How Loony are the Loons?

[apathoid]

We have to do something about the cricket infestation in this thread....its getting bad.

 

[Horatius]

armed and ready sir!

For the youtube function to work, you need to cut out all the "http:..." stuff, and only use the index ("3gQCqxgzoGs" in this case).

 

[babazaroni]

"You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Go and read this thread:"

Apparently, neither do you!!!

"But we are to believe that it took a weekend to rig a huge building and a bunch of angry white guys with mid-80s IQ can spot it over demolition contracts, even though something this tall has never been done in demolition history?"

NO ONE is claiming it "took a weekend" for any of this! Talking about IQ's your are in mils, not inches.

I'd sure like to read that thread, but since you don't use the quote function it is very difficult.

 

[uk_dave]

RemoveBush,

Answer the question:

Why did people choose to jump from the wtc towers?

 

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

...
Not to say that at some point or in some areas it was not hot, but again..... The ASSUMPTIONS. NIST has reported that the steel did not see any heat above 800 degrees.

Patently false.

A limited amount of physical evidence about the fires is available in the form of videos and still photographs of the buildings and the smoke plume generated soon after the initial attack. Estimates of the buoyant energy in the plume were obtained by plotting the rise of the smoke plume, which is governed by buoyancy in the vertical direction and by the wind in the horizontal direction. Using the Computational Fluid Dynamics (CFD) fire model, Fire Dynamics Simulator Ver. 1 (FDS1), fire scientists at the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) (Rehm, et al. 2002) were able to mathematically approximate the size of fires required to produce such a smoke plume. As input to this model, an estimate of the openings available to provide ventilation for the fires was obtained from an examination of photographs taken of the damaged tower. Meteorological data on wind velocity and atmospheric temperatures were provided by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) based on reports from the Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System (ACARS). The information used weather monitoring
instruments onboard three aircraft that departed from LaGuardia and Newark airports between 7:15 a.m. and 9:00 a.m. on September 11, 2001. The wind speed at heights equal to the upper stories of the towers
was in the range of 10–20 mph. The outside temperatures over the height of the building were 20–21 °C (68–70 °F).​

The modeling suggests a peak total rate of fire energy output on the order of 3–5 trillion Btu/hr, around 1–1.5 gigawatts (GW), for each of the two towers. From one third to one half of this energy flowed out of the structures. This vented energy was the force that drove the external smoke plume. The vented energy and accompanying smoke from both towers combined into a single plume. The energy output from each of the two buildings is similar to the power output of a commercial power generating station. The modeling also suggests ceiling gas temperatures of 1,000 °C (1,800 °F), with an estimated confidence of plus or minus 100 °C (200 °F) or about 900–1,100 °C (1,600–2,000 °F). A major portion of the uncertainty in these estimates is due to the scarcity of data regarding the initial conditions within the building and how the aircraft impact changed the geometry and fuel loading. Temperatures may have been as high as 900–1,100 °C (1,700–2,000 °F) in some areas and 400–800 °C (800–1,500 °F) in others.​

The viability of a 3–5 trillion Btu/hr (1–1.15 GW) fire depends on the fuel and air supply. The surface area of office contents needed to support such a fire ranges from about 30,000–50,000 square feet, depending​

on the composition and final arrangement of the contents and the fuel loading present. Given the typical occupied area of a floor as approximately 30,000 square feet, it can be seen that simultaneous fire involvement of an area equal to 1–2 entire floors can produce such a fire. Fuel loads are typically described in terms of the equivalent weight of wood. Fuel loads in office-type occupancies typically range from about 4–12 psf, with the mean slightly less than 8 psf (Culver 1977). File rooms, libraries, and similar concentrations of paper materials have significantly higher concentrations of fuel. At the burning rate necessary to yield these fires, a fuel load of about 5 psf would be required to provide sufficient fuel to maintain the fire at full force for an hour, and twice that quantity to maintain it for 2 hours. The air needed to support combustion would be on the order of 600,000–1,000,000 cubic feet per minute.

http://www.house.gov/science/hot/wtc/wtc-report/WTC_ch2.pdf section 2.2.1.2 Fire Development. (bolding mine)​

 

[RemoveBush]

"And don't try pulling that 'radio-controlled' BS outta your arse. There's a reason demo companies use hardwiring instead of radio control. It's called interference. They don't want to take the chance that a stray radio signal, either from a cell-phone, two-way radio, or electrometer would accidentally set off the charges before they're supposed to go off."

Yes I know, I am VERY versed in RF! My point was that IT COULD be done! Your making an ABSOLUTE statement that it CAN'T!!!

Just like the government would NEVER attack it's own. Yet there are plenty of examples, the U.S.S. Liberty is one that can't be disputed.

 

[defaultdotxbe]

For the youtube function to work, you need to cut out all the "http:..." stuff, and only use the index ("3gQCqxgzoGs" in this case).

thanks, i edited my post as well (got in under the deadline )

hey this thread has once again proven itself useful! i learned something

 

[RemoveBush]

" What article would that be? This is why people want you to use the quote function, and provide links. It's so we know WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. Fruitloop."

How about looking at the article that this thread is based on Smart guy??

 

[defaultdotxbe]

Just like the government would NEVER attack it's own. Yet there are plenty of examples, the U.S.S. Liberty is one that can't be disputed.

so the united states attacked liberty? i thought it was israel

BTW im sure you can provide full documentation that this was known at the highest levels of both governments and was planned for some time, right?

 

[Horatius]

thanks, i edited my post as well (got in under the deadline )

hey this thread has once again proven itself useful! i learned something

I live to serve. Took me a couple of tries to figure it out. Good clip you have there, btw.

