Bigfoot - The Patterson-Gimlin Film

[LTC8K6]

They don't appear to be going far enough from camp to need to stay overnight. They knew they were going back to Bluff Creek that day, where they'd been before, and it was not far from their camp.

If you are going within easy riding distance of your camp, why prepare to spend the night? You can just ride back into camp, like you did to get the casting materials.

After that ride back and forth to camp for plaster, they still had plenty of daylight, right? So how far away could they have been?

 

[Skeptical Greg]

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/interviews/john.htm

Gimlin: The day we got the film footage, I left early in the morning and Roger slept in. I just rode out and around, I always got up early and so I rode on out. My horse loosened a shoe and I came back in to tack the shoe on tighter. About 10:00, mid morning or so, I sat around there for a little while, because Roger was gone when I got back. Supposedly he had gone down the creek there, ..ah Bluff Creek there and after awhile he came back and asked what area I had covered that morning? I told him and he says why don’t we ride up into this area we had ridden into before, a desolate type area down a couple of canyons, there’s a creek running through it. So we went ahead and fixed lunch and he said let’s get our gear together so when we ride out we can stay if we have to and stay a little bit later into the night if we need to. We packed up the pack horse and it was about mid day, perhaps a little bit after noon time when we went around this bend in the creek bed. There was a fallen tree and as we came around it there was this creature standing by the creek. That’s when everything started happening. The horses started jumping around, raising the devil and spooking from this creature. Roger, well his horse was rearing up and jumping around. . .he slid off him, got his camera out of the saddle bags and started trying to get pictures of this creature as it was walking away.

I don't find the pack horse out of line with being prepared to stay out a while, if the found themselves far from base camp after dark..

I do find no casting casting gear out of line.. It's what they were there for..

 

[William Parcher]

So, what was the pack horse for? It obviously wasn't carrying casting supplies.

How do you know they didn't carry casting supplies everywhere with them? Is it because Gimlin said they had to return to the truck to get the plaster after the Patty encounter? How can we know if that statement is true anyway?

If P&G did hoax the trackway, it would have been odd to leave the plaster behind when they decided to do it. Why start making hoaxed footprints if you don't have the plaster on hand?

Could some of these horseback scenes have been filmed in Yakima or elsewhere in Washington, before the trip to Bluff Creek?

 

[LTC8K6]

I just find the pack horse odd. Two guys on horseback should not need a pack horse to film scenery and camp out overnight. The only extra gear they supposedly had with them was the movie camera and an extra roll of film, and possibly a still camera. Rifles are normal and are in scabbards on your own horse.

Assuming they really did not have casting materials with them, then they knew they would have to return to camp if they came upon any tracks they wanted to cast.

Then again, what does a guy who is going to hoax a film at Bluff Creek need a pack horse for???

 

[LTC8K6]

What's unbelievable is that you have all of this telephoning going on about the film and the events at Bluff Creek to just about every bigtime footer in the area, and not one of them goes out to the site of the filming to see it and document it for themselves.

Not one.

On Sunday, Dahinden, McClarin, and Green see the film. They still don't go out to the site, though.

I have to believe that they wanted to go out to the site, but were not able to for some reason, such as Patterson wouldn't tell them the location.

I cannot believe they weren't chomping at the bit to get out there.

 

[LTC8K6]

By October 25th, they have gone to the trouble of setting up a screening in B.C. at the university, but no one has bothered to look at the site.

 

[William Parcher]

Bob Titmus went to Bluff Creek after seeing the screening at UBC. Does he count? Laverty may have heard or read about it locally before he found the tracks.

 

[LTC8K6]

Bob Titmus went to Bluff Creek after seeing the screening at UBC. Does he count?

No. He acted normally. Had he seen the film at DeAtley's on Sunday, I'm sure he'd have been up there on Monday, like the rest should have been.

From Sanderson. Has anyone seen this Kunsler drawing of Patty?

Roger Patterson was at one time employed in show business, and Bob Gimlin was not available when a film unit went to make a documentary of this affair, and the creature in the film does look exactly like a drawing by Mr. Martin Kunsler for an article published by Sports Afield in 1960

 

[William Parcher]

The pack horse may have been used mostly as a prop for Roger's Bigfoot search "documentary". He may have thought it gave the footage a look of realism. The guys are out looking for Bigfoot and need a pack horse because they are fully equipped for anything anywhere anytime. Roger at least wants it to look that way in his documentary. It was the same thing when he put a wig on Gimlin. Create a dramatic but false world around your film.

I noticed something else. When we first see P&G and the pack horse - the black pack horse carries bulky saddlebags. In the next scene - a white pack horse is carrying large wooden boxes. All of a sudden we get a white horse that isn't in the first scene.

