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Hello from a non-skeptic

Charles, do you have any idea how common the surname Steuart/Stuart/Stewart was, or how common the names John and Mary were at the period you are looking at?
 
Charles Boden said:
Garrette, your "civility" only went as far as attempting to lure me into all of this.
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And now I revise my earlier assessment. I stand by this in regard to your original claim of ancestry:

Garrette said:
Frankly, I don't think you are intentionally lying. I think you are so emotionally invested--and have been for so long a time--that you truly believe your claims despite the lack of real evidence. I think the JREF represents the very first time you have ever been truly challenged and that you were not only surprised by it but emotionally threatened.
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But I join the others in regard to all the ancillary items and your assessment of our behavior that you are knowingly lying. You are likely repeatedly telling yourself that you aren't lying, but you know it.

I did not lure you in, Charles. I responded to your posts in a thread you started. I remained civil throughout. I am even being civil now, despite pointing out that I think you are lying. I have not said or implied that you are a rotten person or even that your nature is one of a perpetual liar. I have described your behavior here and on the PLF.

Your errors in regard to quantum effects were explained early, often, and politely (at first, at least).

The reasons that the Holohan/Poole case does not provide evidence for the paranormal were provided early and politely.

Your errors in your ancestry have been explained thoroughly and with proper citations.

Your absolute and utter twaddle regarding feeling threatened here and being worried for the members of the PLF were dismissed far more civilly than such slurs deserved. Of everything that you have said, this is the part that brings me closest to wanting to discard my civility.

How dare you? There have been exactly zero threats to you here, and exactly zero instances of uncivil behavior by skeptics from the JREF on the PLF. You were the one banned from there; you were the one who crossed the line.

I will not even stoop to asking you to point out anything even approaching threats or approaching making a shambles of the PLF because I know you cannot and will not even attempt it because you know that you are wrong. Is that how you choose to raise your sons? To cast vile aspersions on those who answered questions that you came unbidden to ask? To deride those who take time and spend money to do research you yourself should have done? I will take my method of child-rearing any day.


Charles Boden said:
If I have not answered or replied to other questions, it is because amidst all the offence made to me here I have not bothered to read them. I only came back because Alice sent me a warning of her post about my genealogy.
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A warning? It must be appealing to play the beleaguered martyr.


Charles Boden said:
Based on what I have already exposed, I believe what I am stating about it deserves at least the benefit of the doubt...
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It deserved the benefit of the doubt until conflicting information with more reliable sourcing became evident. Such a thing happened. You now have the opportunity to show even better conflicting information but sadly have repeatedly failed to do so.

You wrote a book stating your claimed ancestry as fact. Now when there is strong evidence that you are not only mistaken but also concocted linkages that are not there, you ask for the benefit of the doubt, and you ask it from those you have falsely accused of threatening you and the people at the PLF.

Again I ask, how dare you?
 
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How dare I? I have replied to the genealogical questions. Just as with spirituality, you caim to have proven me wrong when you haven't... You have just once again assumed your one-sided position.

DLorde, you won't do the hypnotic regression and you all keep going at me because of the Ouija? I did it once, and what I "saw", uninfluenced in any way by the therapist, was myself as a soldier in the Crusades by the name of Ezequiel. A totally different result from what I expected. And you all wish to claim that the such is due to the influence of the therapist? You all relly have a lot of "field work" to do...

I am off to work. Why don't you go and give your wives and husbands a couple of kisses or something? Or do you make money by participating here full-time and by the sales of Skeptics' magazines?

You want to tell me that there were no offences made to me here, Garrette? Just read through it all and put yourself in my shoes...

I am, indeed, once and for all, "over and out"...

I wish you all the best.

Charles
 
So because people questioned your claims and asked for evidence, you were justified in fearing for your safety. OK.
 
Charles Boden said:
How dare I? I have replied to the genealogical questions. Just as with spirituality, you caim to have proven me wrong when you haven't... You have just once again assumed your one-sided position.

DLorde, you won't do the hypnotic regression and you all keep going at me because of the Ouija? I did it once, and what I "saw", uninfluenced in any way by the therapist, was myself as a soldier in the Crusades by the name of Ezequiel. A totally different result from what I expected. And you all wish to claim that the such is due to the influence of the therapist? You all relly have a lot of "field work" to do...

I am off to work. Why don't you go and give your wives and husbands a couple of kisses or something? Or do you make money by participating here full-time and by the sales of Skeptics' magazines?

You want to tell me that there were no offences made to me here, Garrette? Just read through it all and put yourself in my shoes...

I am, indeed, once and for all, "over and out"...

I wish you all the best.

Charles
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Okay, bye.
 
So often it comes down to:

- I choose to believe these ideas based on evidence sufficient to myself.
- You cant prove I am wrong. (Said after ignoring any falsifying evidence proffered, suggestions how ideas could be tested, and demonstrations of weakness of evidence)
- Why can't you be tolerant of my beliefs? You are bunch of mean spirited cynics.

People like Charles are happy with a comforting fantasy and don't want to examine their beliefs.
 
