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Let's ask again: What was the MOTIVE for WTC7?

A little late, but.... Jowenko's motives for demolition: He seems to think that Silverstein would have had to bear the cost of the repairs to WTC7 if it had remained standing and he would have ended up with a repaired, old buiilding. Instead, Guiliani slips Silverstein a quick demolition permit, possibly after the receipt of a bribe, and the buliding was demolished. Hence Silverstein ends up with a new building. Bizarre.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sep-HDZoEBM
 
A little late, but.... Jowenko's motives for demolition: He seems to think that Silverstein would have had to bear the cost of the repairs to WTC7 if it had remained standing and he would have ended up with a repaired, old buiilding. Instead, Guiliani slips Silverstein a quick demolition permit, possibly after the receipt of a bribe, and the buliding was demolished. Hence Silverstein ends up with a new building. Bizarre.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sep-HDZoEBM

I hadn't seen that part.

Gosh truthers, if you think you have anything with that, you're deluding yourselves. :rolleyes:
 
He even talks about NORAD... Now why the interviewer would talk to him about NORAD if the purpose of the interview was to ask him about his knowledge of controlled demolitions?

:eusa_think:
 
Please explain how they could have gotten rid of those documents without getting rid of the building? You can't misplace 3000 files. People would have asked serious questions if the documents had just disappeared.

How about if there was a major fire in WTC7, but the building didn't collapse? The documents could have been shredded in advance, the destruction blamed on the fire, and there wouldn't have been the building collapse to explain away. Much, much simpler, but it requires you to think through the story forwards instead of backwards.

Dave
 
I don't think you could bring down wtc1 without hitting 7, but I disagree with your premise that it was necessary.

Would you be so good as to explain to the remainder of the truth movement that serious damage to WTC7 was inevitable as a result of the collapse of WTC1? Some of them seem not to agree with you.

Of course, one could as easily argue that serious damage to the buildings on either side of WTC7 was also inevitable as a result of the collapse of WTC1, yet somehow they weren't hit anywhere near as badly. So, maybe, was the hit on WTC7 not so inevitable after all? Was it maybe just a random event from a highly chaotic collapse?

Dave
 
Would you be so kind as to answer my question that has been restated for at least two pages?

He's just ignoring questions he can't refute while using conjecture on the ones he does answer.

Swallow your pride JHarrow and consider the reality of being mislead down the rabbit hole by the twoof ambulance chasers.
 
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Alright!!! I give in. I'll tell you why WTC7 came down.

The original plan was for all the sensitive documents to suffer severe water damage. We figured that we could light a small fire in the building and in the chaos of the day, nobody would notice. Unfortunately, the collapse of WTC1 played merry havoc with the sprinkler system, and what was supposed to be a small fire raged out of control. We couldn't let the firefighters into the building in case they saw or recovered sensitive information, so we evacuated the building and let the fire run its course.

Sheesh. I reckon my scenario above is ten times more realistic than any nonsense fed to us by the truth movement...
 
You seem to have allowed yourselves to be drawn away from the topic again. I am actually starting to admire the skill being demonstrated in doing so.

I think (to get back on topic) that if anyone's motive to destroy WTC7 concerned documentation, then the fires would have been sufficient. It still doesn't ring true as a motive to completely demolish the building.
 
Why are you calling 911 victims nutcases?

Are you saying that 9-11 victims are immune from insanity? They couldn't suffer from PTSD? Couldn't develop schizophrenia or Alzheimer's? That would be astounding if true.

Of course this ignores the fact that one can say nutty things without being nuts. Greed, or a desire for fame, can get sane people to say all sorts of crazy things they don't really believe.


You seem to think that imploding a building with super-invisible & silent can't-possibly-cook-off-early explosives just to temporarily slow down some SEC investigations (only slowed down because none were fatally comprised) is more plausible than the idea that a building that is structurally compromised by another nearby building falling on it and then burns out of control for five hours might possibly suffer the collapse of a key column, a premise you dismiss as "ridiculous." How the heck is that?

What is so "ridiculous" about steel failing in a long lasting, diesel fuel fed, un-fought fire?

What is so "ridiculous" about the steel that fails being in a key column?

What is so "ridiculous" about the failure of that key column then dragging down the rest of the building around it?

How is any of that more "ridiculous" than super-invisible & silent can't-possibly-cook-off-early explosives?

As for motive; are we to believe that you are currently endorsing the temporary slow down of certain SEC investigations motive as the most likely or would we be correct in believing that you feel the destroy the stupidly mis-located conspiracy command center before someone finds it motive is most likely?

