Merged [Ed] Get involved detecting the ade 651 detector / Jim McCormick arrested

[Dan O.]

Oddly enough, part of the Lockerbie evidence which isn't referred to much is the fact that the luggage loaded on to flight KM180 at Malta was screened for explosives by the Maltese military using a hand-held "sniffer device". I have no idea at all what that was, or even whether there is such a thing as a functional device of this nature, but I still wonder if it was an ADE 651. This was December 1988 - is that possible?

Rolfe.

This is not the woo you are looking for. Move along.

Perhaps what you want is the GT200 that dates from Dec. 1997.


ETA: there is also the quadro detector

U.S. v. QUADRO CORP.
928 F.Supp. 688 (1996)
United States District Court, E.D. Texas, Beaumont Division.
April 22, 1996.​

 

[zooterkin]

This is not the woo you are looking for. Move along.

Perhaps what you want is the GT200 that dates from Dec. 1997.


ETA: there is also the quadro detector

U.S. v. QUADRO CORP.
928 F.Supp. 688 (1996)
United States District Court, E.D. Texas, Beaumont Division.
April 22, 1996.​

Well, neither of those are any good, the Lockerbie bombing was 1988, as Rolfe said.

 

[Dan O.]

Well, neither of those are any good, the Lockerbie bombing was 1988, as Rolfe said.

Yea, I misread that as '98. The quatro seems to have started in '93.

 

[Rolfe]

Why? Explosive detectors are entirely real things. Just because this particular one was a fraud doesn't mean they all are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explosive_detection

I don't know much about it. I wasn't putting much emphasis on the point that the KM180 luggage was all screened for explosives by a detector of this nature, because I knew there were fakes out there. However, if the detector in use was the real deal, for example if it pre-dates the known fakes, then it's one more nail in the already nail-stuffed coffin of the Malta ingestion theory.

Rolfe.

 

[Blue Bubble]

Is sentencing due for today ?

Anyone got more information ?

 

[sleepy_lioness]

10 years jail time

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22380368

Well done everyone.

 

[zooterkin]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22380368

British fraudster James McCormick has been jailed for 10 years for selling fake bomb detectors.
...
The prosecution said the "inescapable conclusion" was that Iraqis died because of their use which allowed bombs to pass undetected through checkpoints.

Richard Whittam QC said that the justice and foreign affairs ministries in Baghdad were hit by truck bombs - which drove through the checkpoints.

 

[Dubious Dick]

Just to add, that was the maximum possible for the offences he was convicted of. Good on Judge Hone!

Much more news to come in weeks to follow!

 

[rjh01]

Congratulations to those people that helped the prosecution and what lead up to it.

 

[dlorde]

Excellent news! Well done to all concerned.

Let's hope this is the first of many...

 

[Crossbow]

Maker of Useless Dowsing Rod for Bombs Convicted for Fraud

http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astr...seless_bomb_detectors_convicted_of_fraud.html

Maker of Useless Dowsing Rod for Bombs Convicted for Fraud

Wow oh wow! The abject stupidity of the Iraq War just never goes away.

In any case, some JREF Members may recall the names Phil Plait and/or Hal Bidlack, and it was Phil Plait who recently published an article in ‘Slate Magazine’ concerning a fellow named James McCormick who made and sold bomb detectors to the Iraqi government that were based on ‘dowsing rods’ technology.

As one can imagine, the devices cost thousands of dollars, James McCormick made millions from the product and sales of the devices, and he quite was surprised to learn that the devices did not actually detect bombs. And to top it all off, now that James McCormick has now been convicted of fraud the Iraqi military is still using these very expensive and very worthless devices to detect bombs.

Ugh!

 

[casebro]

I suspect there is just as much deterrent effect of a bomb detector that doesn't actually work?

 

[Rolfe]

There's a currently-active thread about this that has been going since 2008.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128253

Rolfe.

 

[Rolfe]

Good news. I suppose it's too much to hope for that the people selling these things to dowse for medical issues get hung out to dry too?

Rolfe.

 

[geni]

Good news. I suppose it's too much to hope for that the people selling these things to dowse for medical issues get hung out to dry too?

Probably. Arguably McCormick mistake was to become a foreign policy issue. On the other hand the result of the case does suggest the "I thought it would work" defence isn't as effective as previously suspected.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Just to add to the piling on, from Canada's National Post:

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...ound-the-world-sentenced-to-10-years-in-jail/

“I never had any negative results from customers,” he said.

 

[Soapy Sam]

What is fascinating about all this is that people continued to buy these things, apparently without doing the most elementary research- (a few Google clicks would have led them to threads on this and other forums).
Did none of the buyers test them?
If they did, were they too embarrassed to admit they had been conned?

 

[zooterkin]

What is fascinating about all this is that people continued to buy these things, apparently without doing the most elementary research- (a few Google clicks would have led them to threads on this and other forums).
Did none of the buyers test them?
If they did, were they too embarrassed to admit they had been conned?

I've read that there were kickbacks involved in a lot of the sales, so there was an additional incentive for the buyers to turn a blind eye. Also, to those who don't know better, the demonstrations can be very persuasive, when you find the wand pointing at the explosives without intentionally pointing it there yourself.

 

[joolz]

Just to add, that was the maximum possible for the offences he was convicted of. Good on Judge Hone!

Much more news to come in weeks to follow!

Is this one of the crimes where the judge can enforce the 'proceeds of crime' rules and take back the millions he made from his fraud?

 

[Dubious Dick]

Is this one of the crimes where the judge can enforce the 'proceeds of crime' rules and take back the millions he made from his fraud?

Yes. And reports suggest that the Inspector General at the Iraqi Ministry of Interior will be seeking compensation. we may see claims from other countries emerge. Unfortunately some of his ill gotten gains may be out of reach, but he may never get to enjoy them, if any of those countries seek extradition when he emerges from prison.

He is spending his first night there and is probably missing the high life. As an ex-Policeman he may well be segregated with the paedophiles and others at risk from other prisoners, making him the lowest of the low in that World. Not a bad result for the scumbag!