Cont: Cancel culture IRL Part 2

[EaglePuncher]

There has never been agreement about what cancel culture is in this thread, as far as I can tell. In addition, my position is that social media facilitates it but is not an essential element. I believe that I have said as much in previous comments.

Yeah, I already explained multiple times (last time in the post you quoted) that cancel culture means anything anyone wants it to mean.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

German and Lukianoff weigh in

Komi T. German and Greg Lukianoff (of FIRE) wrote, "But just because the term has been grossly overused doesn’t mean we should give up on its popularly understood definition—which aptly describes a real (and growing) problem. This is the measurable uptick, since around 2014, of campaigns to get people fired, disinvited, deplatformed, or otherwise punished for speech that is—or would be—protected by First Amendment standards. That’s 'cancel culture.'...On campus there are hundreds of examples in only the past few years limited just to scholars, and likely thousands if you count students, which is amazing because 80 percent of students at not-for-profit four-year colleges attend only about 600 schools. (We are gathering data on student cancellations, but from the approximately 1,500 incidents we look at each year, we already know that students get in trouble far more often than professors.)"

I am very grateful that these authors took the time to walk the reader through a number of examples across the political spectrum. The denialist position is that cancel culture does not exist, except as a rhetorical weapon used by conservatives. The case of Will Wilkinson shows how strong denialism can be. Yet FIRE is nonpartisan, and that the World Socialist Web Site (although not using the term cancel culture) critiqued several of the same incidents that we discussed in these threads.

 

[Graham2001]

This case being covered in the New York Times has the same dynamic as the case I mentioned in Post 1657. Someone on social media decides that something is 'harmful' without actually having interacted with the story (e.g. based on rumour.) and launches a campaign to get the item banned so that it cannot 'harm' whoever the person launched the campaign believes they are protecting.


In this case a female(?) author has used the classic trope of a 'world without men' to write a novel which according to the publishers blurb:

From the author of The Heavens, The Men is a gripping, beautiful, and disquieting novel of feminist utopias and impossible sacrifices that interrogates the dream of a perfect society and the conflict between individual desire and the good of the community.

It is of course now being condemned as 'transphobic' because apparently, only males can be trans (an interesting view that...).


Lesbian author Lauren Hough, went on social media to defend the author and call for people to read the book before criticising it.


She has now had her own work pulled from a major award and is apparently a 'TERF'.


Here is the incipit from the NYT article:

Last month, Lauren Hough, a first-time author, received good news from an editor at her publishing house: Her essay collection “Leaving Isn’t The Hardest Thing,” published last year, was set to be nominated for a Lambda Literary Award in the category of lesbian memoir.

The nomination seemed a capstone to a remarkable debut, which won critical acclaim and spent two weeks on The New York Times’s best-seller list. The book, described by its publisher as interrogating “our notions of ecstasy, queerness, and what it means to live freely,” drew heavily on Hough’s life experiences, including as a lesbian in the Air Force during the “don’t ask, don’t tell” era. A reviewer for NPR likened her skill at portraiture to that of “one of those cartoonists who can sketch out four lines and suddenly you see your face in them.”

But Hough said in an interview Monday that an editor had recently informed her that the nomination had been pulled, following a social media dust-up in which Hough had defended, at times heatedly, a forthcoming novel by the author Sandra Newman, a friend of hers, from criticism that it was transphobic.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/21/books/lauren-hough-lambda-literary.html


Here is Lauren Hough's response to what's happened.


https://laurenhough.substack.com/p/a-question-for-lambda-literary?s=r

 

[angrysoba]

Did Will Smith just cancel Chris Rock?

