PDs would either release the relevant details, or just say that everything's under wraps during the investigation - rather than running a smear campaign and attacking the local residents, reporters, and so forth.

I have to say, this is the worst cover-up I've seen in my life outside of North Korea, regardless of what the PD are covering up.

 

[GWCarver]

Well, me and the FBI, and CNN commentators, and the Ferguson PD, and audio experts, and the head of Glide communications...

But other than that, yeah. I'm the only one.

Being a skeptic, I'm skeptical about the recording as well.

 

[Fudbucker]

No, I just made a decision not to deal with bigots online any further, except to make an example out of them. It's better for my mental health. And so, this is the only answer you will get from me.

Go away kid, you bother me.

LOL, you obviously can't deal with contrary viewpoints.

It's all true. Brown was trying to pay for his cigars. Wilson is a thug whose record of systemic abuse was covered up by the corrupt Ferguson PD. Brown was trying to polish Wilson's shoes when he was shot through the head.

Sure.

 

[Skeptic Tank]

I believe the recording is authentic and I believe he likely had a headset on at the time, with full ear covering headphones, and that's why he didn't even notice or react to the gunshots. That'd be my guess.

I see nothing about the recording which sheds any substantial light on what happened.

 

[newyorkguy]

<snip> How is it that you cannot understand that "edited" or "faked" are impossible?

Well, me and the FBI, and CNN commentators, and the Ferguson PD, and audio experts, and the head of Glide communications... But other than that, yeah. I'm the only one.

Are you saying the FBI, CNN, the Ferguson PD, audio experts and the head of Glide Communications all agree the tape a) was edited/faked, b) could've been edited/faked or c) have not said they accept it as genuine?

Can you provide some cites to back up your assertion that CNN, the FBI, FPD, audio experts (IMO the one you previously cited has been debunked) and Glide all think it's possible the tape was faked?

 

[Unabogie]

Well, me and the FBI, and CNN commentators, and the Ferguson PD, and audio experts, and the head of Glide communications...

But other than that, yeah. I'm the only one.

What? No. The Glide people have authenticated the following two things about that audio:

1) It was taken at the time Michael Brown was shot.
2) It was taken in close proximity to where Michael Brown was shot.

Furthermore, the man's lawyer has confirmed his address, which means both his address of record and the geolocation placed him near the scene of the crime, as it were.

You keep alluding to the possibility that the gunshots were added later or edited in. However, this is impossible. As in NOT POSSIBLE because of PHYSICS.

So what possible alternate explanations are you left with? A man sitting near the crime scene records what sounds like the gunfire from a Sig pistol at the exact moment that Michael Brown is killed, but by some bizarre coincidence is actually recording a DIFFERENT set of 10 shots fired at precisely the same time and same place? Shots that were not reported by anyone as having occurred?

 

[Fudbucker]

Are you saying the FBI, CNN, the Ferguson PD, audio experts and the head of Glide Communications all agree the tape a) was edited/faked, b) could've been edited/faked or c) have not said they accept it as genuine?

Can you provide some cites to back up your assertion that CNN, the FBI, FPD, audio experts (IMO the one you previously cited has been debunked) and Glide all think it's possible the tape was faked?

I can back up my assertion that none of them are going on the record saying it's an authentic recording of what actually happened. To my my knowledge, no one has, except some people here.

 

[newyorkguy]

I can back up my assertion that none of them are going on the record saying it's an authentic recording of what actually happened. <snip>

Okay. Please do so.

 

[Distracted1]

I'm pretty sure the evidence overwhelmingly supports the conclusion Brown was never inside the vehicle and the physical exchange took place through the car window with Wilson never having made it further than opening his door.

The police chief made some comments about a struggle inside the car that seemed to me to be a misunderstanding of a hastily stated or a second hand version of events that he got.

If the door was open, a struggle " through the window" makes little sense.

 

[Unabogie]

If the door was open, a struggle " through the window" makes little sense.

Why do you think the door was open? I think based on Dorian's account, plus Michael Brady's account, we can deduce that the scuffle happened with Darren Wilson inside the car. It seems as though Wilson pulled the vehicle up right next to them and when he opened it, it either hit them or Brown shoved it closed. If Brown shoved it closed, this would explain Wilson's actions from the point. He was probably pissed at the kid shoving a door back into him. In fact, it's possible the door hit him in the face if he was scooting out of the door as he opened it.

But all witnesses saw the door closed with one man in, one man out, and all contact through the window until Wilson shot Brown and the two kids fled for their lives.

 

[casebro]

If the door was open, a struggle " through the window" makes little sense.

Wilson backed up past the two citizens, then cut his wheel to the right, cutting them off with the suv. Then as he was getting out of the car to ask them to vacate the roadway, the little angels, in their haste to converse with the neighborhood keeper of security, accidentally slammed the door on him. When Brown bent in to see if the officer was OK, the officer grabbed him by the neck to whisper his thanks in Brown's ear. To the paranoid bystander it looked like a fight through the window. Meantime the officer's gun had become dislodged during the conversation, and there was an accidental discharge as Gentle Giant Mike attempted to retrieve it for Officer Darren.

Mike then went back to his voluntary chore of measuring the width of the street, to help out the street maintenance department. Officer Wilson accidentally backed over him, and only discharged 10 more rounds as a signal to call the ambulance to tend to Big Mike. Mike was shot in the back with 9 rounds as they fell back to earth. All a big misunderstanding and an accident.

And it fits all the knone facts that have been released by Big Media.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

There was an altercation with a store clerk in which the clerk laid hands on Brown and was shoved.

The chief of police says Wilson was unaware of that incident.

The store never reported a robbery as revealed by a statement from their lawyer.

The call was from a "concerned citizen" who saw the shoving incident from outside of the store.

Oh, this too.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...souri-police-michael-brown-shooting/14098369/
In an afternoon press conference, Ferguson, Mo. Police Chief Thomas Jackson said Wilson did not initially make a connection between the robbery and Brown,whose death spurred violent protests and unrest in the St. Louis suburb over the past week.

Wilson stopped Brown and a friend because "they were in the middle of the street, blocking traffic," Jackson said.

Hours later, however, Jackson told a slightly different story to CNN and NBC, saying that Wilson noticed Brown was carrying a box of cigars that had been reported stolen. Wilson, he said, initially stopped Brown for blocking traffic, but as he began driving past Brown, he noticed Brown was holding cigars.

At that point, Wilson "made the connection" that Brown might have been involved in a theft that had just been broadcast on police radio, Jackson said.

I guess the police are lying about that too. And you know this because .... racism , or something.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Well, we know they were walking down the middle. This is actually very common in places where you are trying to avoid becoming a victim of crime.

So you are saying Johnson and Brown were walking in the middle of the street because there were more potential victims for them there ?

 

[Mumbles]

If the door was open, a struggle " through the window" makes little sense.

The door was apparently closed. but we know that the window was down, since by all accounts Wilson exchanged words with Brown and Johnson through it.