H.a.a.r.p
- Thread starter rorylee
- Start date
sts60
Illuminator
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2007
- Messages
- 4,107
No, rorylee; maybe for you, but that's not true for all of us.
I'm an engineer with a space physics degree (not from the University of Google), and I don't need teh interwebs to figure out that an alleged connection between HAARP (or, for that matter, the Arecibo radio telescope, or the microwave oven in the kitchen at work) and the Haiti earthquake is arrant nonsense. There's nothing connecting the two - no mechanism to convert HAARP energy into mechanical forces underground, no way to direct the energy, nothing whatsoever. Moreover, the notion that HF energy generated by HAARP would have any such impact in reality is laughable. Just the daily variation in natural solar energy received by the Earth is many orders of magnitude greater than what HAARP can put into the ionosphere.
I don't know which is worst - the absurdity of the claim, the fact that in six pages of thread there's only the slightest of handwaving to even try to support this ridiculous and vague notion, the appeals to magic (if you can imagine it, it can be done), or the smug assertion that everyone is equally ignorant. I've seen this "appeal to equal ignorance" from conspiracists before, and it doesn't get any less tiresome (or wrong) with time.
Sunsneezer
Thinker
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2010
- Messages
- 159
Such an exercise could yield interesting results, however there are two very big problems about the way you go about doing it:
- Conspiracy speculation is a circular argument.
- You justify your own ignorance and rejection of anything that is official by your belief in conspiracies.
- The assumptions and data from which your ideas and theories stem are certifiably incorrect because of said ignorance.
I think that it has been demonstrated that we can't help you create and build a theoretical model for how H.A.A.R.P is being used as a weapon because it contradicts every piece of available and verifiable information we can find. Moving on.
How do you "skeptics" explain this happening right before the Haiti disaster?
It's all related, man.
It's all related, man.
Nonpareil
The Terrible Trivium
I haven't, and no, I don't drink. I don't plan to in future, either. I decided a long time ago that drugs and alcohol were not for me. For you to assume that everyone has done it simply because you have is just arrogant and betrays your ignorance of society.
Marduk
Banned
- Joined
- Apr 26, 2009
- Messages
- 10,183
thats not connected to Haiti, thats connected to next weeks destruction of Brisbane by uncontrolled and unmedicated psi powers
Still
Here.
Here.
It's always entertaining to see how one person with nothing important to say and an utter lack of scientific understanding can incite so much interest in an obscure conspiracy theory while inspiring a host of otherwise knowledgeable and skeptical thinkers to give him all the attention he wants. Carry on!
The Norwegian death ray!!
Who would have thought that they were involved, and the effect on the spiral is cleverly disguised as a lens artefact.
Yea true, Though i did find out alot more information just from the people in this thread then what i knew before hand. You have to start somewhere and of course find that partner in crime!!
Holy ****, thats some info!! cool link cheers.
It wasn't directed at you at all, so please don't take it to heart.
hahahaha i just lmao!!thats not connected to Haiti, thats connected to next weeks destruction of Brisbane by uncontrolled and unmedicated psi powers
What, lutefisk wasn't enough to fulfill Norway's plans for global domination?
Correa Neto
Philosopher
- Joined
- Aug 4, 2003
- Messages
- 8,548
Crap...
Space Nazis + HAARP
A B-movie so bad that may be outstanding!
Space Nazis + HAARP
A B-movie so bad that may be outstanding!
It is a great mind control device with only one small weakness, getting the world to eat it.
Belz...
Fiend God
Which is funny, because by the same token that belief doesn't make you right, which is what you were saying about what people "think" of HAARP.
It is a great mind control device with only one small weakness, getting the world to eat it.
People EAT lutefisk?!!
Well, if some people believe that the HAARP project* is an earthquake-inducing weapon, then it stands to reason that some people would think that lutefisk is edible...
(*Betcha were all wondering how or if I would ever get back on topic!)
CORed
Penultimate Amazing
I get annoyed with people who nitpick every typo, misspelling and minor grammatical error, but for posters like rorylee who post gibberish that only bears a remote resemblance to written English, it is entirely appropriate to be critical.
Sledge
Grammaton Cleric
- Joined
- Oct 4, 2009
- Messages
- 7,114
I totally agree. Let's face it, if we picked up on every typo people make, no discussion would stay on topic longer than about three posts max before turning off into endless "Well that's how we spell it in America" and "Well it's OUR bloody language" posts. If the way someone has spelt something, or the context within which their misspelt word is used, leaves the sentence comprehendable then anything other than good-natured ribbing is just a feeble attempt at point-scoring. But when someone is replacing the word "Vatican" with "vaccines"... ouch.
