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Cont: 2024 Election Thread part 3

As an aside, anyone noticed how the trumpkins have suddenly gone completely quiet about election fraud? Almost as if...
 
AmyStrange said:
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Sexual orientation is a personal choiceand should be left up to the people themselves and not the local or federal government.
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Deciding which socks to wear in the morning is a personal choice. This, is not. I don't want to sidetrack the discussion and you make very clear and sensible points otherwise, but this sounds like Republican mantra.
 
alfaniner said:
Deciding which socks to wear in the morning is a personal choice. This, is not. I don't want to sidetrack the discussion and you make very clear and sensible points otherwise, but this sounds like Republican mantra.
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I Agree. I misspoke, and I apologize. Sexual orientation is not a choice, otherwise, heterosexual folks would have to explain exactly when they made the choice not to be gay.


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Safe-Keeper said:
As an aside, anyone noticed how the trumpkins have suddenly gone completely quiet about election fraud? Almost as if...
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Actually I've seen quite a few remark that the fact the popular turnout was so much lower this time is proof positive that the higher count in '20 was a direct result of the fraud (dead voters, illegals) which of course they were on guard to prevent this time around. :rolleyes:
 
Safe-Keeper said:
As an aside, anyone noticed how the trumpkins have suddenly gone completely quiet about election fraud? Almost as if...
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Though I don't speak for all Republicans, I feel it's highly likely the 2020 election will be investigated during Trump's time in office and that's likely the main concern that will be addressed. I do see multiple posts from Democrats at various online media outlets questioning millions of missing votes though. Perhaps there will be bipartisan support to secure our elections?
 
Safe-Keeper said:
As an aside, anyone noticed how the trumpkins have suddenly gone completely quiet about election fraud? Almost as if...
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At worst, legal means to ballot harvest last time around, exploiting covid and pushing mail-ins. But as I am concerned the results from the last election were legitimate. The situation all around could have been handled better.

2016 had 2 years of democratic efforts to connect Trumps' electoral college win to Russian interference.... that also could have been handled better.

The issue now isn't about people claiming the results for 2024 are based off fraud or cheating. It's people invoking Godwin's Law rather than doing introspection as to why the electorate voted the way it did.
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
Though I don't speak for all Republicans, I feel it's highly likely the 2020 election will be investigated during Trump's time in office and that's likely the main concern that will be addressed. I do see multiple posts from Democrats at various online media outlets questioning millions of missing votes though.
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It's perhaps worth noting that there's a difference between "This is an oddity well worth investigating further to verify" and "MASSIVE FRAUD/Find me X number more votes so that I win/recount over and over and over and then try to rig the recount when the recounts show that the result was correct the first time!"

ChrisBFRPKY said:
Perhaps there will be bipartisan support to secure our elections?
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Democrats have long been firmly in support of securing our elections. Republicans? Many of them say so, but actions speak louder than words.

For example, strongly pushing a system that gets things wrong over 99% of the time is NOT securing our elections. Throwing out roadblocks that do far more to stop legitimate voters from voting (especially skewed in a rather partisan manner) than they even could do to stop illegitimate voters from voting is not securing our elections. Spreading brazen lies and fantasy-based distrust is not securing our elections. Threatening election workers is not securing our elections. Violating the security measures in place for voting machines is not securing our elections. Plenty more can be said, really, but this old inane lie that only Republicans care about election integrity is a tired bit of ridiculousness. Makes for a fine narrative to latch onto for Republicans trying to rationalize and/or weaponize their own disregard for actual election integrity, though.
 
Aridas said:
It's perhaps worth noting that there's a difference between "This is an oddity well worth investigating further to verify" and "MASSIVE FRAUD/Find me X number more votes so that I win/recount over and over and over and then try to rig the recount when the recounts show that the result was correct the first time!"



Democrats have long been firmly in support of securing our elections. Republicans? Many of them say so, but actions speak louder than words.

