It's Homeopathy Awareness Week!

[Eos of the Eons]

Thanks Rolfe - interesting as you say. The tragedy of exchanges such as these is that the quacks never directly answer a question, and any questions that are too hard are simply ignored. I'm still trying to get Sarah to look at those 22 PubMed citations, but apparently a popular magazine carries more weight than peer-reviewed journals.

>Why, how dare he!! I'm a practising Craniosacral therpist! There there my dear, your little head is fine...no you are not experiencing any more symptoms! Those are phantoms leftover from your real symptoms. Those randi people have no idea what they are talking about, they think science can explain things and help modern medicine explain your phantom symptoms!!

 

[Zep]

Yes Zep, I think you might have done. Fortunately or unfortunately for you, I can read French.

Excellent! A translation for those who don't might be in order, yes?

But the question REALLY is: Do you truly understand what you are reading (in either French or English) when you look up your coroborrating evidence? Do you accept whatever you read without question, or are you applying any common sense to it before acting on it?

 

[aggle-rithm]

From this treatment on, her symptoms resolved very quickly.

...later....

Her symptoms very quickly resolved following this session.

...and then....

Her physical symptoms resolved very quickly following this session.

... and FINALLY....

Yes, my patient is alive and is doing very well. Her presenting symptoms have almost fully resolved now.

...so which is it? Did her symtoms resolve, or are they almost fully resolved? Did you believe she was fully healed, but then found otherwise?

In my experience, this sort of magical healing is never as miraculous as it first seems.

 

[Nucular]

...later....

...and then....

... and FINALLY....

...so which is it? Did her symtoms resolve, or are they almost fully resolved? Did you believe she was fully healed, but then found otherwise?

In my experience, this sort of magical healing is never as miraculous as it first seems.

Well spotted AR.

Whiplash symptoms, like most things would, of course, tend to improve over time with or without magic spells and pleasing massages. Pleasing massages for neck-ache seem like a fairly sensible option - just from a friend, relative or liberal passer-by, though, no need to pay for it I wouldn't have thought.

Sarah, how would we tell the difference between your treatment and it getting better on its own? This is what control groups are for. Have you looked at the 22 studies yet?

 

[Mojo]

Sarah still hasn't said what the symptoms actually were, beyond the rather vague "neck problems" she mentioned a while back.

 

[Asolepius]

Sarah still hasn't said what the symptoms actually were, beyond the rather vague "neck problems" she mentioned a while back.

I think she has become tired of this thread - it's gone to the `too difficult' tray.

 

[Nucular]

Sarah still hasn't said what the symptoms actually were, beyond the rather vague "neck problems" she mentioned a while back.

That's probably all the information she needed.

Patient: "Hi, I have neck problems."

Sarah: "Right. I think it might be your neck."

P: "Really?"

S: "Er, yes. I'm going to give you a magic neck rub, to free all the blocked chi, and to open up your, erm, chakras."

P: "Oh that feels nice"

S: [Aside] "Then what I said was true! I have opened up her chakras!"

S: "Better take it easy with the neck, then."

P: "Good advice. You've done this before."

S: "Oh, all the time. American Express is fine, see you weekly until you're all better."

 

[Mojo]

 

[Sarah-I]

Firstly, craniosacral therapy is NOT massage. Also, it has nothing at all to do with the circulation of Qi or the Chakras.

I did not do the healing, my patient did. I went and worked at different parts of her body where I felt there were restrictions which did include the neck.

Also, Upledger has done a lot of the research about craniosacral therapy that exists. He was also party to the development of an instrument that measured cranial bone movement.

As practitioners, I think we need to get out there and do more research. I am planning to do this myself at some stage.

Craniosacral Therapy Awareness week is underway now. Why don't you go and find a stand near you and I am sure the practitioners will be more than happy to answer your questions. This is run by the Craniosacral Therapy Association, which is the body that registers practitioners and regulates the training.

 

[wollery]

This is run by the Craniosacral Therapy Association, which is the body that registers practitioners and regulates the training.

And who gave them the authority to do that then?
Is it possible to be a Craniosacral practitioners without belonging to this association?

 

[Donks]

Firstly, craniosacral therapy is NOT massage. Also, it has nothing at all to do with the circulation of Qi or the Chakras.

The "College" of Cranio-Sacral Quakery will hold a seminar on Feb. 2006, with Andrew Stones. It is about:

In this weekend course we will explore various themes. The centre piece of the weekend will be an exploration of the relationship of the Seven Transverse Diaphragms to each other, and to the Chakras, and their reflections in the extremities. The method is, as far we know, unique, and whilst on the one hand serves as a highly effective clinical tool, it is also a highly effective training method for the practitioner, developing anatomical awareness and a strong ability to treat structures from a distance.
Specific Chi Kung type exercises will be taught to help develop the skills for this. In addition to this work with the diaphragms, Andrew will teach meditation methods that he has found particularly effective for enhancing palpatory and healing skills in Cranio-Sacral work.

Are you sure they have nothing to do?

 

[MRC_Hans]

Firstly, craniosacral therapy is NOT massage.

It is, from a skeptical POV, or at least, that is all it is.

Also, it has nothing at all to do with the circulation of Qi or the Chakras.

No, it has to d owiht circulation od spinal fluid and "pulse" in spinal fluid.

I did not do the healing, my patient did.

