d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
Can you please be more specific?
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Cont: Cancel culture IRL Part 2
- Thread starter ahhell
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- cancel culture
arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
You know, when he cancelled news organisations by banning them from the White House. The recent time, that was overturned by the Supreme Court because it was blatantly unconstitutional. Remember?
d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
Just to be clear, do you recognize any conceptual distinction between informal cultural issues and formal legal issues? Seems like those require different solutions but I want to hear your take.
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arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
I do not recognise any conceptual distinction between so-called "cancel culture" and the Trump administration, no. Trump is one of the biggest cancellers on the planet.
dirtywick
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2006
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Damning Elon Musk Film Hit With Shocking Censorship
Musk’s power is the subject of Alex Gibney’s new documentary—and apparently the reason some platforms don’t want to advertise it.
www2.thedailybeast.com
does this count? a bunch of social media sites refusing to run advertisements for musk documentary, said it ran afoul of bans on political content
d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
Some say politics are downstream of culture, which makes policies a lagging indicator of the zeitgeist at best.
A leading indicator of whether Americans continue to support Trump's attacks on the press would be something more like this:
The poll, completed on Sunday, was conducted over a four-day period that saw Trump throw three major news organizations out of the White House and muse that Washington's iconic Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts -- named after slain President John F. Kennedy -- could be torn down if Trump's own name could not be added to it.
Of course, conservative cancel culture remains alive and well amongst MAGA diehards but I expect them to wield less and less actual power for at least the next couple of years as the consequences of Trump's policies becoming more and more clear to ordinary Americans.
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arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
The US Administration cancelling black and female vets:
www.bbc.com
Arlington Cemetery strips content on black and female veterans from website
The Army-run cemetery said it is working to follow Trump's orders on ending diversity while restoring information.
www.bbc.com
Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
Narrator: They aren't.
Arlington Cemetery strips content on black and female veterans from website
The Army-run cemetery said it is working to follow Trump's orders on ending diversity while restoring information.
So... you know all the people are still there, and most of the people that your article insists have been taken down are still present in the notable graves section, don't you?
All they've done is to remove categories that are explicitly race-based and sex-based from the menu.
OMG, the horror of a national cemetery treating all servicemembers as if their sex and their race are irrelevant to their careers and honors! It's truly the end times, when content of character is considered of far more import than color of skin! We must revolt because we can't make race the only major characteristic by which to judge people!
[/s]
ETA:
Your article says "
On the cemetery's website, internal links that directed users to webpages with information about the "Notable Graves" of dozens of black, Hispanic and female veterans were missing on Friday.
The pages contained short biographies about veterans such as Gen Colin L Powell, the first black chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, which is the highest rank in the military after the president."
But if you go look...
Your article says "They also told the life stories of members of the Tuskegee Airmen, the country's first black military airmen."
Turns out they still do!
They get an entire page, contrary to what your BBC article claims about them having been removed.
Your article claims "Information on Hector Santa Anna, a World War II bomber pilot and career military leader who has been called a hero of the war, has been taken down, as well."
But hey, look at that, Santa Anna is still there!
Stop letting sensationalist media overclock your outrage processors with lies.
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d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
Race/ethnicity is quite relevant sometimes, and it is ahistorical to pretend otherwise.
Why was Felix Longoria interred at Arlington? Because a racist Texas funeral director inadvertently sparked a movement to treat Mexican American soldiers honorably.
ETA: This information was formerly avaliable from here, a convenient page collating a number of true stories which might come in handy in classrooms during Hispanic Heritage Month.
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Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
You might note that the entries for the individuals continue to note their race when it's relevant. Nobody is being ahistorical.
The only change is that the site no longer treats some races as more noteworthy than others. Do you think some races are more noteworthy and more deserving of special treatment than others?
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d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
Ethnic and religious groups which were traditionally segregated from the majority group (i.e. WASPs in U.S.A.) merit some special consideration, of course, if we happen to be memorializing and teaching American history.
Felix Longoria is personally noteworthy specifically because his family refused to allow him to be buried in a segregated cemetery.