ETA: just corrected a "there/their" error. I think that proves the point quite well.
Last edited:
bookitty
Philosopher
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2009
- Messages
- 5,732
Ok, cool. So now that you've gotten some info that is a little more factual (Because let's face it, Reader's Digest isn't exactly the most in-depth magazine) what do you think?
Ikarus
Critical Thinker
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2008
- Messages
- 319
first off:
tl;dr : Fantasy is a bad foundation for understanding the world as it is and if you disagree, you should not be on this website.
I think he actually means he has gained more "cool" information. It seems rorylee is actually embracing confirmation bias, and does so rather openly (See also Sunsneezer's analysis upthread).
I did get him to utter, "Oh wait, you need evidence". I'm pretty sure that's the best we can hope for now. He followed up with, "mmmm one day maybe we'll get [to] that". I ripped these two sentences out of context, but to present it this way gives me some hope. Because I genuinely hope that he will one day see the worth of real evidence.
For today, I hope he'll go off to a different forum, where he can use his imagination skills with a "partner in crime", and back-and-forth a wonderful amazing story, including aliens, conspiracies, government cover ups, earthquakes and drama. I hope it will be a good, entertaining story for all to read and enjoy, like a Stephen King novel. I also hope that he, like King, has the honesty to label it fiction.
When he likes to learn more about the real world, or discuss events therein against a backdrop of facts, then I'd be delighted to engage in conversation with him here on the JREF about the topics he'd like to learn a bit more about, especially if it has to do with architecture, which is my cup of tea.
In this thread, there appeared both a space engineer and a geophysicist with lots of real factual knowledge about earthquakes and tectonic plates, electromagnetic waves and communication, and from the others at least also a doctor with plenty of knowledge about the scientific method, plus a high likelihood of more very knowledgeable clever people, as these folk seem to be magically attracted to the JREF forums. The abundance of knowledge here is amazing. It's like ripe apples hanging from the bottom branches. And you could pluck them so easily, if only your hands were up there, and not down your pants.
But since all they have to offer are theories that are rather bland and boring (as in "accepted" and non-controversial), you, rorylee, seem to ignore whatever they are saying, leaping like mad from one theory to the other to escape from the obvious conclusion that there is no conspiracy, while jumping up and down of excitement when someone presents you with this really poor conspiracy material that was written by a guy who's only scientific experience is the fact that he was curator for the Springfield Science Museum, when he was 19, back in the sixties. You just HAVE to see that there is something epically wrong with the way you apply logic and reasoning, when you give more credit to people who have no clue, than to educated folk.
On this forum, we are not trying to expand our understanding of the world in any and all directions. What we're doing here is trying to understand what is going on in the world, within a framework of structured logic, which should result in factual statements or well-supported opinions. Back and forth feeding of imagination is just not good enough. And that doesn't have to do with imagination.
I am in fact a MSc student of Architecture at a technical university. I'm pretty much required to have a working imagination and so it is absolutely no problem for me to summon all kinds of exotic theories and visions. But if I wanted to do that, I'd be at one of those fantasy fiction websites I recommend you go to.
I'm here, though, because skeptics and me share the idea that to understand the world, we cannot rely (at all) on fantasy and imagination to do so. First, we need to properly understand the world AS IT IS (not as we fancy it to be), stripped from as much fiction as we can manage, and from there on we can use our imagination to move into the future and find solutions to unsolved problems facing us now.
Also, because I actually need to work with my imagination quite a lot, I know just how limited a tool it is. It's actually quite hard, if not impossible, to think up something entirely new. That is why conspiracy theorists keep rehashing the old Alien Coverup (albeit in a slightly different jacket for each version). Or Scientific evil experiments. Or "the Jews did it". Or the mysterious monster (Loch Ness, Bigfoot, Chupacabra; they're all exactly the same, except a different location and beast. And it should be noted that each of these beasts are just combinations of other real life animals. Again with the limited imagination!).
And now look at the real world. That huge complex system amazes me every time again. Whether it be natural phenomenon or human inventions or even social constructions... Or complete idiots. They amaze me, too.
Yes, the world is truly magical, without successfully passing the million dollar challenge in any way. But since you seem to insist on masturbating on your own imagination, I heartily advise you that you are on the wrong website.
LS, if you bothered to read to here, congratulations and thanks. I should probably explain that I know that this is a message that isn't going to arrive (that is: in rorylee's brain). But I found it helpful to write, so I am going to put it out there and maybe it resonates with other folk who happen to read it. My attention is not to him, although it happens to be in response to his nonsense. My reason is that I needed to write it; because I have this idea that these things need to be said. Whether that is true, I cannot know. We can't know everything, and that is okay.
tl;dr : Fantasy is a bad foundation for understanding the world as it is and if you disagree, you should not be on this website.
