Alex Jones' "TerrorStorm"

Looks like there is abundant crap to debunk in this video as well. Just to take one example, Jones claims that the Number 30 bus was diverted from its normal route on 7/7. This is true, but what he ignores is that it was diverted because road closures caused by the attack on one of the subway stations meant that it couldn't take its normal route. I'll see if I can find a link for this info; I got it from Wikipeda.

Jones also makes a big deal out of the claim by a disaster response expert that he was running a drill on 7/7 that involved terrorist bombings of the London tubes. Jones of course exaggerates wildly by saying that the drill included the exact same trains and the exact same bus at the exact same locations. Never mind that the expert never said that, or that he clearly said he was doing this for a private firm (in other words, this was not a government drill). Now remember, much like the WTC, this was not a far-fetched scenario; terrorists had targeted subways and trains before, including the 3/11/03 attacks in Madrid, the sarin gas attack in Tokyo, and of course the IRA's attempts back in the 1970s.

Jones does the typical "odds of this happening by coincidence" calculation and comes up with an amusing number: 1 in 300 "tretagillion". Moronic of course because you cannot take an actual historical event and assign probabilities to individual parts of the event and then think you've proven it wasn't a coincidence. Actuarial calculations only work when you're looking at possible future outcomes. The odds of the house three doors down from mine being destroyed by a fire were probably 1 in a million the day it happened, but it still happened.
 
Brainster said:
Jones does the typical "odds of this happening by coincidence" calculation and comes up with an amusing number: 1 in 300 "tretagillion". Moronic of course because you cannot take an actual historical event and assign probabilities to individual parts of the event and then think you've proven it wasn't a coincidence. Actuarial calculations only work when you're looking at possible future outcomes. The odds of the house three doors down from mine being destroyed by a fire were probably 1 in a million the day it happened, but it still happened.
Click to expand...

Yeah, even with an odd of 1 in 300 "tretagillion", I would still tend to believe in a coincidence.
 
Possible Copyright Violation

At about 1:06:04, Jones shows a brief clip from the famed "1984" commercial by Apple Computers.

Lots of sloppy mistakes: the White House is the whitehouse, the Reichstag is the Reichstagg, etc. Jones cites the 2005 bombings in London as the impetus for British government crackdowns and shows news clippings from 2001 and 2004 as evidence. The focus is on England, with I guess the point being that if it happens there it will happen here, but of course this ignores completely the vast differences between the UK and the US politically, especially with regard to individual freedoms. He claims that the free speech zone extends for miles, but if you watch carefully a BBC article says a .5 mile radius around Parliament.
 
Another examples was the De Menezes shooting.

Jones made the statements that "everyone knows" you don't shoot at a suicide bomber, and you don't approach them.

However in the aftermath of the shooting the British Police revealed they had spent a long time studying the methods Israel had developed to counter suicide bombers (methods that have proved successful).

The method determined as most effective was to tackle the suspect (thus making them unable to trigger their explosives) and shoot them in the head.

-Andrew
 
gumboot said:
The method determined as most effective was to tackle the suspect (thus making them unable to trigger their explosives) and shoot them in the head.

-Andrew
Click to expand...

Interesting the bombers didn't switch to a dead-man switch scenario. I've read (but can't find the damn article anymore) that when the miltary started deploying cell phone jammers to block signals to bombs, bombers switched to a timer that started timing after the loss of a cell phone signal. So the bomber (not suicidal in this case) calls the bomb, keeps the phone open, jammer comes in, bomb starts count down....
 
steverino said:
Alex Jones "gets it." I think he simply found a lucrative radio niche and exploits it. The USS Liberty was a tragic unfortunate incident. I do have my suspicions on the Oklahoma City bombing trial. Too many Taliban connections in OK City at that time.
Click to expand...

Are you saying you think the Oklahoma City bombing was a taliban plot? To do what? To accomplish what? They weren't even in control of Afghanistan yet at that time.
 
kevin said:
Interesting the bombers didn't switch to a dead-man switch scenario. I've read (but can't find the damn article anymore) that when the miltary started deploying cell phone jammers to block signals to bombs, bombers switched to a timer that started timing after the loss of a cell phone signal. So the bomber (not suicidal in this case) calls the bomb, keeps the phone open, jammer comes in, bomb starts count down....
Click to expand...


Yeah... though I'm not sure how a "dead-man" switch would work...A classic explanation is, if you shoot someone in the head the jerk reflex is different, so they won't trip an explosive or something... *shrugs*

Your comments re: the cellphones remind me of a photo from Iraq some US soldiers took of a mobile phone taped to some explosives. The display on the screen read "1 missed call".

-Andrew
 
CFLarsen said:
Wrong. He was found inside the building, shirtless.

Alex Jones has a knack of starting out behind.
Click to expand...


Actually that bit made me laugh, because he pronounced "naked" as "nekked". It just really didn't fit.