For example, strongly pushing a system that gets things wrong over 99% of the time is NOT securing our elections. Throwing out roadblocks that do far more to stop legitimate voters from voting (especially skewed in a rather partisan manner) than they even could do to stop illegitimate voters from voting is not securing our elections. Spreading brazen lies and fantasy-based distrust is not securing our elections. Threatening election workers is not securing our elections. Violating the security measures in place for voting machines is not securing our elections. Plenty more can be said, really, but this old inane lie that only Republicans care about election integrity is a tired bit of ridiculousness. Makes for a fine narrative to latch onto for Republicans trying to rationalize their own disregard for actual election integrity, though.
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California Governor Gavin Newsom signed Senate Bill 1174 into law on September 29, 2024. SB 1174 prohibits local governments from requiring voters to present identification when casting their ballots at the polls. Newsom is a Democrat.
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
California Governor Gavin Newsom signed Senate Bill 1174 into law on September 29, 2024. SB 1174 prohibits local governments from requiring voters to present identification when casting their ballots at the polls. Newsom is a Democrat.
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A weak argument, from the start. Nothing more than a lame attempted gotcha, really.

For a better assessment of the situation at hand -

California Common Cause, writes: "Studies by the Center for Democracy & Civic Engagement found that during the 2020 elections millions of voters nationwide did not have current government-issued photo identification, and that voters who lacked photo identification were more likely to be voters with disabilities and Latino, Black, young, and low-income voters. These communities of voters would be disproportionately harmed by requirements to show photo identification before voting...Locally imposed voter identification rules would also create a confusing voting experience for Californians and increase election administration costs. Local rules would not apply for state and federal elections, which are generally held at the same time as municipal elections, so could mean different experiences for voters election to election, and increased costs from holding a separate municipal election."

"California also already has numerous precautions in place to prevent voter fraud, such as signature verification checks, ballot tracking, audits, and recounts. To register to vote, a person must provide their driver's license number, their state identification number, or the last four digits of their Social Security number. If a person does not include this identifying information with their registration application, pursuant to federal law they must provide identification the first time that they vote in a federal election. While efforts to impose voter identification requirements locally may already be in violation of state law, SB 1174 rightly affirms that voter eligibility is a matter of statewide concern and state policy."
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Fun times here in Sacramento. Newsom announces special session of the State Legislature in reponse to Trump's relection.https://news.yahoo.com/news/california-gov-newsom-calls-special-190609102.html
Thank the powers the be for federalism...(the actual system, not the crap the misnamed federalist society preachesP, I think this is just the first of many such actions in the Blue states.
I won't deny that Newsom might have political motives; he is probably thinking at least a little about 2028 but you have to expect some grandstanding from any politician.
Maybe Nullification will become anisue again...which would be a nice irony.
 
stanfr said:
I'm probably in the minority here, but I think JD would be a far lesser threat. He's a simple opportunist, still knows that Trump is nuts but plays along. If he were in power sure he might push for horrible policies, but it would be done through the system. Trump wants to abolish the system, especially if it denies him his perceived right to beatification. If the choice is between evil and insane I'll take evil. The end of the world is far more likely to come from the chaos that insanity brings. Live to fight another day.
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I am inclined to agree Everything about Vance screams pure opportunist.
People forget what he said about Trump 5 years ago.
 
I think some of you need to take Harris's speech more seriously.
Despair and resignation help nobody but Trump.That was the point she was maiking.
I understand the anger, and I even understand the angst, but the whole "WE ARE DOOMED AND NOTHING CAN SAVE US" is BS< and helps nobody but Trump.
I am predicting that a lot of the swing voters are boing to have the worst case of Buyer's regreat in history by the end of 2025.'
 
Aridas said:
For a better assessment of the situation at hand -
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Actually, to poke a little more at this, the opposition argument there is sorta noteworthy.

Confidence in our election process is the first line of defense against this chaos. The Greater Bakersfield Republican Assembly would even argue that confidence is more important than the candidates or issues on the ballot…If an election is to be free and fair, voters must have the highest confidence in the entire election system, from voter registration to ballot counting and tabulation. This proposed legislation would diminish confidence and impose the will of the state on local communities' and municipalities' elections processes…
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Confidence in our elections is super important, eh? So important that the Republican Party happily pushes friggin' bizarre CTs, easily debunked lies and nonsense, and excuses/embraces actual illegal foreign interference when it thinks it benefits from such? After so very much hard work to undermine America's confidence in our elections, this is utterly shameless.

Actions speak louder than words.
 
dudalb said:
As for Hitler, Hitler was a lot smarter then Trump. Trump is more like Bursecolni
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At last check, going by the news of the time, Hitler was also friggin' dumb? Like Trump, though, his strengths laid elsewhere. Either way, an exact match is completely unnecessary for the point made. They're very much not the same, just far too similar in the ways that actually matter.
 
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