It would just be more efficient if we knew exactly which of the two retarded premises should be logically eviscerated for all to see.
 
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Motive? I'll stay on motive, and I have to say (again) that the idea that someone would risk additional and unnecessary exposure of their nefarious insider plot - rigging a 47-story building for demolition (without anybody noticing, natch!) with their motive to destroy some documents has to be one of the stupidest things anybody has ever said. Ever.

[quote="New York Times] AS they watched news accounts of the World Trade Center disaster, a detail caught the attention of Davia Nelson and Nikki Silva, two independent radio producers in California.

''There were sheets of paper strewn all over,'' Ms. Nelson recalled. The scraps of paper that blanketed Lower Manhattan -- photographs, letters, depositions, résumés -- were like scattered pieces of a jigsaw puzzle that formed a picture of daily life in the trade center towers before the attacks. [/quote]
What a brilliant method to be sure you destroyed all the papers - except for the ones distributed over lower Manhattan. Never mind that there was heavy fire all over the place in the building - the Einsteins who ran this plot couldn't destroy the documents with an ordinary fire. Certainly not with a paper shredder (which conveniently can also shred disks). No, they had to destroy a skyscraper and do it in such an obvious way that the uberinvestigators of the troof movement would be sure to figure it out!

Belief in such a notion, IMHO, is a sign that the believer needs professional help. Not from engineers, architects, or firefighters - all of which has been offered at length here - but from psychologists. I'm not one, but perhaps there is some therapy that will help these people get past their inability to acknowledge even the simplest aspects of observed reality, their willingness to endlessly repeat outright fabrications as acknowledged fact, and, not to put to fine a point upon it, their sheer ineducability. I'm not a psychologist. I can't do it. I've pointed out a few of their self-contradictions and misrepresentations and misunderstandings, repeatedly, but such types are utterly and dedicatedly clueproof. I leave them to their paranoid and ignorant fantasies, and to the obscurity they so richly deserve. (I'm obscure, too, but I don't fancy myself as the Vanguard of the Coming Wave of Righteous Truth when I'm wasting time arguing on the Internet.)

Sorry, I went OT again; it's the corrosive effect of exposure to such stubborn and pernicious foolishness. So much for the shrieking idiocy of the alleged motives for blowing up WTC 7. Yet even this miscarriage of neural activity pales in comparison to the achingly vapid claim that the Powers That Be actually felt the need to tell the media that the tower would fall, either by design or mistake, before it fell. What exactly is the motive for that one - anxiety that no one would notice the collapse of a 47-story building in Manhattan?

It's astonishing that anyone could top the first claim of motive for WTC 7 - which is itself a sort of anti-thought, like anti-matter. But there is no height of absurdity which the 9/11 conspiracy loons cannot scale. I leave by way of closing the observation of the noted philosopher whose portrait I attach:

"Just when I thought you said the stupidest thing ever, you keep on talking!"
 

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Collapse zones around high rise fires are standard. They are not put in place in case the building implodes, they are created in case of partial collapses or things falling off the building.

These zones happen in all high rise fires.
True, but they usually say that it's for safety reasons, not because it's going to collapse.
1. They backed me off the rig because Seven was in dead jeopardy, so they backed everybody off and moved us to the rear end of Vesey Street. We just stood there for a half hour, 40 minutes, because Seven was in imminent collapse and finally did come down. –Firefighter Thomas Smith
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110246.PDF

2. Chief Nigro directed me to continue monitoring conditions at the site. Specifically to monitor number 7 World Trade Center. We were very concerned with the collapse potential there, and to do whatever I could do to ensure site safety in that no additional people became injured. –FDNY Deputy Chief Harold Meyers http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110382.PDF

3. We were concerned that the fires on several floors and the missing steel would result in the building collapsing. So for the next five or six hours we kept firefighters from working anywhere near that building, which included the whole north side of the World Trade Center complex. –Chief Frank Fellini http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110217.PDF
 
Well, it appears that the likeliest motive was "let's destroy a bunch of papers related to investigations." There are all sorts of holes and silliness attached to that, of course, but since this is a conversation about motives, we can leave those aside.

Another motive was something about insurance, wasn't it? Also feeble and repeatedly debunked over many threads.

Then there is Magz's idea, which has the virtue of not making up additional villains. Offhand I can't remember any others.

Can we close off the "motives" discussion? Jharrow keeps dragging up points that really are not motives, but other Salomon Bros Bldg matters and ideas.
 

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