LDS II: The Mormons

[dafydd]

Aren't they? Influenced by one, anyway.

Perhaps I should have said ''are a quote''.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Janadele

Do you think what you are telling us is anything new?

If you live in the Western Hemisphere you know the basic Biblical stories. We've heard these fairy tales before. Hearing them repeated to us again verbatim isn't going to change our minds.

That's the whole flaw in proselytizing. No one is going to go "Wait... what... there's some giant invisible sky genie? And he has a set of rules for us to follow? And if I do it I will be rewarded? Why I have never heard that before! This is totally new information!"

 

[dafydd]

Janadele

Do you think what you are telling us is anything new?

If you live in the Western Hemisphere you know the basic Biblical stories. We've heard these fairy tales before. Hearing them repeated to us again verbatim isn't going to change our minds.

I knew that the tall tales were garbage when I was six years old.

 

[Slowvehicle]

To be fair, the passage really doesn't necessarily say anything specifically about being married:

I have no idea what it says in the original language, and I'd have to go look up other context or other phrasing of the same thing elsewhere in the Bible to see how it compares, but a straightforward reading of the above passage alone could also be: no new marriages will occur, but previous marriages would not necessarily be dissolved.

Edited to add: Mormons solve the problem of multiple husbands caused by widows who remarry by only allowing one temple marriage per woman.

The question was, "Which of the woman's seven husbands will she be married to 'in the resurrection'?". It is difficult to believe that the compilers who attributed Luke 20:35 (&pp) intended his answer, that those worthy of resurrection would not "marry" (γαμέω) nor "be given in marriage" (ἐκγαμίσκω) only to apply to new, post-resurrection marriages, since the question had to do with the woman's seven legal marriages.

The traditional xianist interpretation has been to take the words attributed to Jesus to mean that the institution of marriage will not exist in heaven.

 

[I Ratant]

Well, with everyone sharing the same perfect body shape, what is there to distinguish the anchor and chain from any of the other identical persons? Shrillness?
And how would she know who to shout at???

 

[devnull]

No halley, He does not. He references the fact that sacred ordinances such as marriage for Spirit children of our Heavenly Father consigned to mortality on this Earth, are sealed for eternity in Temples on this Earth, not in Heaven.

Wow. You're not even close. Seriously.

 

[sadhatter]

"The Lord giveth, the Lord taketh away.
We were sent into mortality to be tested and tried.
As the Lord explained to Abraham:
“We will prove them herewith, to see if they will do all things whatsoever the Lord their God shall command them.” Abraham 3:25

http://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/abr/3?lang=eng

He sound pretty unpleasant, i don't care how much power a bully has, they are still a bully.

 

[The Platypus]

It is very weird how an all powerful, all knowing god, couldn't come up with a better way, or a better time even, to reveal his supposed word, other than telling a handful of individuals, in primitive times and in some tiny corner of the world, to write books and expect them to get it right, and expect that everyone else, throughout time, should just trust this.

 

[desertgal]

<Snipped for brevity>
Christian Scriptures include:
The Old and New Testaments of The Holy Bible... as far as translated correctly.
The Book of Mormon. The Pearl of Great Price. The Doctrine and Covenants.

Is that it?

 

[desertgal]

Janadele

Do you think what you are telling us is anything new?

If you live in the Western Hemisphere you know the basic Biblical stories. We've heard these fairy tales before. Hearing them repeated to us again verbatim isn't going to change our minds.

That's the whole flaw in proselytizing. No one is going to go "Wait... what... there's some giant invisible sky genie? And he has a set of rules for us to follow? And if I do it I will be rewarded? Why I have never heard that before! This is totally new information!"

Yeah, buy Jan isn't here to tell us anything new, or convert us. Self martyrdom requires fuel.

 

[surrogate]

It is very weird how an all powerful, all knowing god, couldn't come up with a better way, or a better time even, to reveal his supposed word, other than telling a handful of individuals, in primitive times and in some tiny corner of the world, to write books and expect them to get it right, and expect that everyone else, throughout time, should just trust this.

The all knowing God is rather busy keeping track of the things an all knowing being must know. If you had to memorize the location of every sub atomic particle in the universe as well as the distance between them for every moment in time, how much time would you have to proofread and edit a book?

 

[devnull]

Im sorry, but moderators, why is this thread still here? I thought that proselytisation was against the MA?

 

[JoeMorgue]

It is very weird how an all powerful, all knowing god, couldn't come up with a better way, or a better time even, to reveal his supposed word, other than telling a handful of individuals, in primitive times and in some tiny corner of the world, to write books and expect them to get it right, and expect that everyone else, throughout time, should just trust this.

Seriously. Other then ye olde classic "God Works In Mysterious (and breathtakingly cruel and inefficient) Ways" malarkey why exactly is the giant invisible sky wizard so damn obtuse?