Neither. Your patient healed.

I went and worked at different parts of her body where I felt there were restrictions which did include the neck.

How astute since she presented with a neck problem. Where DO you people get it from .

Also, Upledger has done a lot of the research about craniosacral therapy that exists. He was also party to the development of an instrument that measured cranial bone movement.

Have you ever seen a cranium? Did you notice how all the bones are fused together?

As practitioners, I think we need to get out there and do more research. I am planning to do this myself at some stage.

By all means, do that. However, wil lyou be prepared to accept a negative result? If not, research is a waste of time.

Craniosacral Therapy Awareness week is underway now. Why don't you go and find a stand near you and I am sure the practitioners will be more than happy to answer your questions.

Why don't you answer the questions right here?

This is run by the Craniosacral Therapy Association, which is the body that registers practitioners and regulates the training.

No, it doesn't. Anybody can call themselves a Cranio Sacral Therapist and set up practice, it is not a protected title. Well, not here anyway.

Hans

 

[Psiload]

Originally posted by Sarah-I

Firstly, craniosacral therapy is NOT massage. Also, it has nothing at all to do with the circulation of Qi or the Chakras.

If not "Qi", then what? What sort of "energy" are we talking about?

I did not do the healing, my patient did. I went and worked at different parts of her body where I felt there were restrictions which did include the neck.

Once again... what are these "restrictions" you speak of?

Also, Upledger has done a lot of the research about craniosacral therapy that exists. He was also party to the development of an instrument that measured cranial bone movement.

Upledger's research was done over twenty years ago, and much of his basic claims cannot be duplicated despite numerous attempts to confirm his "findings". What is the name of the "instrument" developed by Upledger? Has this instrument been evaluated/approved by the FDA?

As practitioners, I think we need to get out there and do more research. I am planning to do this myself at some stage.

Good idea... as long as you realize that there's a difference between research and indulgence.

Craniosacral Therapy Awareness week is underway now. Why don't you go and find a stand near you and I am sure the practitioners will be more than happy to answer your questions. This is run by the Craniosacral Therapy Association, which is the body that registers practitioners and regulates the training.

Why do I need to seek out a CS practitioner to answer my questions? You claim to be a trained CS therapist, why is it that you won't answer my questions?

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

Originally posted by Sarah-I 10-02-2004 05:26 PM
Homeopathy is:-

- a well established and complete system of medicine which has been in world wide use for over 200 years;

- a natural, safe, effective and scientific system of healing which supports the body's natural desire to heal itself;

- a holistic approach to health, which incorporates the emotional and mental aspects of a persons well-being in addition to the physical.

Originally posted by Sarah-I 06-15-2005 01:11 PM
In some cases yes, I have found the homeopathy to be ineffective and craniosacral therapy to be more effective.

 

[Sarah-I]

Hans,

It is NOT massage, as we do not use massage techniques as massage therapists do.

This is a postgraduate course run by Andrew - who incidentally was one of my tutors when I was training. This can be used in practice, but not all therapists do this.

I have undertaken some simple research where myself and another practitioner were separated by a screen and could not see each other. I was at the sacrum and she was at the head and we had to press a foot pedal to indicate when we felt certain things in the body and there was a concensus rating in the 90's.

I would accept a negative result, but I doubt that would happen.

Oh Hans, why don't you stick to your debate with bach over at otherhealth. Is the heat getting too much for you? Seems to me as if he has the upper hand at present!!!

For your information, it is the College of Cranio-Sacral Therapy www.ccst.co.uk

Why don't you go to the website and click under articles and read the article on Fascial Unwinding that has been written in two parts by Thomas Attlee himself.

 

[Nucular]

I have undertaken some simple research where myself and another practitioner were separated by a screen and could not see each other. I was at the sacrum and she was at the head and we had to press a foot pedal to indicate when we felt certain things in the body and there was a concensus rating in the 90's.

What sound did the foot pedal make?

 

[Mojo]

For your information, it is the College of Cranio-Sacral Therapy www.ccst.co.uk

Why don't you go to the website and click under articles and read the article on Fascial Unwinding that has been written in two parts by Thomas Attlee himself.

I've just done that. A lot of rather repetetive waffle, but no indication of any actual evidence for it.

 

[Asolepius]

I have undertaken some simple research where myself and another practitioner were separated by a screen and could not see each other. I was at the sacrum and she was at the head and we had to press a foot pedal to indicate when we felt certain things in the body and there was a concensus rating in the 90's.

Sounds interesting. Where has it been published? Presumably n=2? So you could send messages to each other via the patient's spine? What were the `certain things'? What's a foot pedal? Is it similar to a hand handle?

Oh, and what about those 22 PubMed studies? Does your n=2 study carry more weight?

 

[Sarah-I]

It was a very ingeneous little experiment. We had a foot pedal each and they were both soft and made no sound so that neither of us could hear. Both pedals were linked into a computer programme that was assessed afterwards.

It demonstrated significant results.

There should be articles on the same website by a therapist called Julian Cowan Hill that demonstrates success in treating tinitus with cranial. He concentrates on this in his practice and has had some very good results. He might even be doing some research.

 

[Mojo]

There should be articles on the same website by a therapist called Julian Cowan Hill that demonstrates success in treating tinitus with cranial.

Which website? I can't see them on www.ccst.co.uk