 

[EaglePuncher]

Komi T. German and Greg Lukianoff (of FIRE) wrote, "But just because the term has been grossly overused doesn’t mean we should give up on its popularly understood definition—which aptly describes a real (and growing) problem. This is the measurable uptick, since around 2014, of campaigns to get people fired, disinvited, deplatformed, or otherwise punished for speech that is—or would be—protected by First Amendment standards. That’s 'cancel culture.'...On campus there are hundreds of examples in only the past few years limited just to scholars, and likely thousands if you count students, which is amazing because 80 percent of students at not-for-profit four-year colleges attend only about 600 schools. (We are gathering data on student cancellations, but from the approximately 1,500 incidents we look at each year, we already know that students get in trouble far more often than professors.)"

I am very grateful that these authors took the time to walk the reader through a number of examples across the political spectrum. The denialist position is that cancel culture does not exist, except as a rhetorical weapon used by conservatives. The case of Will Wilkinson shows how strong denialism can be. Yet FIRE is nonpartisan, and that the World Socialist Web Site (although not using the term cancel culture) critiqued several of the same incidents that we discussed in these threads.

Yawn....

If your best point is: "They were allowed to say that" you did not have much of a point to begin with. I'm pretty sure that claiming "The shoa was a great thing" is also protected by the first amendment.

The fact that you mention Wilkinson who was fired after suggesting "Pence should be lynched by Biden for the sake for unity" is extremely hilarious.

 

[EaglePuncher]

Did Will Smith just cancel boost his and Chris Rocks career?

ftfy

 

[Chris_Halkides]

more on Will Wilkinson

"Consider Will Wilkinson, the former vice president of policy at the Niskanen Center, who was fired in 2021 for tweeting, “If Biden really wanted unity, he’d lynch Mike Pence,” for which he later apologized. Conservative news sites such as The Federalist and The Daily Caller condemned Wilkinson, and a Twitter mob ensued. Despite losing his job because of cancel culture, Wilkinson continues to dismiss the phenomenon, characterizing cancel culture as “conservative hysteria” and a “boogeyman.”" from the Daily Beast.

Wilkinson reminds me of anti-vaxxers who deny the existence of Covid-19 while on their deathbed.

 

[EaglePuncher]

"Consider Will Wilkinson, the former vice president of policy at the Niskanen Center, who was fired in 2021 for tweeting, “If Biden really wanted unity, he’d lynch Mike Pence,” for which he later apologized. Conservative news sites such as The Federalist and The Daily Caller condemned Wilkinson, and a Twitter mob ensued. Despite losing his job because of cancel culture, Wilkinson continues to dismiss the phenomenon, characterizing cancel culture as “conservative hysteria” and a “boogeyman.”" from the Daily Beast.

Wilkinson reminds me of anti-vaxxers who deny the existence of Covid-19 while on their deathbed.

Translation: Cancel culture exists because people say so, anyone who disagrees looks like some anti vaxxer.

Strong points,lol.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

This case being covered in the New York Times has the same dynamic as the case I mentioned in Post 1657. Someone on social media decides that something is 'harmful' without actually having interacted with the story (e.g. based on rumour.) and launches a campaign to get the item banned so that it cannot 'harm' whoever the person launched the campaign believes they are protecting.


In this case a female(?) author has used the classic trope of a 'world without men' to write a novel which according to the publishers blurb:



It is of course now being condemned as 'transphobic' because apparently, only males can be trans (an interesting view that...).


Lesbian author Lauren Hough, went on social media to defend the author and call for people to read the book before criticising it.


She has now had her own work pulled from a major award and is apparently a 'TERF'.


Here is the incipit from the NYT article:



https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/21/books/lauren-hough-lambda-literary.html


Here is Lauren Hough's response to what's happened.


https://laurenhough.substack.com/p/a-question-for-lambda-literary?s=r

Man, crazy world we live in where going on a profanity laced flame war with the intended audience of your books puts you in hot water with an organization meant to appeal to that audience. What really happened here is this lady acted like a gigantic jackass, and now nobody wants to experience the second-hand embarrassment of publicly associating with her.

