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Anecdote Alert!

FWIW: I was interviewed by the New Era, along with other young adults, for a piece on youth missionary work (we were chose because each of us had been successful bringing people into the church. IMO: the magazine heavily edited many of the responses. I don't think they were happy with us. Our consensus was we should be less judgmental of other views and beliefs. It didn't fit their narrative though.

Oh well.
 
RandFan said:
Anecdote Alert!

FWIW: I was interviewed by the New Era, along with other young adults, for a piece on youth missionary work (we were chose because each of us had been successful bringing people into the church. IMO: the magazine heavily edited many of the responses. I don't think they were happy with us. Our consensus was we should be less judgmental of other views and beliefs. It didn't fit their narrative though.

Oh well.
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Are you willing to divulge the year and month of the New Era issue? ("No" is a perfectly acceptable and understandable answer.)
 
Janadele said:
They have succumbed to the influence of Lucifer... whether they realise it or not.
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I'm not anti-Mormon. Mormons are no different from other people: most of them are decent people. As long as you don't harm anyone, you are free to believe whatever you like for whatever reasons you like with no interference from me.

But when a Mormon, or a member of any other religion, comes to the Religion & Philosophy sub-forum of an internet forum created specifically for the intellectual examination of metaphysical claims and starts discussing Mormonism, I'm going to write what I think. I decided a long time ago that any belief system that required me to ignore facts and make excuses for it; any belief system that demanded that I have "faith" rather than the support of evidence and reason, wasn't a belief system that was worthy of my pursuit. This decision has caused me no grief, and has led me to see a universe that inspires a far grander sense of religious awe than any of the provincial fairytales of those who cling to faith.
 
jsfisher said:
Are you willing to divulge the year and month of the New Era issue? ("No" is a perfectly acceptable and understandable answer.)
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I don't mind at all that you ask. I honestly don't know which month but it was either my junior or senior year (I graduated in 1979). My mother kept a copy for years. I'll ask her if she remembers or if she still has it.

I would prefer to remain anonymous but I will PM you my full name if you want it. If anyone else would like to know my full name PM me and I will consider given it to you on a case by case basis. Though for the industrious, there is sufficient info on JREF to ascertain my name.

And FWIW: I'm nobody. My claim to fame was a single appearance on a children's show where I bawled the whole time and that interview (I think I got a single paragraph).
 
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Janadele said:
Moroni 10:3–5.
3 Behold, I would exhort you that when ye shall read these things, if it be wisdom in God that ye should read them, that ye would remember how merciful the Lord hath been unto the children of men, from the creation of Adam even down until the time that ye shall receive these things, and ponder it in you hearts.

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not btrue; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

5 And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things.
http://www.lds.org/scriptures/bofm/moro/10.3-5?lang=eng



"We invite all men everywhere to read the Book of Mormon, to ponder in their hearts the message it contains, and then to ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ if the book is true. Those who pursue this course and ask in faith will gain a testimony of its truth and divinity by the power of the Holy Ghost. (See Moroni 10:3–5.)

Those who gain this divine witness from the Holy Spirit will also come to know by the same power that Jesus Christ is the Savior of the world, that Joseph Smith is his revelator and prophet in these last days, and that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the Lord’s kingdom once again established on the earth, preparatory to the second coming of the Messiah."
http://www.lds.org/scriptures/bofm/introduction?lang=eng
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So you are validating tBoM with tBoM. Noithing like a good, circular argument...

What does the New Testament say about "other scriptures"?
 
Pakeha: Regarding Facsimile 1 :see Abraham Chapters 1 to 3.

The Lord Saved Abraham
15 And as they lifted up their hands upon me, that they might offer me up and take away my life, behold, I lifted up my voice unto the Lord my God, and the Lord hearkened and heard, and he filled me with the vision of the Almighty, and the angel of his presence stood by me, and immediately unloosed my bands;

16 And his voice was unto me: Abraham, Abraham, behold, my name is Jehovah, and I have heard thee, and have come down to deliver thee, and to take thee away from thy father’s house, and from all thy kinsfolk, into a strange land which thou knowest not of;

17 And this because they have turned their hearts away from me, to worship the god of Elkenah, and the god of Libnah, and the god of Mahmackrah, and the god of Korash, and the god of Pharaoh, king of Egypt; therefore I have come down to visit them, and to destroy him who hath lifted up his hand against thee, Abraham, my son, to take away thy life.

http://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/abr/1.16-19?lang=eng#15

pakeha said:
Thanks so much for your reply, Janadele.
That clears up my confusion about Egyptus being a man or a woman.
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RandFan said:
And FWIW: I'm nobody. My claim to fame was a single appearance on a children's show where I bawled the whole time and that interview (I think I got a single paragraph).
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Don't feel bad; Bozo frightened lots of kids.
 