Why not just.... poof. Make a clear, concise, metaphor free, parable free, vague doublespeak free guidebook written in everyone's preferred modern language just magically appear on everyone's nightstand? Complete with a glossary and 1-800 number you could call with questions. Boom problem solved. Everyone knows exactly what God wants, easy peasy.

But Noooooo. That would make too much sense.

Why the "What? For My Sake humanity I told the illiterate goat herders what I wanted from you... well I didn't I told a guy who told a guy... anyway I'm sure they got the gist of it... a few thousand years ago! What more do you want?" shtick?

Why the ever loving flip is God so crappy at communicating!?

I said in one of Janadele's previous threads it would like me rehydrating a batch of Sea Monkeys, picking a few of them at random, telling them a vague parable in English about a one legged prostitute, a turkey baster, and left handed shortstop, putting them back in the tank, letting 50 generations go by and the one random day going back to the tank and telling them I'm going to dump all the water out of their tank and I'm only going to save those Sea Monkeys that had their entire lives 4 times a day faced the west side of their tank and told me how much they liked my haircut.

 

[desertgal]

Seriously. Other then ye olde classic "God Works In Mysterious (and breathtakingly cruel and inefficient) Ways" malarkey why exactly is the giant invisible sky wizard so damn obtuse?

Why not just.... poof. Make a clear, concise, metaphor free, parable free, vague doublespeak free guidebook written in everyone's preferred modern language just magically appear on everyone's nightstand? Complete with a glossary and 1-800 number you could call with questions. Boom problem solved. Everyone knows exactly what God wants, easy peasy.

But Noooooo. That would make too much sense.

Why the "What? For My Sake humanity I told the illiterate goat herders what I wanted from you... well I didn't I told a guy who told a guy... anyway I'm sure they got the gist of it... a few thousand years ago! What more do you want?" shtick?

Why the ever loving flip is God so crappy at communicating!?

I said in one of Janadele's previous threads it would like me rehydrating a batch of Sea Monkeys, picking a few of them at random, telling them a vague parable in English about a one legged prostitute, a turkey baster, and left handed shortstop, putting them back in the tank, letting 50 generations go by and the one random day going back to the tank and telling them I'm going to dump all the water out of their tank and I'm only going to save those Sea Monkeys that had their entire lives 4 times a day faced the west side of their tank and told me how much they liked my haircut.

That's a fair analogy.

It's also eternally mystifying to me why anyone would buy the schtick of Joseph Smith (or L. Ron Hubbard, for another example) as wholeheartedly as Janadele seems to (or pretends she does). These are not mysterious prophets from aeons ago whose alleged words have a certain allure from being shrouded by the mists of time. Rather, men of the relatively modern age whose identities are certain and who were proven con men. It never fails to amaze me, even when it shouldn't, that there are people who are so willing to let go of their ability to think simply because they so desire to believe a fairy tale.

Alas. It's the age old conundrum of the chicken and the egg. A con man can't con the unwilling.

I've far more respect and understanding of someone like Cat Tale, who acknowledges the truth and the reality without letting go of the positive elements she gleans from her faith and church membership.

I'm curious why the flip the ever loving God is so darn hypocritical? Is He a woman, perpetually menopausal? He flip flops more than flip flops.

 

[Janadele]

Janadele, if the Christian scriptures are the word of God how do you account for the following...

Tim, there are many mistranslations through human error. Some significant, some of minor importance.

The following clarification of Matthew Chapter 27 is from the Joseph Smith Inspired Translation of the Bible:
http://www.centerplace.org/

50. And about the ninth hour, Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? (That is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?)
54. Jesus when he had cried again with a loud voice, saying, Father, it is finished, thy will is done, yielded up the ghost.

Also from JSIT: Luke Chapter 23
47. And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit. And having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

Which is identical to Luke Chapter 23 Verse 46 King James: http://www.lds.org/scriptures/nt/luke/23?lang=eng

 

[dafydd]

Mathew 27: 54 Joseph Smith Inspired version:

Fiction upon fiction.

 

[AdMan]

Tim, there are many mistranslations through human error. Some significant, some of minor importance.

The following clarification of Matthew Chapter 27 is from the Joseph Smith Inspired Translation of the Bible:
http://www.centerplace.org/

50. And about the ninth hour, Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? (That is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?)
54. Jesus when he had cried again with a loud voice, saying, Father, it is finished, thy will is done, yielded up the ghost.

We've heard that fairy tale (Joseph Smith? Really?) before. What do you got that's new?

 

[Tassman]

According to William Lane Craig the real victims were the soldiers who had to kill the children, it caused them guilt and emotional scars.

Really! That same argument was used by the SS when they brutalized and gassed the Jews in Auschwitz.

 

[Tassman]

She/he is annoyed that those fabulous gays are getting all the hot guys, leaving none for her/him.

Maybe! Personally, I think she's a guilt-ridden, self-loathing closet homosexual. But I could be wrong.

 

[Janadele]

...But I could be wrong.

As you usually are.