Raving like a lunatic on Twitter is bad for your career, news at 11. Getting into vitriolic flame wars with people who criticize your work (or someone else's work, in this case) is unhinged behavior.

“In a series of now-deleted tweets, Lauren Hough exhibited what we believed to be a troubling hostility toward transgender critics and trans-allies and used her substantial platform — due in part to her excellent book — to harmfully engage with readers and critics,” Cleopatra Acquaye and Maxwell Scales, Lambda Literary’s interim co-executive directors, said in a joint statement Monday. “As an L.G.B.T.Q. organization, we cannot knowingly reward individuals who exhibit disdain and disrespect for the autonomy of an entire segment of the community we have committed ourselves to supporting.”

Hough said Monday that she could not recall whether she had deleted any tweets, and denied that any of her tweets had been transphobic. Lambda did not provide examples of the posts they were most critical of. The Times has not reviewed any deleted tweets.

Lol just like the NYTimes to run another "cancel culture" shock piece without even bothering to actually look into the allegedly bad behavior. Did she or did she not delete inflammatory statements? Probably a factual question a journalist could answer if they cared to find out.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Choe's point of view

Another cancellation on the books.



https://www.thestranger.com/slog/2022/03/21/68783953/komo-journalist-blasts-out-proud-boy-propaganda

Can't even put together a sizzle reel for a fascist street gang set to white separatist anthem without triggering the libs. So much for freedom of speech!

Wonder which right wing rag will pick up this "cancelled" journalist first.

Jonathan Choe wrote, "In fact, none of the marchers would talk to me on the record because they “didn’t trust the mainstream media.” So I just started following the march route...In a Tweet recapping the day, I decided to create a photo montage with natural sound from the march (in TV news this is what’s called a “NAT Pkg”). One of my videos picked up music blasting from a speaker strapped over the shoulder of one of the protesters. I could not make out the words and had never heard this song in my life. You could also hear car horns and the footsteps of marchers as I weaved in and out of the crowd. I laid some photos over this natural sound from the video and hit send."
EDT
The Stranger wrote, "He added to the montage's recruitment energy when he — or whoever made the video — decided to set it to a ballad called "We'll Have Our Home Again,"" (from Suburban Turkey's link). Sloppy reporting from The Stranger? You could knock me over with a feather.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

Jonathan Choe wrote, "In fact, none of the marchers would talk to me on the record because they “didn’t trust the mainstream media.” So I just started following the march route...In a Tweet recapping the day, I decided to create a photo montage with natural sound from the march (in TV news this is what’s called a “NAT Pkg”). One of my videos picked up music blasting from a speaker strapped over the shoulder of one of the protesters. I could not make out the words and had never heard this song in my life. You could also hear car horns and the footsteps of marchers as I weaved in and out of the crowd. I laid some photos over this natural sound from the video and hit send."

"I didn't make a propaganda slide show on purpose, I'm just incompetent" isn't much of a defense, nor does it pass the smell test. This self-serving crap is just after the fact ass-covering from the guy who got caught red handed.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Both versions cannot be true

"I didn't make a propaganda slide show on purpose, I'm just incompetent" isn't much of a defense, nor does it pass the smell test. This self-serving crap is just after the fact ass-covering from the guy who got caught red handed.

Either he recorded the sounds of the march, as he said, or he overlaid the track later, as Rich Smith wrote at The Stranger. One of them spoke falsely; there is no middle ground. If it is Mr. Smith who spread false information, should he be fired?

 

[TurkeysGhost]

Either he recorded the sounds of the march, as he said, or he overlaid the track later, as Rich Smith wrote at The Stranger. One of them spoke falsely; there is no middle ground. If it is Mr. Smith who spread false information, should he be fired?

Depends on how he wrote the article. I'm guessing that Smith, unlike Choe, ran this article by an editor before blasting it out to the public, giving the publication a chance to decide whether it met their standards and was something they were willing to stake their reputation on.

Choe's fascist sizzle reel would likely never seen the light of day if he had submitted it for editorial review.

ETA: I don't really see the difference in your question. Choe posted a slide show of pictures. Whether he recorded these guys singing their white ethnostate anthem in person on the scene or pulled it from a different source, he decided that this song was the best backing for the puff piece about the fascist street gang. This is trash journalism no matter how you slice it.

 

[Matthew Best]

Man, crazy world we live in where going on a profanity laced flame war with the intended audience of your books puts you in hot water with an organization meant to appeal to that audience. What really happened here is this lady acted like a gigantic jackass, and now nobody wants to experience the second-hand embarrassment of publicly associating with her.

Raving like a lunatic on Twitter is bad for your career, news at 11. Getting into vitriolic flame wars with people who criticize your work (or someone else's work, in this case) is unhinged behavior.

Lol just like the NYTimes to run another "cancel culture" shock piece without even bothering to actually look into the allegedly bad behavior. Did she or did she not delete inflammatory statements? Probably a factual question a journalist could answer if they cared to find out.

I don't know, did she or did she not delete inflammatory statements? What were those statements?

 

[Stout]

This case being covered in the New York Times has the same dynamic as the case I mentioned in Post 1657. Someone on social media decides that something is 'harmful' without actually having interacted with the story (e.g. based on rumour.) and launches a campaign to get the item banned so that it cannot 'harm' whoever the person launched the campaign believes they are protecting.

What kind of world are we living in when you can't even write a misandrist feminist fantasy/erotica novel where predatory lesbians have an endless smorgasbord of "straight" women to hit on because there's no men around?

Just for fun. Here's a novel by an author who was unimpressed after reading The Men.

Gretchen Felker-Martin's Manhunt, an explosive post-apocalyptic novel that follows trans women and men on a grotesque journey of survival.

Beth and Fran spend their days traveling the ravaged New England coast, hunting feral men and harvesting their organs in a gruesome effort to ensure they'll never face the same fate.

Robbie lives by his gun and one hard-learned motto: other people aren't safe.

After a brutal accident entwines the three of them, this found family of survivors must navigate murderous TERFs, a sociopathic billionaire bunker brat, and awkward relationship dynamics―all while outrunning packs of feral men, and their own demons.

Manhunt is a timely, powerful response to every gender-based apocalypse story that failed to consider the existence of transgender and non-binary people, from a powerful new voice in horror.

SJW gore porn, who'd a thunk it?

 

[EaglePuncher]

What kind of world are we living in when you can't even write a misandrist feminist fantasy/erotica novel where predatory lesbians have an endless smorgasbord of "straight" women to hit on because there's no men around?

Just for fun. Here's a novel by an author who was unimpressed after reading The Men.



SJW gore porn, who'd a thunk it?

Where is the quoted text from? Can't see it in your link.

Also: SJWs, 'conservatives' worst enemy

 

[Stout]

Where is the quoted text from? Can't see it in your link.

Also: SJWs, 'conservatives' worst enemy

The text is right there in the middle of the screen, you'll need to click on "more" to see all of it.

SJW can be anybody's enemy. We've seen lots of progressive on progressive action ITT.

 

[Dr. Keith]

One of my oak trees died over the winter. Cancel culture strikes again.

 

[EaglePuncher]

The text is right there in the middle of the screen, you'll need to click on "more" to see all of it.

SJW can be anybody's enemy. We've seen lots of progressive on progressive action ITT.

Nope, not there. As usual, you are lying...

 

[TurkeysGhost]

What kind of world are we living in when you can't even write a misandrist feminist fantasy/erotica novel where predatory lesbians have an endless smorgasbord of "straight" women to hit on because there's no men around?

Just for fun. Here's a novel by an author who was unimpressed after reading The Men.



SJW gore porn, who'd a thunk it?

It's YA fiction, none of it is very good.