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[Sword_Of_Truth]

Since it has almost been 9 years since 9/11, there are still a lot of misconceptions floating around about fires and firefighting. So to help clarify and answer any questions people may have, I started this thread.


I also ask that any other posters with firefighting experience to join in as well.

Has there ever been a Women Firefighters calendar?

If so, was it any good?

 

[NYCEMT86]

Has there ever been a Women Firefighters calendar?

If so, was it any good?

Check your inbox

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Check your inbox

Dude.. You have won the internet.

The rest of y'all can pack up and go home.

 

[RedIbis]

Long enough and hot enough. I'll take your unsubstantiated word that the fire was on the NE corner. My recollection is that most of the action happened on the SW corner.

You might want to check your recollection.

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Check your inbox

(*Ahem*) Need a CC: on that, please.

 

[ElMondoHummus]

You cannot trust these firefighters. Richard Gage has already called the head of the firefighting operations a liar and wants him subpeona'd. Richard knows they could have fought WTC 7 and put it out.

There is just so much evidence against the firefighters. There is the group that knew that WTC 7 was going to come down because they were going to "pull it". And then many of them lied saying there was fires at every level on WTC 7, just because there was smoke coming out at every level.

As Bill says, although they had lost hundreds of colleagues, if they were really brave the firemen could have fought the multiple level WTC7 fires with fire extinguishers. That way they could have saved the building, to enable it to be demolished a few years later, like Deutche Bank.

However I do believe the testimony from the hundreds of firefighters that reported explosions, since it is part of our evidence proving CD. But I am amazed that hardly any of them has signed the Firefighters for 9/11 Truth Petition, when they actually heard the explosions. ! You can't trust them.

And I don't know what I think of the fireman who reached the fires in the towers and looked at the underside and said there are only two pockets of fire here. Everyone knows heat rises and I am sure he would have had a different opinion if he had got on top of the fire.

And finally the firefighters were all over the debris pile and would have seen the evidence of explosives during the clear up. They must be in on it.!

Exactly Bill. I guess that is why engineers don't design tall buildings for plane impact. Because planes are made of thin aluminum and can't damage hard steel.

Reader's note: I'm not sure that they are trying to pull the wool over your eyes. I think these people are just stupid.

Wow. This is parody. I'm still undecided about whether it's good or bad parody, but it's parody.

 

[Thunder]

Check your inbox

can i see tooo????

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Dude.. You have won the internet.

The rest of y'all can pack up and go home.

SoT is right: You just won the internet!

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Regarding impact damage

" You mean the damage to the Twin Towers ? How much real damage can a plane weighing one three-hundreth of one percent the weight of the building do ?"

a hell of a lot. to the area impacted?

a hell of a lot. it appears to have sheared the majority of the outer beams on the side of impact. and damaged/destroyed who knows how many interior core beams.

About as much damage as a 203 grain soft tip 7.62X54R bullet will do to a 500+pound moose's head.

It's not just a matter of weight and strength of the material, but the speed, thus the energy available when it impacts the target.

take the led point of a bullet, and push it against a wall, and it aint gonna do much damage.

move it at 2,000 ft. per second, and you have a whole different outcome.

but of course, Truthers fail to understand this.

or they make believe, they don't understand this.

i suggest the latter.

Please explain bullets.

Ok, take that bullet, flatten it out, fire it at something at 200 feet per second, and it will slice shatever it is.

Wanna try again??


LOOK AT THOSE GOALPOSTS GO!!! WOOT!!

You know, folks, we don't really have to guess at this. NCSTAR 1-2, chapters 7 and 8 lays it out for us. It discusses not only exterior and core column damage, but goes into some detail regarding the calculated damage to the floor trusses and floor pans.

 

[NYCEMT86]

How long do you suspect the fire burned in the northeast corner of WTC7 to generate the temperatures that initiated the collapse?

I am not ignoring this question. I am reviewing the NIST WTC 7 report again right now, so please hang on.

 

[RedIbis]

I am not ignoring this question. I am reviewing the NIST WTC 7 report again right now, so please hang on.

Take your time. I appreciate you taking a look at it.

 

[Hamradioguy]

Pretty obvious that BS is A: Not a Firefighter, B: Unwilling to learn, and C: Just trolling. Welcome to "ignore" BS.

 

[WildCat]

um..is this guy for real? Isn't it standard operating procedure for 9-11 Truthers NOT to accuse members of the FDNY of being "in on it"???

or this this just a rogue truther?

or just a troll.

It's called "parody".

 

[alfaniner]

I didn't realize at first this was in the Conspiracy topic (where I almost never go), but the thread title interested me.

Not to be disrespectful in what is ultimately a serious (and heated) thread, but...

Why do so many firefighters have 70's gay porn mustaches?


I only noticed it because I just saw a show on Travel Channel where firefighters from New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles all rated some pizzas. Many of them had these big, thick bushwhackers that you'd only otherwise see on VHS tape covers in a very special section of the adult video store.

 

[ElMondoHummus]

I didn't realize at first this was in the Conspiracy topic (where I almost never go), but the thread title interested me.

Not to be disrespectful in what is ultimately a serious (and heated) thread, but...

Why do so many firefighters have 70's gay porn mustaches?


I only noticed it because I just saw a show on Travel Channel where firefighters from New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles all rated some pizzas. Many of them had these big, thick bushwhackers that you'd only otherwise see on VHS tape covers in a very special section of the adult video store.

Okay, if NYCEMT86 doesn't answer this, I'll be most disappointed.

 

[triforcharity]

I didn't realize at first this was in the Conspiracy topic (where I almost never go), but the thread title interested me.

Not to be disrespectful in what is ultimately a serious (and heated) thread, but...

Why do so many firefighters have 70's gay porn mustaches?


I only noticed it because I just saw a show on Travel Channel where firefighters from New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles all rated some pizzas. Many of them had these big, thick bushwhackers that you'd only otherwise see on VHS tape covers in a very special section of the adult video store.

Because they won't let us have the latest version. Something about budget cutbacks.

 

[TruthersLie]

Dude.. You have won the internet.

The rest of y'all can pack up and go home.

ahem... I'd like to be cc'd in on that too...

It is just for research. Honest.

 

[commandlinegamer]

take the led point of a bullet, and push it against a wall, and it aint gonna do much damage.

move it at 2,000 ft. per second, and you have a whole different outcome.

but of course, Truthers fail to understand this.

or they make believe, they don't understand this.

i suggest the latter.

I really wish we could dig up ol' Isaac Newton, stick him in a room of Truthers and watch the fur fly.

 

[Dave Rogers]

have you ever seen fireproofing on steel melt into a glassy residue? at what temp would the fire have to be to melt blazeshield or the older asbestos containing fireproofing?

This seems worryingly like the beginning of a complex question fallacy. Looking at this as a physicist, it seems to me that there is no need for fireproofing on steel to have melted for the steel to fail. Fireproofing on steel works rather like pipe lagging in reverse; it doesn't stop the flow of heat into the steel from its surroundings, just slows it down. That's why fireproofing has a protection time rating. After that time, in the standard conditions of the test, even with the fireproofing still in place and intact, the steel will nevertheless have been heated to its point of failure (said point being defined in a manner specific to the rating test; mileage may vary in real situations).

As for whether fireproofing will actually protect steel up to its rated time in a specific fire, that's been done to death many times here; the rating is for a specific set of standard conditions that may not bear much resemblance to a real-life fire, and detailed modelling or testing would have to be done to predict how a specific assembly would perform in specific conditions. Such modelling and testing formed a significant part of the NIST investigations.

Dave

 

[bill smith]

This seems worryingly like the beginning of a complex question fallacy. Looking at this as a physicist, it seems to me that there is no need for fireproofing on steel to have melted for the steel to fail. Fireproofing on steel works rather like pipe lagging in reverse; it doesn't stop the flow of heat into the steel from its surroundings, just slows it down. That's why fireproofing has a protection time rating. After that time, in the standard conditions of the test, even with the fireproofing still in place and intact, the steel will nevertheless have been heated to its point of failure (said point being defined in a manner specific to the rating test; mileage may vary in real situations).

As for whether fireproofing will actually protect steel up to its rated time in a specific fire, that's been done to death many times here; the rating is for a specific set of standard conditions that may not bear much resemblance to a real-life fire, and detailed modelling or testing would have to be done to predict how a specific assembly would perform in specific conditions. Such modelling and testing formed a significant part of the NIST investigations.

Dave

Suppose you had a hollow core column coated all round in a thick layer of fireproofing. Then further suppose that this hollow core column was filled with nanothermite. If this was ignited would it liquify the steel instantly. Would all the fireproofing melt together- fuse into a kind of glassy residue forming a hollow pipe of sorts ?