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Abortion Referendum

Two minor points.
1. Does a ~2:1 majority constitute a 'landslide'? I'd reserve that for 3:1 at least.

2. The result is almost exactly an inversion if the result of the 1983 referendum.

BTW, for those of you interested in what happens next; the Returning Officer issues a Provide Referendum Certificate which will be published in Iris Oifigiúil (probably on Tuesday unless a special issue is published but that's unlikely). Then all persons who wish to challenge result (and there's almost always done crank) has seven days to apply to the High Court for leave to present a petition as to why the result should be annulled. Conspiracy just get short shrift.
If any petitions fail or are dismissed the Referendum Certificate issued and sent to the President to be signed into law. That will probably take a week or two.
 
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catsmate said:
Citation required.
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I was going by Repeal's rhetoric of Abortion being the ultimate expression of feminine empowerment and it being the golden ticket to gender equality. Except 90s Russia had an abortion rate to the point that it was an immediate first resort yet it didn't do much for women. Hell, I would go so far as to say the demographic collapse in that time was a significant contributing factor to Putin's rise to power.

Let's be honest here, I am no fan of the Hypocritical and Abusive Catholic Church, who condemn gay men for existing then go on to enable child abuse. I am no fan of the "all are god's children" then sending a woman to slavery in the magdalene laundries.
 
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NWO Sentryman said:
Going by the rhetoric of Abortion being the ultimate expression of feminine empowerment and it being the golden ticket to gender equality, 90s Russia had a hell of a lot of that yet it didn't do much for women.
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Still no citations for your assertion of this rhetoric.
 
TheGoldcountry said:
Out of all the crap you spew, this is the most condescending and insulting. As though people who disagree with you are just being "trendy"
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I accept there are women who want to abort an unwanted pregnancy. What I don't understand is why everybody is so joyous about the 'yes' vote. Even the reporter on BBC was bouncing around as though it was the Berlin Wall coming down.

Let's face it, the only people who will benefit are those who want an abortion.
 
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Vixen said:
I accept there are women who want to abort an unwanted pregnancy. What I don't understand is why everybody is so joyous about the 'yes' vote. Even the reporter on BBC was bouncing around as though it was the Berlin Wall coming down.

Let's face it, the only people who will benefit are those who want an abortion.
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One, yes I am joyous about a woman having rights to her body.

Two, society benefits as a whole from supporting the rights of others. We don't live in a vacuum.
 
NWO Sentryman said:
So Ireland will soon try and beat 90s Russia for Demographic Collapse speedrun - or at least that's the impression I'm getting from the repeal voters? Only, despite abortion being an immediate First Resort and glorified as such in Russia, it didn't usher in gender equality.
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No one is claiming that.

NWO Sentryman said:
No, but...
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No one is saying that.

NWO Sentryman said:
No, but...

Declared Interest: Pro-Choice for purely pragmatic reasons.
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Then why are you attacking people who voted the same way you would have done?
 
TheGoldcountry said:
One, yes I am joyous about a woman having rights to her body.

Two, society benefits as a whole from supporting the rights of others. We don't live in a vacuum.
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As a matter of interest, do the "rights of others" include the rights of the unborn foetus, or the father of it?

Or are only highly vocal women who want, "a woman's right to choose" the only voices we should listen to?

That slogan in itself implies a doctor is being 'sexist' if an abortion is refused, because of the law or because of personal ethics, and that the woman's predicament is because of this dreadful 'sexist' society.

But hang on, what is the premise based on? Is a pregnancy really forced on women?
 
Vixen said:
As a matter of interest, do the "rights of others" include the rights of the unborn foetus, or the father of it?

Or are only highly vocal women who want, "a woman's right to choose" the only voices we should listen to?

That slogan in itself implies a doctor is being 'sexist' if an abortion is refused, because of the law or because of personal ethics, and that the woman's predicament is because of this dreadful 'sexist' society.

But hang on, what is the premise based on? Is a pregnancy really forced on women?
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Let’s say in cases where it is forced on women - rape - and the foetus has yet to develop a central nervous system. Whose rights do you favour? The foetus? It has no brain yet! The father? Do you think the rapist should get a say? The government? The Catholic Church? The doctor? I literally want you to explain whose rights should trump those of the woman who has been raped and explain why.
 
Vixen said:
As a matter of interest, do the "rights of others" include the rights of the unborn foetus, or the father of it?

Or are only highly vocal women who want, "a woman's right to choose" the only voices we should listen to?

That slogan in itself implies a doctor is being 'sexist' if an abortion is refused, because of the law or because of personal ethics, and that the woman's predicament is because of this dreadful 'sexist' society.

But hang on, what is the premise based on? Is a pregnancy really forced on women?
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One strawman argument at a time, please.

Hint: I never suggested any of the above, so I don't feel the need to argue in favor of a position I never held.
 
Vixen said:
I accept there are women who want to abort an unwanted pregnancy. What I don't understand is why everybody is so joyous about the 'yes' vote. Even the reporter on BBC was bouncing around as though it was the Berlin Wall coming down.

Let's face it, the only people who will benefit are those who want an abortion.
Click to expand...
My cousin got pregnant in the 1990s. She was married and was planning a family. However, the foetus had a medical condition (can't remember the details, it's not important) which meant that if it survived to full term, it would be born and would die within hours. There was 0% chance of the baby being viable.

Legally there was nothing she could do to terminate the pregnancy. She could have regular scans to see if the foetus was still alive and could have had it removed if it was dead, but the foetus survived full term. For some reason (don't know her personal situation, doesn't really matter) she chose not to travel abroad to have an abortion but instead carried the foetus to term, and it died almost immediately, as expected.

"Joy" is not the emotion women in her situation would feel if they could legally and safely terminate their pregnancies.

What a situation. To be forced to carry a non-viable foetus to term because some **********-up law considers it to be a full human being with full rights. Yet people on these forums seem to think there's something wrong with remove the extreme legal barriers that would allow a woman to legally and safely terminate the pregnancy in those kind of situations.

If you want another example, look up the "X case" that happened in Ireland during the 1990s, where a 14 year old girl who got pregnant as the result of rape, and had reported felling suicidal because of her situation, but when the police learned that she intended to travel to England to have an abortion, they prevented her from doing so. The situation was ludicrous and tragic and the result of the 8th amendment we have just voted to remove from the constitution.

These are the kind of tragic situations that women are forced to put up with precisely because we have preposterously conservative and extremist laws regarding abortion, because of what is enshrined in our constitution. Removing the 8th amendment will allow for terminating pregnancy to be sensibly legislated for.

I'm shaking my head at yours and others incoherent and rather silly objections to what has been done here in Ireland.
 
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