I think he actually means he has gained more "cool" information. It seems rorylee is actually embracing confirmation bias, and does so rather openly (See also Sunsneezer's analysis upthread).
I did get him to utter, "Oh wait, you need evidence". I'm pretty sure that's the best we can hope for now. He followed up with, "mmmm one day maybe we'll get [to] that". I ripped these two sentences out of context, but to present it this way gives me some hope. Because I genuinely hope that he will one day see the worth of real evidence.
For today, I hope he'll go off to a different forum, where he can use his imagination skills with a "partner in crime", and back-and-forth a wonderful amazing story, including aliens, conspiracies, government cover ups, earthquakes and drama. I hope it will be a good, entertaining story for all to read and enjoy, like a Stephen King novel. I also hope that he, like King, has the honesty to label it fiction.
When he likes to learn more about the real world, or discuss events therein against a backdrop of facts, then I'd be delighted to engage in conversation with him here on the JREF about the topics he'd like to learn a bit more about, especially if it has to do with architecture, which is my cup of tea.
In this thread, there appeared both a space engineer and a geophysicist with lots of real factual knowledge about earthquakes and tectonic plates, electromagnetic waves and communication, and from the others at least also a doctor with plenty of knowledge about the scientific method, plus a high likelihood of more very knowledgeable clever people, as these folk seem to be magically attracted to the JREF forums. The abundance of knowledge here is amazing. It's like ripe apples hanging from the bottom branches. And you could pluck them so easily, if only your hands were up there, and not down your pants.
But since all they have to offer are theories that are rather bland and boring (as in "accepted" and non-controversial), you, rorylee, seem to ignore whatever they are saying, leaping like mad from one theory to the other to escape from the obvious conclusion that there is no conspiracy, while jumping up and down of excitement when someone presents you with this really poor conspiracy material that was written by a guy who's only scientific experience is the fact that he was curator for the Springfield Science Museum, when he was 19, back in the sixties. You just HAVE to see that there is something epically wrong with the way you apply logic and reasoning, when you give more credit to people who have no clue, than to educated folk.
On this forum, we are not trying to expand our understanding of the world in any and all directions. What we're doing here is trying to understand what is going on in the world, within a framework of structured logic, which should result in factual statements or well-supported opinions. Back and forth feeding of imagination is just not good enough. And that doesn't have to do with imagination.
I am in fact a MSc student of Architecture at a technical university. I'm pretty much required to have a working imagination and so it is absolutely no problem for me to summon all kinds of exotic theories and visions. But if I wanted to do that, I'd be at one of those fantasy fiction websites I recommend you go to.
I'm here, though, because skeptics and me share the idea that to understand the world, we cannot rely (at all) on fantasy and imagination to do so. First, we need to properly understand the world AS IT IS (not as we fancy it to be), stripped from as much fiction as we can manage, and from there on we can use our imagination to move into the future and find solutions to unsolved problems facing us now.
Also, because I actually need to work with my imagination quite a lot, I know just how limited a tool it is. It's actually quite hard, if not impossible, to think up something entirely new. That is why conspiracy theorists keep rehashing the old Alien Coverup (albeit in a slightly different jacket for each version). Or Scientific evil experiments. Or "the Jews did it". Or the mysterious monster (Loch Ness, Bigfoot, Chupacabra; they're all exactly the same, except a different location and beast. And it should be noted that each of these beasts are just combinations of other real life animals. Again with the limited imagination!).
And now look at the real world. That huge complex system amazes me every time again. Whether it be natural phenomenon or human inventions or even social constructions... Or complete idiots. They amaze me, too.
Yes, the world is truly magical, without successfully passing the million dollar challenge in any way. But since you seem to insist on masturbating on your own imagination, I heartily advise you that you are on the wrong website.
LS, if you bothered to read to here, congratulations and thanks. I should probably explain that I know that this is a message that isn't going to arrive (that is: in rorylee's brain). But I found it helpful to write, so I am going to put it out there and maybe it resonates with other folk who happen to read it. My attention is not to him, although it happens to be in response to his nonsense. My reason is that I needed to write it; because I have this idea that these things need to be said. Whether that is true, I cannot know. We can't know everything, and that is okay.
You are not running for president - but unless you are gamesplaying - and stating you know the rules and might use them is an extremely likely indicator of that (it says "I know I am having fun harassing you - because I know if you respond and get over the line -as I certainly intend - then you get suspended and..That is why I will not respond as you deserve and frankly I feel the "Do not feed" rule is appropriate here) -you are not making a good impression with your ideas or your way of phrasing them.