Dylan starts to get pissy

[Oliver]

bermas a graphic designer?

wait....let me put down my coffeee.


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Well, that´s what he said three minutes ago ... listening
to his show from last saturday...

http://66.90.103.18/Archives2/Jan2007/louder7nmx4/0113072.mp3

 

[Crungy]

Is being told to "grow up" by Merc rock bottom?

Dylan, seriously dude, I would chill on all this *******-ism.

You are looking so bad right now, a lot of people know we are trying to reach out and unify the movement, while patching things up with you. It's not just confined to people who left your original forum or people at pilots. We're talking about people who are in your movie, people who are helping you with your movie.

I can't help it if you slept on our second trip, we made the offer. You dropped the ball. We got the evidence. Now you're acting all salty about it.

You delete this post, it's again, just going to show how bitter you still are over all this stuff.

Knock it off and grow up homey.

 

[Oliver]

And a kleenex.

tampon?

 

[uk_dave]

tampon?

If you insist, but there's no need to hammer it home.

 

[Oliver]

If you insist, but there's no need to hammer it home.

 

[Firestone]

Is being told to "grow up" by Merc rock bottom?

Dylans' answer:

Ego ego ego Merc. You really are a nutcase.

I'll leave this post for all to see that you are a glory hound, and you're so delusional you feel the entire movement is going to drop to its knees and worship you because you've found a couple witnesses who may or may not have witnessed a potential flyover.

I have an idea.

How about you take out all of the footage I sent you? Considering you kissed my ass just to get it and talk rampant nonsense about me behind my back, I have no obligation to give you ANYTHING.

Think about this...when the Final Cut hits theaters, which it IS, my distribution company won't be pleased that someone's using our footage. Personally, I'm not a lawsuit kinda guy, but our company is.

You really think I'm bitter because I "slept on your second trip"?

I'm bitter because you are an unstable individual, and you need a really bad reality check, brother.

You've harassed people in DC, including Mike Walter. You've left voicemails on Russ' phone like a coward.

What's left to say, Merc? I don't give a **** about your movie. Period. Get that through your thick skull.

Everyone else, I'm all for uniting within the movement, but what these guys are doing is the exact opposite.

They debunk themselves, me think ...

 

[Oliver]

Dylans' answer:

They debunk themselves, me think ...

 

[chran]

http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=2796&view=findpost&p=11347838

How about you take out all of the footage I sent you? Considering you kissed my ass just to get it and talk rampant nonsense about me, I have no obligation to give you ANYTHING.

Seems like the Pentagon-movie will have another delay

 

[chippy]

Keep an eye on this thread. Looks like Merc is really sticking it to Dylan right now. If Loose Change ever gets a wide release, this is something that should be shown to as many people as possible:

http://www.proxygem.com/cgi-bin/nph...ge_Forum/index.php=3fshowtopic=3d2796&st=3d60

 

[chippy]

Oh wow...it's already been deleted! Crap, I should have saved what Merc said!

 

[Oliver]

Oh wow...it's already been deleted! Crap, I should have saved what Merc said!

Damn - does someone have this site still open? I missed his reply, too...

 

[Firestone]

Oh wow...it's already been deleted! Crap, I should have saved what Merc said!

I have!

Merc's last answer I have is:

Ego?
I ain't the one walking around with black T-shirts, producing half assed documentaries that I have to revise 3 times. Causing everyone else to work overtime because of YOUR stonerfied mistakes, but then prancing aroundcting like you are the savior to the movement.
You're a coward. You sat on your ass for 4 days in the Sheraton after we left, smoking weed, when you could have went out did interviews in the streets like we did. But you didn't, you wait for other people to do the work, then you jucie them for all their worth and the dump them when you don't need them.
You don't care about the truth movement. You care about $ and fame.
If you did care, you would have called us and shown up on that second trip. If you cared, you'd want to swap footage.
Our footage is way more important than your Lloyd/Shinki "smoking gun".
Yeah, real truther. He is going to sue us for using footage he sent us and said we could use. Way to unify the truth movement.
Question why is this about us? Why aren't you jumping at the evidence. O h I got it, because we didn't just roll over and put it on your forum for free, huh? You're mad because we didn't just hand it over to you, the omnipotent "leader of the pack? I didn't kiss your ass to get it, I asked you and told you what it is for. You better check who the glory hound is, you seem to be lacking glory when it comes to evidence that the plane was on the North side, and now you want to downgrade that glory, because it isn't yours. Hater.
You can't even get your facts straight, I didn't leave a voicemail for Russell. i harrassed Mike Walter? We called him once, LIAR. He never returnd our call.
I'll make sure I spread this news around plenty.

Good job, dog. Smoke another blunt.

 

[Oliver]

I. Love. You ... Firestone.

Don´t tell my girlfriend, promised?

 

[Alt+F4]

Dylan was posting that LC:FC would definitely have a theatrical release. Someone replied with, "Well Gigli was released in theatres too."

BANNED!

 

[R.Mackey]

...Causing everyone else to work overtime because of YOUR stonerfied mistakes, but then prancing aroundcting like you are the savior to the movement.
You're a coward. You sat on your ass for 4 days in the Sheraton after we left, smoking weed, when you could have went out did interviews in the streets like we did. ...

Good job, dog. Smoke another blunt.

I don't mean to leap to conclusions, but there sure seems to be an inordinate amount of marijuana usage among the Troothers.

Possibly because they're all teenagers. Correlation need not imply causation, and all that. Still, it's pretty sad.