Maximiliano Luna served the U.S. in the First Volunteer Cavalry during the Spanish American War, back when his fellow Americans were even less keen on native Spanish speakers than they are today. Teddy Roosevelt saw to it that his name was memorialized alongside fellow Rough Riders, making him the first Hispanic American to be honored at Arlington.
The Tuskegee AirmenWP and the Borinqueneers are especially noteworthy because they served with distinction despite cultural difficulties integrating African Americans and Puerto Ricans into traditionally white ranks.
I don't think we can tell the fully story of what made these men significant while leaving off the fact that they were up against color barriers.
ETA: This has almost nothing to do with "cancel culture" which is more about mob justice meted out upon living individuals.
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Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
I think you're missing the point here. It's fine and dandy to acknowledge the barriers they were up against at the time. It's something different to use federal funds at a national cemetery to explicitly call out a race in its entirety.
The information about these people - including their race - is still present on the arlington site (contrary to what the BBC article claims. What has changed is that there's no longer a "black people" list or a "hispanic list" or other exclusionary list that places more focus on the color of their skin than the content of their character.
d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
The content of someone's character cannot be blithely decoupled from the "barriers they were up against at the time" because character is forged by overcoming challenges. There is nothing remotely wrong with using federal funds to teach historical facts about people who overcame color barriers and/or broke through glass ceilings, and there is something wrong with censoring such material to assuage unearned white guilt.
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arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
You do realise that "white guilt" is always a phrase used by the anti-woke, anti-SJW, anti-CRM crowd, right? Nobody who argues for social justice or the redress of historical wrongs is ever talking about "white guilt".
d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
Yes, precisely the sort of crowd who are motivated to take down webpages (and books) highlighting Hispanic American heritage, African American heritage, women's breakthroughs, etc. Do you object to my characterization of their motives on grounds of style or substance?
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Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
Hmm. Nothing has been decoupled from those barriers. If you read the entries, the information is still present.
You seem to think that creating entire categories in a government database that are solely about a service member's race is a good thing to do. I think it's counterproductive and continues to make color of skin a more important characteristic than content of character.
Additionally, there are many places to find information about people who overcame barriers. The purpose of Arlington is to honor deceased servicemembers - the end. The purpose of Arlington is not to advocate on behalf of one race or sex.
Emily's Cat
Rarely prone to hissy-fits
White Fragility - Wikipedia
d4m10n
Penultimate Amazing
This statement is not entirely true. For example, sentences like "the “Felix Longoria Affair” played a significant role in catalyzing Mexican American political consciousness and activism" were stripped entirely from the official website but remain preserved in the Wayback Archive.
What I said was something more like "I don't think we can tell the full story of what made these men significant while leaving off the fact that they were up against" various ethnic and racial barriers to integration within the armed services. Can you see the difference?
I've no idea how you came to this conclusion. Mentioning that the Borinqueneers were Puerto Rican and not yet integrated into other units is a noteworthy historical fact, but it isn't considered more important than their meritorious service. Seriously, who even says that sort of thing?
If you want to honor the Tuskegee Airmen, you have to honor everything they achieved including how they altered the perceptions of policymakers regarding the capabilities of African American servicemen generally and pilots specifically.
I've had enough of this derail from cancel culture; if you want to make a general argument against pointing out the achievements of those who broke through irrational discriminatory barriers, I'll see you over in the DEI thread.
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Cain
Straussian
A former Israeli actress thought she was speaking to morning show hosts off-air during a commercial break. She said she no longer felt proud to be Israeli. She lamented religious fervor sweeping the country, the actions of the settlers, Jewish terrorism, and arrogance. She said Israelis are conquerors. She claimed things started going downhill after the reality of the '67 occupation set in. Upon learning her comments were being broadcast, her eyes went wide with disbelief.
Well, freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequences. Sucks to suck. Imagine thinking you're entitled to say whatever you want without pushback. Maybe don't be a terrible person. Nobody owes her a platform. She should look up the word "accountability." Cry harder. Stay mad. The trash took itself out.