We now have to account for at least 4 horses and 3 men.

Look

 

[Skeptical Greg]

I have said it over and over..
This is all about Patterson's ( Patterson the would-be producer /director ) documentary ..
He made a costume for the documentary, shot the footage ( maybe early September ), had a look at it with 1967 projection technology, decided to float it as a real encounter and the rest is history ...

Gimlin made a decision to go along, and never decided on the right time to come clean..
Now it's too late .. ( in his mind ) ..
If there was a million dollars on the table, the story might be different.
Problem is, no one with a million dollars cares...

Patty Patterson knows the truth. She is not ambitious and wants to be left alone. At the least, no offer has been big enough ..

That's my rough take on it ...

 

[Correa Neto]

MOTS, I'm going to go ahead and be the guy that barks USE THE SEARCH FEATURE at you. Usually I'm the guy that falls over bringing you a link but I'm still crippled by upgrade weirdness.

Tell you what, I'll meet you half way. For a good start and an easy read with both WP and Correa weighing in on the subject, click that search feature and look for the thread titled 'flores man... please be real'.

Here's your starter question. Do you think Homo floresiensis feet and purported orang pendek prints are a match?

("Inbreeding!" I hear the hairy homo apologists say.)

Got one too many beer on my bloodstream right now, maybe that's why I can't remember that thread...

Got one too many beer on my bloodstream right now, maybe that's why I'm feeling too lazy to use the search function, LOL...

Got one too many beer on my bloodstream right now, maybe that's why I fail to see anything new, but despite of this, carry on...

 

[Correa Neto]

Did someone say 'little bigfoot'?
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_1970546f939c510bf4.jpg[/qimg]

Four toes?

 

[tube]

I've been advised of a very interesting website by an individual deep within my secret cabal of cryptid informants. Thus, while I would like to take credit for impressive Google-fu in all matters Crypto, I cannot.

http://www.pulpanddagger.com/canuck/Kong_mask.html

Two photos from the site show the "undersuit" that Rick Baker is wearing:

The most interesting part for me is that professional ape costumers recognise the limitations of the cheap and baggy ape-suit, which they derisively call a "boo suit", and work hard to create the illusion of musculature:

"Far from being a simple zippered boo-suit, the costume invented for Kong '76 (actually four costumes were used) realistically depicted the appropriate musculature beneath the fur through a special undersuit with silicone filled muscles."

 

[mangler]

LTC8K6,

I think Sanderson means Kunstler.


m

 

[tube]

I recognise the issue has been brought up before, by Correa Neto I believe, but I though I would revisit it because of what I've found recently. Here is a skeletal reconstruction of "Patty" by Reuben Steinforf, of 5'7" Patty fame:

http://www.bigfootforums.com/index.php?showtopic=14316&mode=threaded

Over on Metafilter, a front page post came up recently that referenced the work of Hyungkoo Lee's cartoon character skeletons:

http://www.metafilter.com/65005/Hyungkoo-Lees-skeletons-of-cartoon-characters

Lee is an outstanding sculptor, and frankly puts Steindorf in the dust artistically:

Other artists besides Lee and Steindorf have had the same idea, and frankly my favorite is a much less sublime image:

 

[manofthesea]

MOTS, Huh?
USE THE SEARCH FEATURE The what?

Here's your starter question. Do you think Homo floresiensis feet and purported orang pendek prints are a match? Orange what?

)

But really, thanks.

The film discussion is deep. The depth of new arguments concerning a 40 year old film is incredible.

 

[Drewbot]

This is a sweet breakdown of the padding BOBBY H wore that day in Willow Creek.
http://www.bermuda-triangle.org/html/unmasked.html

 

[LTC8K6]

I noticed something else. When we first see P&G and the pack horse - the black pack horse carries bulky saddlebags. In the next scene - a white pack horse is carrying large wooden boxes. All of a sudden we get a white horse that isn't in the first scene.

Yep. The more we study, the more we see. Bob only brought 3 horses, though...

 

[William Parcher]

This is a sweet breakdown of the padding BOBBY H wore that day in Willow Creek.
http://www.bermuda-triangle.org/html/unmasked.html

I disagree. I saw that article previously and was unimpressed. I agree with the author that the padded suit reveals itself in a few ways, but his ability to clearly explain things is poor. It needs severe editing. For one thing, the arrow that is supposed to indicate a nipple is located in the wrong place.

Additionally, the author keeps talking about a padded bodysuit underneath a costume skin. That may have been used, but if so it would rule out the testimony of Bob Heironimus. He didn't put on a bodysuit before putting on the costume itself.

 

[Drewbot]

You're right, the body suit angle does not make sense.
*Some good points are the hair on the chest and the folded padding/fur on the back of the arms and tops of the thighs.