 

[RemoveBush]

"Please, point out the two isolated pockets of fire on the 78th floor. Also point out the not so large fires. Thanks much."

Hey brainiac! No one is not saying that there were no fires..... Once again TWISTING and DISTORTION!

 

[hellaeon]

Crazy,
Toys in the attic I am crazy,
Truly gone fishing.
They must have taken my marbles away.
Crazy, toys in the attic he is crazy.

 

[uk_dave]

"Please, point out the two isolated pockets of fire on the 78th floor. Also point out the not so large fires. Thanks much."

Hey brainiac! No one is not saying that there were no fires..... Once again TWISTING and DISTORTION!

OK good, you finally accept that there were severe fires raging within the wtc towers, so severe in fact that people trapped above the impact zone chose to jump rather than burn, and that these fires then combined with the structural damage caused by the impact from the planes to further weaken the structure until a catastrophic failure occured causing a large portion of the structure to come crashing down through the building obliterating itself in the process.

Good, you finally accepted reality.

 

[RemoveBush]

"The FBI took over the investigation from the NTSB since the criminal investigation superceded the accident investigation, but the NTSB still did work on the FDRs and CVRs, and even created the AA77 animation. I believe that they even had there top investigators working with the FBI, so 28ths argument is essentially a strawman as the NTSB was very much involved in the investigations.

This is their 9/11 page which links a number of documents on the investigations:"

Which is questioned by pilots....
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/pentagon.html

Notice how the DATA from NTSB shows the plane being to the left of what we are told and 400 FT above the freeway. NTSB will not address the discrepencies.

 

[aggle-rithm]

Yes I know, I am VERY versed in RF! My point was that IT COULD be done! Your making an ABSOLUTE statement that it CAN'T!!!

Just because something COULD happen doesn't mean it DOES happen. For instance, you COULD use the "quote" feature (at least, anyone with more than two brain cells to rub together could), but for some reason it doesn't happen.

 

[uk_dave]

OMG he even uses 'Piwots for twoof' website.

 

[aggle-rithm]

Notice how the DATA from NTSB shows the plane being to the left of what we are told and 400 FT above the freeway. NTSB will not address the discrepencies.

Notice how you claim to be an electrical engineer yet are apparently unable to use a simple web-based utility such as the "Quote" button. I notice that you won't address this discrepancy.

 

[Horatius]

" What article would that be? This is why people want you to use the quote function, and provide links. It's so we know WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. Fruitloop."

How about looking at the article that this thread is based on Smart guy??

And where in any of your nonsense have you actually told us that you wrote that tripe?

As an example of how to use the quote function, here's your first fart of a post:

Allow me to enlighten some of the people here who have a comprehension problem.

"Kiwiwriter - The fact that these guys prattle about treason trials and executions for ordinary folks who accept the various reports on 9/11 is something that bothers me. These nutters actually have no regard for any other form of human life except themselves and their immediate followers and flunkies. Yet that is precisely what they accuse the government of doing. A lot of this 9/11 conspiracy nonsense are projections of the nutters' own view of the world."

This person can clearly not read!!! The reply was not to "ordinary folks" it was to the US GOVERNMENT! I guess this is what's wrong with our country these days, as someone above posted, our schools are not teaching the basics. He/She cannot clearly read!

"Crazycowbob - I can't help but just shake my head in disbelief when reading rants like these. The lack of education shown is just appalling; I mean, if they wanted to tout a conspiracy theory, they could at least come up with something that couldn't be so easily disproven."

Though this person indicates he/she is a scholar, I seriously doubt that! They fail to acknowledge that PHYSICS is something that cannot be denied. Physics is something that PROVES that the WTC's were brought down by something OTHER than a plane and fires. Here are some very simple questions for you scholar..... 1) What is the Free fall speed of an object dropped from the top of the WTC's? 2) What was the speed at which the buildings fell?? 3) Provide Scientific evidence by experimentation or imperical evidence that the core would have been completly destroyed and that the concrete would have vaporized in mid air like it did.

Since, as you say, it can be "easily disproven" then by all means enlighten us. After all, there are hundreds of HIGH level government officials and Military personnel that believe 9/11 was something other than what we were told. So are all these people "high on crack" as you imply?

I won't hold my breath on a civilized debate, as most of the comments have shown that you simply want to attack and call names of those people who do not follow in lockstep like you do with the official version.

I bet that most of you deniers believe that JFK was killed by a lone gunman??? Despite the fact that ballistics has shown that a bullet will enter the body with a small hole and exit in a larger one. JFK had a small hole in his forehead and the back of his head was blown out. Scientific proof, but you still deny this fact!

So, where in that mass of slime is there any indication that you wrote that piece of trash? All I see is a lot a non-linked quotes, some attacks on people's reading conprehension, and some amazingly bad appeals to physics. Oh, and a JFK non sequitur, for some reason.

If you want us to know what you're saying, you have to actually say it. I know that's a radical concept, but please do try to get it into your brain, fool.

 

[Arus808]

RemoveBush

Please learn to use it

 

[Horatius]

The FBI took over the investigation from the NTSB since the criminal investigation superceded the accident investigation, but the NTSB still did work on the FDRs and CVRs, and even created the AA77 animation. I believe that they even had there top investigators working with the FBI, so 28ths argument is essentially a strawman as the NTSB was very much involved in the investigations.

Once again, it's nice to see you acknowledging the work the FBI and NTSB did on the investigations into 9/11. One wonders why you only have such bouts of sanity intermittently.

Oh, well, I'm sure there's a reasonable explanation for it.