Debate (not debase) a Truther

Oystein said:
In other words: You have nothing. Nothing whatsoever. Nothing at all.

Thanks for admitting the Big Nothingness.

Case closed?
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In your mind it obviously is. But you're still here talking to me, asking me questions (kinda).....

Heres a question for your question: How do you define the starting and ending points of a conspiracy as vast and complex as this one. In order to understand their motive, you must understand their history.

But I dont expect you to appreciate this.

Can you, at least agree that Rockefeller is considered a Global Elite based upon his previously posted quotes?
 
ImANiceGuy said:
taken from rense.com; evidence of influence in the Media

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, the New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years."
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You got a source on that one?

Lets check wikiquote. It says the source is "as quoted in Matrix of Power: How the World Has Been Controlled by Powerful Men Without Your Knowledge (2000) by Jordan Maxwell"

Well, there's a reliable source.

From Rockefeller's 2002 memoirs; evidence of geo-political engineering/influence

"For more than a century ideological extremists at either end of the political spectrum have seized upon well-publicized incidents such as my encounter with Castro to attack the Rockefeller family for the inordinate influence they claim we wield over American political and economic institutions. Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as 'internationalists' and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure -- one world, if you will. If that's the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it."
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Not the first time someone's posted that.

I think this post explains that quote fairly well.

Also:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4586124&postcount=41
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4590007&postcount=45
 
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I disagree with your 'symantic' hand wave.

He explicitly says; If this is the charge, then I stand guilty.
 
"Populists and isolationists ignore the tangible benefits that have resulted from our active international role during the past half-century. Not only was the very real threat posed by Soviet Communism overcome, but there have been fundamental improvements in societies around the world, particularly in the United States, as a result of global trade, improved communications, and the heightened interaction of people from different cultures. Populists rarely mention these positive consequences, nor can they cogently explain how they would have sustained American economic growth and the expansion of our political power without them." -- David Rockefeller

Could be refering to this. One World has many meanings.

ETA: Damnit, broke the boycott. Man, now I'm a scab too.
 
ImANiceGuy said:
I disagree with your 'symantic' hand wave.

He explicitly says; If this is the charge, then I stand guilty.
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Again I asked for a source on the first quote, where is it?

As for the second...

He says he is guilty of wanting... "to build a more integrated global political and economic structure -- one world, if you will"...

Remember he starts the sentence off with "SOME EVEN SAY". IE. Its a separate point to the preceding sentence. He uses the word "conspire" as a joke (conspiracy theorists don't understand jokes, or hyperbole). He also explains what he means by this "integrated global political and economic structure".

But why would he just come out and admit he is this evil banker trying to take over the world? Doesn't it sound more likely to you that this is what he meant?

This is a textbook example of a quote-mine and you fell for it. Well done. Truthers told you what it says, so now you can only see that.

I wonder if someone told you they can see a monkey in the clouds, Im sure you refuse to see anything but monkeys as well.
 
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dudalb said:
I am not a scab because I thought the boycott was a silly idea and never signed on.
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Ditto! However, this sub-forum is a waste of bandwidth now (not that I care). It used to be informative, tip of the spear, and all that. Twoof is dead, but still damn hysterical! Carry on . All of the "boy cotters", will be back soon enough...
 
Edx said:
You got a source on that one?

Lets check wikiquote. It says the source is "as quoted in Matrix of Power: How the World Has Been Controlled by Powerful Men Without Your Knowledge (2000) by Jordan Maxwell"

Well, there's a reliable source.
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I think you're the first guy here to answer a question as he's asking it. Congrats.
 
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dudalb said:
I am not a scab because I thought the boycott was a silly idea and never signed on.
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Hell yeah.
hfive.gif
 
ImANiceGuy said:
I think you're the first guy here to answer a question as he's asking it. Congrats.
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UUUUhhh, no...

This is like saying you got the quote from an Alex Jones film. Where did Jordan Maxwell get it? Do you even know who Jordan Maxwell is? Do you even care? Or do you only care that he is telling you what you want to hear?
 
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Edx said:
UUUUhhh, no...

This is like saying you got the quote from an Alex Jones film. Where did Jordan Maxwell get it? Do you even know who Jordan Maxwell is? Do you even care? Or do you only care that he is telling you what you want to hear?
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Jordan Maxwell got it from Rockefeller's 1991 address to the Trilateral Commission. You can see the quote on page 16 at google books (link is crazy long, google book title)

Pretty damning quote imo.....what happened to the idea of a free press?
 
ImANiceGuy said:
Jordan Maxwell got it from Rockefeller's 1991 address to the Trilateral Commission. You can see the quote on page 16 at google books (link is crazy long, google book title)

Pretty damning quote imo.....what happened to the idea of a free press?
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Unless I can find a primary source of what Rockefeller is meant to have said and in context, then all you have is hearsay by a proven liar and nut case (Maxwell) and we just have to believe him on faith.

Would you just believe something because it is written in a book by David Icke as well, or would you really need to check that out first? Conspiracy theorists love spreading around false quotes they don't check beforehand. Many of these banking CT quotes were usually started by some anti-Semitic group/writer at that.

So you have that primary source or not?
 
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Edx said:
Unless I can find a primary source of what Rockefeller is meant to have said and in context, then all you have is hearsay by a proven liar and nut case (Maxwell) and we just have to believe him on faith.

Would you just believe something because it is written in a book by David Icke as well, or would you really need to check that out first? Conspiracy theorists love spreading around false quotes they don't check beforehand. Many of these banking CT quotes were usually started by some anti-Semitic group/writer at that.

So you have that primary source or not?
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Well the Reptilians would blow their cover if they sued for libel.

I'll email Maxwell just for fun; where would one get trasncripts from Trilateral meetings I don't know...
 
ImANiceGuy said:
Well the Reptilians would blow their cover if they sued for libel.

I'll email Maxwell just for fun; where would one get trasncripts from Trilateral meetings I don't know...
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So, you see my dilemma right?

And it should be yours too, why should YOU believe Maxwell? You should know by that that conspiracy theories especially banking ones are FULL of out of context, falsely attributed quotes, along with ones that are completely fabricated! And they get passed around and around and around.

Report back what Maxwell's excuse is.
 
ImANiceGuy said:
where would one get trasncripts from Trilateral meetings I don't know...
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Have you looked at their web page yet?
http://www.trilateral.org/

Example:
I see J.D. IV at the 88 meeting, not in 91.
T40. The Tokyo Meeting Of The Trilateral Commission, April 1988
The Trilateral Commission (© 1988)
Ed: Andrew V. Frankel, Charles B. Heck
Contributions by Masaru Yoshitomi, Sumiko Iwao, Seizaburo Sato, Noboru Takeshita, Yasuhiro Nakasone, Sosuke Uno, Richard Holbrooke, Roderick MacFarquhar, Kazuo Nukazawa, Pu Shan, Park Yung-Chul, Koichi Kato, John D. Rockefeller IV, Piero Bassetti, Ritt Bjerregaard, Isamu Miyazaki, C. Fred Bergsten, Niels Thygesen, Pedro Schwartz, Kiichi Miyazawa, Otto Graf Lambsdorff, Paul A. Volcker, Ivan Head, Edmund Wellenstein, Saburo Okita, Sadako Ogata, Michel Tatu, Strobe Talbott, Masashi Nishihara, and Zbigniew Brzezinski.


T43. Tokyo 1991: The Annual Meeting Of The Trilateral Commission
The Trilateral Commission (© 1991)
Ed: Andrew V. Frankel, Charles B. Heck
Contributions by Yoichi Funabashi, Takatoshi Ito, Akihiko Tanaka, Han Sung-Joo, Sukhumbhand Paribatra, Hadi Soesastro, Gareth Evans, C. Fred Bergsten, Kazuo Chiba, Mario Monti, Joseph J. Sisco, Yukio Satoh, Garret FitzGerald, Sadako Ogata, David Gergen, Simone Veil.
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Maybe these lists aren't complete. Do you know?
 
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ImANiceGuy said:
In your mind it obviously is. But you're still here talking to me, asking me questions (kinda).....

Heres a question for your question: How do you define the starting and ending points of a conspiracy as vast and complex as this one. In order to understand their motive, you must understand their history.

But I dont expect you to appreiate this.
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That's right, I don't appreciate this, as I am not fantasizing about "of a conspiracy as vast and complex as this one". You are doing the fantasizing, so it's your job to define start and end (and everythin in between).

I am waiting.

ImANiceGuy said:
Can you, at least agree that Rockefeller is considered a Global Elite based upon his previously posted quotes?
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Yes, I can. And?
Can you at least agree that Hu Jintao, Warren Buffett and Vladimir Putin are members of the Global Elite (MUCH more so than the relatively poor-off old-money Rockefellers), probably can be quoted with having had grandiose plans at some point in their careers, but probably have nothing at all to do with 9/11?

So what does it mean to say that some Rockefeller is in some vague sense member of the vaguely defined "Global Elite" with regard to 9/11? Nothing, I'd propose!?
 
Oystein, you need to calm down man. I've found more interesting people to run my ideas across.....they're much friendlier.
 
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