As I understand it most people who claim the Nazis lit the fire argue that Vanderlubbe DID start a fire in the Reichstag, but it was a pitiful little fire and not the raging inferno that the Nazis simultaneously lit.

He really does his side no favours. Looking up examples like the Gulf of Tonkin and USS Liberty incidents will show there's certainly room for alternate theories, but Jones' blanket authoritarian statements of "exactly what happened" just make him out to be completely wrong - even if his point in that instance is justified.

-Andrew
 
gumboot said:
Yeah... though I'm not sure how a "dead-man" switch would work...
Click to expand...

A fairly simplistic one is a spring type clothspin. wrap wires around each of the ends that normally touch. squeeze the other end to separate the wires. Arm the bomb so when the wires touch it goes off. If you're tackled you let go. If you're shot in the head you should let go automatically but I'm not sure that is a given.
 
gumboot said:
Your comments re: the cellphones remind me of a photo from Iraq some US soldiers took of a mobile phone taped to some explosives. The display on the screen read "1 missed call".
Click to expand...

I highly recommend reading Bruce Schneier's stuff. Although a computer security expert he talks about how a lot of "security" measures are misguided attempts to foil a particular plot (movie plots) but that once the security measure is implement terrorists will simply change their tactics to get around that one measure.

http://www.schneier.com/blog/
 
Darat said:
It's a slight aside but this true hero died just a few days ago: Lieutenant-Colonel George Styles, GC http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,60-2295008,00.html , his book that is mentioned Bombs Have No Pity is unfortunately out of print but I read it as a kid and it was very interesting (obviously it would be very dated today).
Click to expand...

from the article:
In 1966 his expert knowledge of explosives engineering was called upon for the demolition of a giant, 1,100-ton “Goliath” crane at Dungeness nuclear power station after it had served its purpose during the construction phase. Dismantling it piece by piece would have been lengthy and prohibitively expensive. At the same time it was essential, because of the proximity of the nuclear power station, for there to be minimum earth shock. Styles devised a system to collapse the structure into an area of shingle, to absorb the shock, and prolong the period of impact by a sequence of charges to break the rigid joints of the crane while it was actually falling. His system proved entirely successful.
Click to expand...

That is freaking brilliant.
 
gumboot said:
Yeah... though I'm not sure how a "dead-man" switch would work...A classic explanation is, if you shoot someone in the head the jerk reflex is different, so they won't trip an explosive or something... *shrugs*

Your comments re: the cellphones remind me of a photo from Iraq some US soldiers took of a mobile phone taped to some explosives. The display on the screen read "1 missed call".

-Andrew
Click to expand...

I can't speak on the "dead-man's switch", but I can definitively say that firearms headshots do often cause severe muscle spasming. So, in relation to a DMS a headshot would be better than a bodyshot.
 
Brainster said:
Looks like there is abundant crap to debunk in this video as well. Just to take one example, Jones claims that the Number 30 bus was diverted from its normal route on 7/7. This is true, but what he ignores is that it was diverted because road closures caused by the attack on one of the subway stations meant that it couldn't take its normal route. I'll see if I can find a link for this info; I got it from Wikipeda.
Click to expand...

Here's a link:

Police had set up diversions around Euston because of the bombs on the underground, forcing Mr Psaradakis to turn into Tavistock Square.
Click to expand...

Psaradakis was the bus driver. So the whole, "This bus should never have been there" bit is nonsense.
 
Last edited:
Arkan_Wolfshade said:
I can't speak on the "dead-man's switch", but I can definitively say that firearms headshots do often cause severe muscle spasming. So, in relation to a DMS a headshot would be better than a bodyshot.
Click to expand...
well it woudl still be fairly simple to make a dead-man swtich for a suicide bomber, you can make one where it goes off if the wires are separated and just have one wire on your hand and one on your chest, as long as your hand is touching your chest your ok

other than maybe shooting an arrow through the hand into the chest i dont think theres any way to take the guy down without detonating the bomb


its a pretty obvious setup to me, but then again ive always considered myself to be more demented than the average person
 
Arkan_Wolfshade said:
I can't speak on the "dead-man's switch", but I can definitively say that firearms headshots do often cause severe muscle spasming. So, in relation to a DMS a headshot would be better than a bodyshot.
Click to expand...

eh, spasm usually means contraction follwed by relaxation (just very rapidly) not sure that would prevent my dms proposal from working, but defaultdotxbe's suggestion is "better" (for very strange meanings of the word better).
 
Brainster said:
Here's a link:

Psaradakis was the bus driver. So the whole, "This bus should never have been there" bit is nonsense.
Click to expand...

Wow.

Police had set up diversions around Euston because of the bombs on the underground, forcing Mr Psaradakis to turn into Tavistock Square.

"I announced that it might be quicker to walk and a large number of passengers got off," he said.
Click to expand...

That man saved their lives.

-Andrew
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom