Cont: Brexit: Now What? Part 6. Pick up sticks...

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

If May loses then Tories already saying that Art 50 will need to be extended. Of course all EU27 would have to agree to that... could you imagine Boris having to go begging for more time?

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

Also think the timing of this leadership election is interesting. Not prepared to wait until she came back from her round of talks to see if they could get changes to the deal... the ERG are engineering, or at least attempting to engineer, a no-deal Brexit for their own ends.

Time will be burned going through this nonsense. Meanwhile Labour sit and do nothing.

 

[Dave Rogers]

If May loses then Tories already saying that Art 50 will need to be extended. Of course all EU27 would have to agree to that...

...unless we decide to extend it for exactly two years.

Dave

 

[Darat]

...unless we decide to extend it for exactly two years.

Dave

I can imagine the letter.


Dear EU

We've changed our mind we aren't leaving.

Yours faithlessly and unsincerely

The UK



PTO



Dear EU

We are leaving.

Up yours, nah, nah!

Yours

Eton College

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

...unless we decide to extend it for exactly two years.

Dave

Even better if BoJo's first act as PM is to withdraw Article 50 haha.

Given the ECJ ruling I can see the EU having to amend the agreement at some point to either clarify that the decision is irrevocable or that if an Art 50 declaration is revoked then another cannot be submitted for 5 years. Or something like that anyway.

 

[Craig B]

Presumably by people who have never come within a thousand miles of Skibereen....

The surviving population of Skibbereen (and elsewhere in Ireland) were the ones who travelled these thousand intervening miles, harbouring thoughts of revenge on the way.

 

[McHrozni]

Tory resentment of Irish power within EU

"The Irish really should know their place," one said

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-46528952?__twitter_impression=true

Aside from offensive, the statement is also ironic: the Irish do know their place and are using it to their full advantage.

It's almost as if, you know, the EU benefits its members.

Radical, huh?

McHrozni

 

[Dave Rogers]

Even better if BoJo's first act as PM is to withdraw Article 50 haha.

A few weeks ago, that would have been a joke. Now, it almost seems inevitable.

Dave

 

[3point14]

Can anyone give me a brief update on the democratic deficit?

 

[ponderingturtle]

If May loses then Tories already saying that Art 50 will need to be extended. Of course all EU27 would have to agree to that... could you imagine Boris having to go begging for more time?

I thought he quit again, has he been put back in again?

At least in the US once someone is out of our current administration they are not going to be back in later.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

I thought he quit again, has he been put back in again?

At least in the US once someone is out of our current administration they are not going to be back in later.

I imagine he would be frontrunner for PM if TM loses the VONC. If he fancies it.

Of course it's fairly normal for ministers to be sacked and reinstated in other roles especially if the PM changes. Amber Rudd made a comeback in a matter of weeks.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

I thought he quit again, has he been put back in again?

At least in the US once someone is out of our current administration they are not going to be back in later.

He quit as Foriegn Secretary but he is still an MP and member of the Conservative Party. Our Cabinet is drawn from MPs (and to a lesser extent Lords). The advantage of this is it means that the Great Offices of State can't be gifted to one's business buddies, the disadvantage is that I have to sadly admit that my fellow citizens did actually vote for the toussel haired buffoon.

Any Minister from the ruling party or coalition can be chosen as Prime Minister, there's a line of succession as to who takes over in an emergency, but that would be temporary and when a PM steps down the floor is open to anyone who wants to throw their hat into the ring, it's not limited to members of the Cabinet. In theory Members of the House of Lords could also be chosen but that would be against the convention established over the last century or so.

 

[Belz...]

Absolutely does if you are referencing precedent.

The whole point of the EU is that you have multiple independent entities in a single bloc. It's on a scale that is unknown anywhere else. That's why you need a Parliament.

I don't see how that follows. What you need is some sort of international organisation that can do that. It doesn't need to be a parliament. That's why I said it doesn't change my general point.

That doesn't make it a single country.

I didn't say it did. I'm saying that the ever-closer union thing seems to be pointing that way eventually. I think the people involved would like it sooner than later, but I'm not sure the actual citizens would.

 

[Belz...]

Can anyone give me a brief update on the democratic deficit?

Start here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_deficit_in_the_European_Union

Especially, for me, the role of the EC.

 

[Guybrush Threepwood]

Start here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_deficit_in_the_European_Union

Especially, for me, the role of the EC.

Did you hear a rush of air above your head when you posted that?

 

[3point14]

Did you hear a rush of air above your head when you posted that?

My thanks. So glad someone got it.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

I don't see how that follows. What you need is some sort of international organisation that can do that. It doesn't need to be a parliament. That's why I said it doesn't change my general point.

You would prefer an unelected shady cabal of bureaucrats to a Parliament?

I didn't say it did. I'm saying that the ever-closer union thing seems to be pointing that way eventually. I think the people involved would like it sooner than later, but I'm not sure the actual citizens would.

Which of the EU27 do you think will be first to give up it's sovereignty in its entirety in order to facilitate the EU becoming a single country?

 

[Belz...]

Did you hear a rush of air above your head when you posted that?

Er... no actually. What'd I miss?

You would prefer an unelected shady cabal of bureaucrats to a Parliament?

Well, leaving aside the false dichotomy there, I can't say that I'd prefer it, but the point is that a parliament is not needed.

Which of the EU27 do you think will be first to give up it's sovereignty in its entirety in order to facilitate the EU becoming a single country?

I guess the idea is that they all do it together.

 

[3point14]

Er... no actually. What'd I miss?

The UK is currently indulging in another vote to see who gets to lead the country.

The people who called for the vote wrote to the head of the 1922 committee, a Toy party insider group that's rather shadowy and steers the Troy party without any input from the electorate.

The vote to decide who is in charge of the UK will only be open to Tory party MPs.

Given that the common refrain from those in favour of brexit is that being in Europe reduces the input of the electorate on the running of the country, I find the current situation to be sickeningly ironic

Add into that that this is the second time since the public actually got a say that the Tories alone are voting for the leader of the country but, oddly, a second vote for the people to decide on brexit is somehow not democratic and the irony is almost an emetic.

 

[angrysoba]

The UK is currently indulging in another vote to see who gets to lead the country.

The people who called for the vote wrote to the head of the 1922 committee, a Toy party insider group that's rather shadowy and steers the Troy party without any input from the electorate.

The vote to decide who is in charge of the UK will only be open to Tory party MPs.

Given that the common refrain from those in favour of brexit is that being in Europe reduces the input of the electorate on the running of the country, I find the current situation to be sickeningly ironic

Add into that that this is the second time since the public actually got a say that the Tory's alone are voting for the leader of the country but, oddly, a second vote for the people to decide on brexit is somehow not democratic and the irony is almost an emetic.

As you asked the question, how does it stack up against the legislative and executive bodies of the EU?

The Tory Party won* the previous election and therefore got to form a government. As Tory MPs are elected then it makes sense that they also get to elect their leader. Maybe that is even more in keeping with representative democracy that only MPs can do this rather than those who pay membership fees to parties. Other parliamentary systems have similar conventions such as the Irish parliament as the party elected Leo Varadkar PM.

* they got the most seats if not a majority.