Bjarne on: Dark Energy, only an illusion.

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Right
I have asked myself the same question.
I have also talked to a building engineer some time ago.
He said; that many places in Denmark the underground is not strong, and require very strong foundation.
He was not sure about Frederiksberg, but is could easy be 5 to 7 meter deep concrete foundation under the carrying construction parts.
All the measurements at ground floor have been done the exact same place, 20 cm from a wall.
If that wall have a heavy concrete block below, it is not so strange we measure stronger gravity here.
There are not heavy building nearby.

5-7 meters?? My friend, most of Copenhagen is built on old marshes. Pilotation depths of 20-30 meters is quite common. Just another example of the importance of doing your homework.

And what do you mean by 'no heavy buildings nearby'? What do you call the shopping arcade at the foot of the building? Have you investigated if there is a basement? Underground parking?

Again: As long as you cannot establish the exact baseline gravity directly under the building, you cannot position its gravity curve in the coordinate system, and you cannot know where (or if) it crosses zero.

Hans
 
Right
I have asked myself the same question.
....
This sounds like I was wrong when I said
The calculations posted seem to be all through the center of the building.
But the measurements are from a stairwell on the side of the building. That is in fact the reason why Bjarne rejects the results as a test of his "central gravity" idea. For some reason he thinks that the same reason does not invalidate the results as a test of Newtonian gravity.
and you now think that this (and other reasons) invalidate the results as a test for any theory.
 
The calculations posted seem to be all through the center of the building.
But the measurements are from a stairwell on the side of the building. That is in fact the reason why Bjarne rejects the results as a test of his "central gravity" idea. For some reason he thinks that the same reason does not invalidate the results as a test of Newtonian gravity.

1.) Our understanding of gravity deep inside a mass, have never been tested before now. - So far it have only been math + creeds.
2.) We are waiting for the report of the measurement central in the building.
The new report does not shows much difference except roughly 25 microgal stronger ADG on the whole line, ( and the "bumps" are a little deeper, since we did only measure with one gravimeter and there was sometimes some "traffic" around us.

I am now very serious planning also measuring inside the great pyramid Cheops.

The weight is 6.000.000.000 KG
DOMUS VISTA is only 35.000.000 Kg (171 times less) .
This mass is almost homogeneous (big advantages)
There are 2 inner central places (near the center) interesting to measure.
We can measure several places around the pyramid.
And there is a chamber deep under the pyramid as well.
And I hope we can measure on the top of it as well. – BUT is it allowed to climb up that pyramid?

http://www.edupics.com/cheops-pyramid-in-giza-t6991.jpg

Any Suggestions of any kind are welcome

For example other better targets
Who can do the measurement in Egypt
Etc..
 
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This mass is almost homogeneous (big advantages)
No it is not. The outer casing consists of blocks of stone, inside it is filled with rubble of various sizes. The various rooms and galleries are lined with more blocks etc. It is not homogenous.
 
1.) Our understanding of gravity deep inside a mass, have never been tested before now. - So far it have only been math + creeds.

No, Bjarne, it has been done before. Early in this exchage, I thin half a year ago, I referred you to a site where you could find a skeleton protocol for measuring the gravity of a building. That was a US college homepage, because it was used as a college assignment. It has probably been done hundreds of times before. And, of course, there was the deep-bore measurement, which we told you about, but which you insisted on ignoring.

You are not breaking new ground at all, you are just wading in the footsteps of others, producing sloppy data, which you don't know how to use.

2.) We are waiting for the report of the measurement central in the building.
The new report does not shows much difference except roughly 25 microgal stronger ADG on the whole line, ( and the "bumps" are a little deeper, since we did only measure with one gravimeter and there was sometimes some "traffic" around us.

And it will show exctly the same as the present data, because you still miss a baseline measurement.

I am now very serious planning also measuring inside the great pyramid Cheops.

Has been done, already.

http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/pyramidchambers.htm

They used it to try to discover unknown chambers. You may think that this is irrelevant, but since they had to use the convnetional law of gravity for their calculations (them being hardly enlightened on the special Bjarne version), they would have found very strange results, had the conventional law been faulty.

So, I suggest you save your time and money.

Hans
 
No it is not. The outer casing consists of blocks of stone, inside it is filled with rubble of various sizes. The various rooms and galleries are lined with more blocks etc. It is not homogenous.

Anyway it is at least heavy and interesting object to measure.
Also such object must show much larger ADG near and in the physical center than expected, - according to the prevailing speculation.
 
No, Bjarne, it has been done before. Early in this exchage, I thin half a year ago, I referred you to a site where you could find a skeleton protocol for measuring the gravity of a building. That was a US college homepage, because it was used as a college assignment.
I have never "got" such message.
Did they do exact systematically central measurement to test the existing speculation or only random measurements for fun?
Where are your source?
How big was the building?

It has probably been done hundreds of times before.
The systematic way it is done is important.
What I mean; - systematical test of inner central gravity (of a mass), have probably never been done before.
Nowhere people do such measurement for fun. - Not today, - not last year - and not 10 years ago, and not tomorrow.
It is pretty expensive. Before you measure you'll have a reason with doing that.

My reason to do this is very clear.
I don't believe anyone ever seriously have doubted the old speculation, and declare open war to it.
Hence also not that there ever have been a wish to test the old speculation.

Furthermore first after gravimeter devices have been more sophisticated (the last decade) (decades?) - It really makes sense to do it.

And, of course, there was the deep-bore measurement, which we told you about, but which you insisted on ignoring.
I still chose to ignore that, because inside the earth you cannot observe where ADG contribution comes from, but only guessing and accused the inner core for what you want.
Once in the eighties there was some strange measurement result in a mine in Australia.
That had leads to a search for a fight force, in many mines, and different places.
A lot of drilling where necessary to determinate the underground contents, and still there was several uncertainties where unexpected measurements could be caused by unknown contents nearby or deeper beneath.
Even in the ice core measurements you can invent mountains or rocks beneath that maybe do or do not exist, or as mentioned, - the inner core doesn’t answer back if you accuse that for having a weight or size, - that you want it to.

You are not breaking new ground at all, you are just wading in the footsteps of others, producing sloppy data, which you don't know how to use.
Reality has spoken; If you are clever, - drop that unsound speculation now.
Next time reality speaks, it will be with a bulldozer technique.
You can’t save the dying (in fact already dead) thesis, - it is already too late.
 
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I have never "got" such message.

Bjarne, you never 'get' any messages.

Next time reality speaks, it will be with a bulldozer technique.
You can’t save the dying (in fact already dead) thesis, - it is already too late.

You are amusing. And a bit boring. Have a nice trip to Egypt. :p

Hans
 
Bjarne, you never 'get' any messages.



You are amusing. And a bit boring. Have a nice trip to Egypt. :p

Hans

Very boring now,it was funny to see Bjarne make an ass of himself at first but now it's time to let the thread die and hang around till our boy wonder gets his Nobel prize.
 
Very boring now, it was funny to see Bjarne make an ass of himself at first but now it's time to let the thread die and hang around till our boy wonder gets his Nobel prize.
I do not let anything die

But I think we have been it all through so far.

It takes times to arrange ADG measurement.

But you too or you local University can easy insure you self that the old thesis in dead.
For example just be measuring on the top of a big harbor oil tank, - full and empty.
In this way you can fast determinate that; - because of the gravitational center is at ground level (not at the oil tank physical center), you'll only get 25 % of the expected ADG when the oil tank is full.

(I am not 100% sure, whether it is 25% or 50%
Maybe you will get 50% of the expected result, because also the underground under the oil tank also contributes with mass, to a common gravity center.)

It is so simple (now) to continue to reject the prevailing speculation.

I will keep attacking that crap until the end, and I really hope that others too will understand that time have come to demand authorities also to begin to KNOW what they talk about, when they teach innocent student , - for ensample the big matter bluff. And hence demands that measurement takes place.

If we can spend 10.000.000.000 USD on higgs crap, - I believe a local University also can spend 500 USD on simple measurements.

----
 
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Why bother? If you're too lazy to do the math to prove yourself right, why do you want universities to spend money to prove what they already know?

You are wrong.
 
Why bother? If you're too lazy to do the math to prove yourself right, why do you want universities to spend money to prove what they already know?

You are wrong.
Bjarne is not too lazy to do the math ... Well, he is that, too,.... but he is also unable to do it.

Yes, time to ignore this drama queen.

Hans
 
Why bother? If you're too lazy to do the math to prove yourself right, why do you want universities to spend money to prove what they already know?
I do not underestimate math. But it can only reflect your understanding. – First understand, then math.
This thread is one of many examples that show that objective measurements are more important than speculation and speculation based math.
In that building there is several aspects to take into consideration.

For example:
I suppose there also is an upwards pull, because of the floors above the measurement point, are independent gravity fields
Furthermore mass beneath the building is also involved to trap central space.

Let see when temperatures again drops, if there is a mathematical answer to that parts.

On all circumstances the answer is either that ADG is 75% weaker as expected on the top of a full oil tank or 50 % weaker.

What I believe/calculate now, is not decisive. – But if you want to know: - I believe ADG is 75% weaker on the top of a full oil tank, - because of the mass beneath the oil tank even if it contributes to trap central space, it does not add any new mass.
Furthermore a ADG drop of 75% is already what DOMUS VISTA shows, but again here we also have a upward pull, due to independent concrete floors.
 
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If we assume that the building's weight was the same as the Cheops Pyramid (6.000.000.000 Kg) and still height about 100 meters, the ADG of the building would be 4 mgal.
The math to use to calculate the negative ADG towards ground floor, inside the Earth, is simple: - ADG of the building /r2
This mean if the building ADG is 4 mgal (calculated based on the radius used in the new theory) - then the negative ADG towards the ground floor would only be 1 Gal , only 2 meter under the building , and 0.25 mgal 4 meter under that building.
So the negative ADG decrease is expected to be neutralized very fast.

Gdecrease.jpg


This is the math to use under an object.
 
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1.) Our understanding of gravity deep inside a mass, have never been tested before now. - So far it have only been math + creeds.
.
So are you
  1. A liar?
  2. Unable to read?
  3. Unable to read and understand?
  4. Or just deluded?
Our understanding of gravity deep inside a mass been tested before now. So far it have only been experimental evidence that Newton was correct.

One more time:
It has been experimentally shown that the force of gravity acts as expected (Test of Newton's inverse-square law in the Greenland ice cap) as Bjarne was told in October 2009 in another thread (The force of gravity is not constant within a sphere).
​
But given that you have been ignoring this for month I expect you to ignore it yet again.

 
So are you
  1. A liar?
  2. Unable to read?
  3. Unable to read and understand?
  4. Or just deluded?
Our understanding of gravity deep inside a mass been tested before now. So far it has only been experimental evidence that Newton was correct.

One more time:
It has been experimentally shown that the force of gravity acts as expected (Test of Newton's inverse-square law in the Greenland ice cap) as Bjarne was told in October 2009 in another thread (The force of gravity is not constant within a sphere).
​
But given that you have been ignoring this for month I expect you to ignore it yet again.


The Greenland ice cap measurement is NOT central gravity measurements.

I have mentioned this 117 times.

Even the most stupid cows on the planet know that nobody have EVER measured ADG in the center of the Earth.

But I guess it all have to do with your deluded understanding of what a gal is, proven that you have not the slightest idea what you talk about.

If you do not understand what I mean, check the examples below:

1.
Bjarne
The real ADG values due to the buildings own gravity is
ONLY between -0.025 MicroGal[/COLOR]
The real ADG values due to the buildings own gravity (measurements minus free air gradient) is ONLY between -0.562 and 1.345 MicroGal
Source > http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6081872&postcount=1133

2.
Doing the math right and to the correct decimal places:
35.000.000 * 6.67E-11 /50^2 = 0.0000009338 m/s
Or……………………………………………………….. 0.9338 microGal
Or……………………………………………………….. 0.009338 milliGal
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6086325&postcount=1162

3.
1 Gal = 0.01 m/s²
I got the decimal place wrong (see how a university education teaches you to acknowledge mistakes).
Source > http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6086388&postcount=1167

A propo
Is it possible to get the last 17 years University fees back?

You then could pay me a little part of that and I could learn you more of what gal is and what central gravity is , - and also what central gravity not is.

Lesson 1
This will be about that it is difference between central and superficial gravity.
For example central gravity on the top of the cows head, or ears is only superficial but the inside the stomach is central gravity of the cow.

Lesson 2
Will be about that it is properly never someone that has measured central gravity inside the cows stomach.

Lesson 3
Will be about that if the cow by a mistake have eaten a stone, you don't know how big it is before you have seen it.
You cannot measured it so long you don't know what gravity really is, - or what central gravity is, - or what 1 gal is. - Exactly the same is the case with the inner core of the Earth.

Our understanding of gravity deep insidea mass been have NEVER been tested before now.

So far understanding of iinner central gravity is only based on; math and creeds.

Boreholes measurement in the ice cap is NOTtest of the Earth central gravity. - But only test of creeds, and hence test of how heavy we belive the inner core is.

To learn you this I will or course only repeats it all at least 500 times, and it will only cost you total 25 USD.

Is RC are you in fact :

  • A liar?
  • Unable to read?
  • Unable to read and understand?
  • Or just deluded?

doglaugh.gif
 
If science can't get it right about gravity, I wish he would explain how GPS works so well.

Paul

:) :) :)
 
The Greenland ice cap measurement is NOT central gravity measurements.

I have mentioned this 117 times.
That is obviously right. The Earth (on case you have not noticed) is not a building or a concrete drum or an Egyptian pyramid or whatever experiment you are going to mess up again :jaw-dropp.

This is referring to your debunked fantasy that the force of gravity is constant inside a body. This is obviously false as I have metioned 118 times.
  1. The proper derivation of the force using the proper mathematics shows that the force varies as the radius. It is zero as you would expect at the center where all of the forces balance.
  2. The forces balance at the center of the sphere balance out so the force has to be zero. His idea could have the force as constant for any radius within the sphere. But if it is zero and constant at the core then it must be zero just below the surface and then suddenly increase to the proper value at the surface of a sphere, e.g. giving an acceleration of 9.8 m/s^2 for the Earth.
    • Discontinuities are not favored by nature.
    • Miners under the Earth do not suddenly become weightless.
    • Water is not weightless under the ocean surface.
    • Submariners do not float in midair.
    • Tourists descending into the Grand Canyon do not float in midair.
  3. It has been experimentally shown that the force of gravity acts as expected (Test of Newton's inverse-square law in the Greenland ice cap) as Bjarne was told in October 2009 in another thread (The force of gravity is not constant within a sphere).
 
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