Janadele said:
Pakeha: Regarding Facsimile 1 :see Abraham Chapters 1 to 3.

The Lord Saved Abraham
15 And as they lifted up their hands upon me, that they might offer me up and take away my life, behold, I lifted up my voice unto the Lord my God, and the Lord hearkened and heard, and he filled me with the vision of the Almighty, and the angel of his presence stood by me, and immediately unloosed my bands;

16 And his voice was unto me: Abraham, Abraham, behold, my name is Jehovah, and I have heard thee, and have come down to deliver thee, and to take thee away from thy father’s house, and from all thy kinsfolk, into a strange land which thou knowest not of;

17 And this because they have turned their hearts away from me, to worship the god of Elkenah, and the god of Libnah, and the god of Mahmackrah, and the god of Korash, and the god of Pharaoh, king of Egypt; therefore I have come down to visit them, and to destroy him who hath lifted up his hand against thee, Abraham, my son, to take away thy life.

http://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/abr/1.16-19?lang=eng#15
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Now, how about the barley?
 
Janadele said:
Pakeha: Regarding Facsimile 1 :see Abraham Chapters 1 to 3.

The Lord Saved Abraham
15 And as they lifted up their hands upon me, that they might offer me up and take away my life, behold, I lifted up my voice unto the Lord my God, and the Lord hearkened and heard, and he filled me with the vision of the Almighty, and the angel of his presence stood by me, and immediately unloosed my bands;

16 And his voice was unto me: Abraham, Abraham, behold, my name is Jehovah, and I have heard thee, and have come down to deliver thee, and to take thee away from thy father’s house, and from all thy kinsfolk, into a strange land which thou knowest not of;

17 And this because they have turned their hearts away from me, to worship the god of Elkenah, and the god of Libnah, and the god of Mahmackrah, and the god of Korash, and the god of Pharaoh, king of Egypt; therefore I have come down to visit them, and to destroy him who hath lifted up his hand against thee, Abraham, my son, to take away thy life.

http://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/abr/1.16-19?lang=eng#15
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Preaching.

  1. No evidence of Abraham appears in any known Egyptian writings.
  2. The Mormon Church admits that at least part of the Papyri was indeed the funerary text (Book of Breathing).
  3. The purpose of the text was to assist the deceased in the next life.
  4. Why would Egyptians, who didn't believe in Jehovah, include this scripture in their text?
  5. We now know that the Book of Breathing was a very common book to include with burial. We have many copies. Why are there no other copies that include the Abraham account?
 
RandFan said:
Preaching.

  1. No evidence of Abraham appears in any known Egyptian writings.
  2. The Mormon Church admits that at least part of the Papyri was indeed the funerary text (Book of Breathing).
  3. The purpose of the text was to assist the deceased in the next life.
  4. Why would Egyptians, who didn't believe in Jehovah, include this scripture in their text?
  5. We now know that the Book of Breathing was a very common book to include with burial. We have many copies. Why are there no other copies that include the Abraham account?
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6. The papyri that Smith "translated" were dated to the first century BCE, 1500 years too late.
 
RandFan said:
Preaching.

  1. No evidence of Abraham appears in any known Egyptian writings.
  2. The Mormon Church admits that at least part of the Papyri was indeed the funerary text (Book of Breathing).
  3. The purpose of the text was to assist the deceased in the next life.
  4. Why would Egyptians, who didn't believe in Jehovah, include this scripture in their text?
  5. We now know that the Book of Breathing was a very common book to include with burial. We have many copies. Why are there no other copies that include the Abraham account?
Foster Zygote said:
6. The papyri that Smith "translated" were dated to the first century BCE, 1500 years too late.
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In the end the facts don't matter.
 
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