 

[uk_dave]

I don't mean to leap to conclusions, but there sure seems to be an inordinate amount of marijuana usage among the Troothers.

Possibly because they're all teenagers. Correlation need not imply causation, and all that. Still, it's pretty sad.

It's OK, we control the supply and quality of cannabis.... all those extra chemicals we add will soon be kicking in!

 

[Arus808]

Dylan was posting that LC:FC would definitely have a theatrical release. Someone replied with, "Well Gigli was released in theatres too."

BANNED!

haha...well even the Toxic Avenger was released to the theaters and that is a better movie than all LC versions ^_^

And again, with him claiming its being released to theaters....I live in California, and most of my friends are actors (one is a casting director) and none of them have heard anything remotely tied to any 911 movie...

He must think that showing it in an art house movie theater, filled with his friends/family/ilk is considered a theatrical release.

 

[geni]

Standard IANAL but

I actually spent a chunk of my weekend in an edit suite discussing the concept of "fair use" with a media lawyer in a news station.

- For tv stations networks it's entirely acceptable to use around 60 seconds of material from another station, provided

A) They've not slapped an "exclusive" aaton onto it.

B) the context of the footage isn't changed.

The relivant case law is?

To me that looks more like an unofficial industry wide agreement rather than something from fair use law.

The latter is incredibly signifigant, any news organisation can sue if for example they "quote mine" a reporter saying something "it looked like an missile"

That is right of publicity rather than fair use. Indeed under fair use transformative works are generaly safer.

Furthermore the concept of fair use works off a quid pro quo system, each network benefits from this system.

If the lawyer told you that there is either some rather odd caselaw or they are flat out wrong. The closest area I know about would be music sampling and is definetly not how the law has decided.

One network has footage of a police chase, and the rest borrow a few seconds of the footage, another
has an interivew with say one of the london suicide bombers (ie Al Jazeera) the other stations can use a bit of it, and claim fair use.

Umm how? this would appear to be directly competeing with the intial use which means fair usew is very unlikely to apply.

However Dylan and loose change isn't a tv station. And cannot plunder their resources. Why? Because he brings nothing to the table. His film is a patch work of news reports and talking heads, he offers little by way of new information. There's no quid pro quo, there's nothing of benefit for the news station Dylan has ripped off.

Largely irrelivant to the legal situation. While fair use is extreamly unlikely to apply it would fail for reasons other than those you have stated.

However with his claim that he's got over 70 prints in the UK for it's release he's entered hot water. UK (and Ireland they are different countries) libel laws are some of the most stringent in the world (recall the "tom cruise won't get out of the closest" SP episode, his final line is "I'll sue your asses in england" and that was prophetic, because Tommy did sue Matt and Trey in England) means that Loose Change need to stand up to not only the rebust criticism of the UK media, the challenges of a vicious libel suit from any number of people, and the extremely serious potential that any number of a couple of dozen tv news networks suing the little [rule8] for misuse of copyright material.

You think UK lible laws are nasty? Wait untill you see our copyright law.

If I was Dylan I'd be under a blanket sucking my thumb right now, or alternatively wandering around some mexican back water trying to perfect my 'Mi namo Pedro, no comprede "Loose Change", Senior."

Not at all. Remeber he can use US gov pictures and footage for a lot of stuff.

 

[Arus808]

Standard IANAL but



The relivant case law is?

To me that looks more like an unofficial industry wide agreement rather than something from fair use law.

Im not sure, cause I can't decipher the copyright law without a lawyer, but you can look it up under Fair Use ..

If you plan on altering then you have to claim its a Parody.

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter9/index.html

You can only use the footage for criticism or commentary. So you'd have to present the footage as it was shown without any alteration. That is what I understand from the classes on film making I took.

What Dylan and company are doing is taking "footage" and altering it in away that the original message is being altered to fit their message. So, its not fairuse. Its not even a Parody.

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter9/9-a.html#2



Here are some links to cases that have been tried under Fair Use:
http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter9/9-c.html#2


Unfortunately, it boils down as to how the Copyright holder interprets how the person who used their footage, and if they feel that their footage can fall under fair use. So if the News Stations that filmed a footage and Dylan uses in LC without their permission, and they felt that their footage is not being used under Fair Use, they can sue dylan and company .... which is what I hope they do...

 

[geni]

Im not sure, cause I can't decipher the copyright law without a lawyer, but you can look it up under Fair Use ..

If you plan on altering then you have to claim its a Parody.

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter9/index.html

I know this however that wasn't quite what I was talking about. I was talking about keeping the work the same but changeing the use.

You can only use the footage for criticism or commentary. So you'd have to present the footage as it was shown without any alteration. That is what I understand from the classes on film making I took.

I would broadly agree that is the case.

What Dylan and company are doing is taking "footage" and altering it in away that the original message is being altered to fit their message. So, its not fairuse. Its not even a Parody.

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter9/9-a.html#2
[/quote]

The counter argument would be allong the lines that they are commenting on the footage (although seince they are commenting on the events in the footage I'm not sure how well that one will hold up).

Unfortunately, it boils down as to how the Copyright holder interprets how the person who used their footage, and if they feel that their footage can fall under fair use. [/qupte]

Heh I would claim it boils down to how the judge is feeling on the day when it gets to court.

So if the News Stations that filmed a footage and Dylan uses in LC without their permission, and they felt that their footage is not being used under Fair Use, they can sue dylan and company .... which is what I hope they do...

Or just wait for it to appear in theUK where there is no such thing as fair use.