Charles Boden said:
Sorry, the link doesn't seem to be working, but enter www.familysearch.org and look up Janet Gordon born 1518 in Huntley who is the 2nd down... She was apparently the daughter of the son of the 3rd Earl of Huntley, and not his daughter...
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I've just looked this up and I don't find it convincing:

Janet Gordon
Female

Event(s):
Birth: About 1518 , , Scotland

Christening:
Death: After 1562

Burial:

Parents:
Father: John BARON GORDON GORDON Family
Mother: Margaret Jane STEWART



Record submitted after 1991 by a member of the LDS Church. No additional information is available. Ancestral File may list the same family and the submitter.

Source Information:
No source information is available.
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No mention of 1518 as a specific birth date, no mention of Huntly, no source information, no information about the submitter. Strangest of all, the family/pedigree sections for Margaret Jane Stewart don't even mention her parents - and her father was King James IV of Scotland! How could any researcher have missed that?!

Charles, I got the impression from your posts on the Jacobite Forum that you regard the IGI as some sort of ultimate authority with whom claims may be checked. In fact, as many genealogists have discovered to their cost, the IGI is far from infallible. It's worth remembering that the Mormons aren't interested in genealogy for its own sake; they use it merely as a means of collecting the names of dead people in order to baptize them posthumously into the church. It's impossible to check this claim because absolutely nothing is known about who collected this data (such as it is), when it was collected or where s/he got the information.

I wonder if there has been some confusion between two Janet Gordons - the one we're dealing with here and an earlier Janet Gordon who was the granddaughter of a king? I ask because the first Janet Gordon was the 2nd Earl of Huntly's daughter by his second wife Princess Annabella of Scotland, daughter of King James I. Stranger things have happened.

Anyway, I'm afraid I'm more inclined to take Burke's Peerage's word over the uncheckable claims of an anonymous Mormon!

ETA: Oh, he's buggered off. Fellow citizens of Jreffia, we need to create two more awards:

Drama Queen First Class
The Order of the Silly Sausage

FOR THE DEBUNKLY SKERRICKS HORDE!!!!!!!!

God, I've enjoyed this. One of you really should tell me to get a life.
 
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Do I win the $1mm psychic prize?

carlitos said:
You are a *********** drama queen.
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Charles Boden (as interpreted by carlitos) said:
<<em seu papel de rainha do drama, Charles afasta>>
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:rolleyes:

Garrette, I commend your civility, and apologize for having a little less patience in this instance. Am I reading right that Mr. Boden was banned from a different forum for something? Linky?
 
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Alice Shortcake said:
<snip>
Anyway, I'm afraid I'm more inclined to take Burke's Peerage's word over the uncheckable claims of an anonymous Mormon!
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I'm not well versed in genealogy research, but are you aware of why the Mormons do this?

Genealogy may be interesting, but to Mormons it is also more than that. "We are not hobbyists in genealogy work," says church official Dallin H. Oaks. "We do family history work in order to provide the ordinances of salvation for the living and the dead." The ultimate goal of LDS genealogy research is to provide proxy ordinances, or vicarious ordinances, to all humankind.
(...)
The LDS church encourages its members to work on their genealogy. Not only is it a productive and enriching hobby, but also Mormons see it as a way to extend the chance for non-LDS ancestors to be baptized, endowed, and sealed to their families in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
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http://www.suite101.com/content/why-do-mormons-do-genealogy-a191502
 
Charles Boden said:
As I said to you all at the beginning, you guys know zilch regarding spirituality and mediumnity. In fact, to attempt to discuss such issues with you all would be like trying to explain advanced physics to a kindergarten class. In effect, you are, as I also said, like children frantically attempting to close your eyes to that which you do not wish to see...
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Again with this. Charles, you keep ignoring the fact that a lot of people here used to believe in that stuff, and/or have studied it quite a bit.

Garrette said:
Your absolute and utter twaddle regarding feeling threatened here and being worried for the members of the PLF were dismissed far more civilly than such slurs deserved. Of everything that you have said, this is the part that brings me closest to wanting to discard my civility.

How dare you? There have been exactly zero threats to you here, and exactly zero instances of uncivil behavior by skeptics from the JREF on the PLF. You were the one banned from there; you were the one who crossed the line.
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Charles Boden said:
How dare I? I have replied to the genealogical questions. Just as with spirituality, you caim to have proven me wrong when you haven't... You have just once again assumed your one-sided position.
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Charles, do you see how completely you evaded the question? You lied -- there's no nicer way to put it. You have lied repeatedly about people here. When challenged directly, you try to divert attention back to some of the other discussions here. Your geneology and your "spirituality" have nothing to do with the false accusations you've made.

I'm not impressed with the results of all your years of "spirituality."
 
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carlitos said:
Am I reading right that Mr. Boden was banned from a different forum for something? Linky?
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He was suspended from the Past Lives Forum, presumably because he invited a bunch of scary:rolleyes: skeptics to come over.

ETA: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6496356&postcount=1

And since I'm already posting:

Charles Boden said:
One thing that seriously dawned on me was the fact that I am dealing with people from an entirely different culture, and mostly the North American one at that.
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Since I am one of the few posting in this thread who specify a North American "location," I do have to point out that this assumption you are making is probably another thing you got wrong.

The USA is simply that--my current location. My mother is Colombian and my father Norwegian and I grew up in South America and Mexico, and most recently lived for six years in Southeast Asia. I have never had a North American passport. And yes, I still think you have been lying.
 
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"Could you lend me 'arf a quatloo for a cup o' tea, guv'nor?"

See, I'm English and have updated my profile to make this clear. I've had enough aggravation recently without being mistaken for an American.
 
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