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2012 Debates

Meadmaker said:
I didn't watch tonight, but I tuned in right at the end of Romney's final speech. I watched NBC's talking heads for about 15 minutes.

The impression I got was that there was no clear winner, but that Romney looked awfully presidential, which would mean that in voter terms, Romney won.

The consensus here is that Obama won. Bias? Or was it that NBC didn't want to appear partisan in their first few minutes of discussion?
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I don't think so... that's not what I took from this at ALL (again, I fully admit I am biased here) and it really seems like the GOP is playing damage control now. It sure seems like a clear win to me for Obama and from the things I am seeing and reading on line a lot of others agree with my take on things.
 
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Meadmaker said:
I didn't watch tonight, but I tuned in right at the end of Romney's final speech. I watched NBC's talking heads for about 15 minutes.

The impression I got was that there was no clear winner, but that Romney looked awfully presidential, which would mean that in voter terms, Romney won.

The consensus here is that Obama won. Bias? Or was it that NBC didn't want to appear partisan in their first few minutes of discussion?
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http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/2011/1022PostDebatePoll.pdf

Decent poll (compared to ones done by CNN) saying otherwise.
 
not_so_new said:
I don't think so... that's not what I took from this at ALL (again, I fully admit I am biased here) and it really seems like the GOP is playing damage control now. It sure seems like a clear win to me for Obama.
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Flipping around a few of the networks (and admitting I'm biased as well), I'd have to say I agree.
 
Meadmaker said:
I didn't watch tonight, but I tuned in right at the end of Romney's final speech. I watched NBC's talking heads for about 15 minutes.

The impression I got was that there was no clear winner, but that Romney looked awfully presidential, which would mean that in voter terms, Romney won.

The consensus here is that Obama won. Bias? Or was it that NBC didn't want to appear partisan in their first few minutes of discussion?
Click to expand...

It was the same on ABC. Im not sure if they were being cautious, or biased, or just want a horse race.
 
AdMan said:
Flipping around a few of the networks (and admitting I'm biased as well), I'd have to say I agree.
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Coupled with the poll Drew posted above.... and some others like the CBS poll I mentioned a few posts up... seems like a pretty clear win for Obama all the way around.

In my eyes he sure did look a LOT more confident than Romney did. In fact, it is exactly the opposite of Meadmaker's "Presidential" comment above. Romney looked out of his league and kept trying to steer the debate back to the economy in an effort to get back to his comfort zone.
 
Meadmaker said:
I didn't watch tonight, but I tuned in right at the end of Romney's final speech. I watched NBC's talking heads for about 15 minutes.

The impression I got was that there was no clear winner, but that Romney looked awfully presidential, which would mean that in voter terms, Romney won.

The consensus here is that Obama won. Bias? Or was it that NBC didn't want to appear partisan in their first few minutes of discussion?
Click to expand...

Romney tried to look very presidential, using his perceived strength in the polls to back off attacking Obama. Given Obama's aggressive stance and well-placed challenges and retorts(which theBlaze is calling "arrogance"), it seems Romney pulled back too far, and it backfired for his performance.

ETA: That's assuming he could have recovered from the dressing-down Obama gave him regarding the navy if he had even tried, which was pretty devastating and will probably form many people's perception of Romney's overall military acumen for the rest of the campaign.
 
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not_so_new said:
Wellllllll.....

The original snap poll after the first debate had Romney winning "hands down" by 26%. The same snap poll from CBS after this debate has Obama with a "very weak win" (using your words) with a 30% margin of victory.
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Yeah, apparently I am an outlier. That's ok. Here's a couple of reasons for my assessment. The single best answer tonight was Romney on Pakistan. I thought he was clear and avoided his usual blathering while saying absolutely nothing (his very first answer being a good example of that). Obama expanded his approach in calling out Romney in this debate. It was necessary but I think he pushed it a little to far. He was better at this in the second debate.
 
Denver said:
Romney tried to look very presidential, using his perceived strength in the polls to back off attacking Obama. Given Obama's aggressive stance and well-placed challenges and retorts(which theBlaze is calling "arrogance"), it seems Romney pulled back too far, and it backfired for his performance.
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Good analysis.
 
I thought it was incredibly brave (read "stupid") for Romney to bring up the "apology tour", considering how it has already been ravaged by fact-checkers, and now will be again two weeks from the election.
 
I can't believe Romney is pushing the whole "navy is smaller" nonsense. I loved Obama's answer but I wish someone would point out that during the cold war the Soviet Union gambled on sheer size while America focused more on advanced technology and strategy.

In any event, this notion that we cannot cut the military without putting us in jeopardy is demagoguery and stupid. It's irrational fear.
 
I did not watch the debates, but reading these forums and a couple articles, I would say that Obama "won". It seems he also used a "zinger" (in the run up to the first debate his team promised substantive answers. I guess that didn't work out so well.)

On the Yahoo comments board, which sometimes seem like the old comments section of FoxNoise, people are saying these like
"As to the headline, you are completely wrong. Yahoo, CNN and the media can spin all you want, but we are NOT going for your #$%$. this time. Romney will make Carter's loss look small compared to Obama." [73 thumbs up, 11 thumbs down]

"Call the Uhaul, OWEbama. You're done!" [9 thumbs up, zero down]

"Obama's understanding of our Navy..."we have aircraft carriers with planes and we have submarines that go under the water". Wow, he really knows his stuff. I feel safer now." [36 thumbs up, 9 thumbs down; glad their sarcasm detector works]

People are also claiming a "fact check" shows we have more bayonets today than 1916.
 
RandFan said:
I can't believe Romney is pushing the whole "navy is smaller" nonsense. I loved Obama's answer but I wish someone would point out that during the cold war the Soviet Union gambled on sheer size while America focused more on advanced technology and strategy.

In any event, this notion that we cannot cut the military without putting us in jeopardy is demagoguery and stupid. It's irrational fear.
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You've never heard of aliens from outter space? How can the US navy in its present form compete against them?
 
RandFan said:
I can't believe Romney is pushing the whole "navy is smaller" nonsense. I loved Obama's answer but I wish someone would point out that during the cold war the Soviet Union gambled on sheer size while America focused more on advanced technology and strategy.

In any event, this notion that we cannot cut the military without putting us in jeopardy is demagoguery and stupid. It's irrational fear.
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Irrational fear is what's helped propel Republicans for years.
 
I may have to resign from these forums. I think we have proof of reincarnation. That wasn't Mitt Romney, it was the spirit of George McGovern. I wish the debate had gone on an hour longer, we'd probably have seen Mitt's hair growing longer and him flashing the peace sign.

He's firm on pulling the troops out, doesn't think killing is a good thing, agrees with Obama's handling of everything but would be even more reasonable. I expected him to eschew the usual closing and go with "Peace! Out!"
 
It seemed like Romney loaded himself up with some Valium and Propranolol, then went out and delivered a series of rehearsed generic/non-offensive platitudes. Playing not to lose... probably the right call given his current situation. The "Mittmentum" phase has pretty much plateaued and he needs to keep the ship steady and not scare anybody off. The apology tour attack was interesting - was the intent to infuriate Obama and get him off his game? It was too far along in the debate. Throw some red meat to the base? Unnecessary, they're showing up on election day. Maybe Mitt was just doing some good ol'-fashioned trolling.

Obama was clearly in the mood for some "tumult" and was throwing shots throughout, particularly in the first half-hour or so. He got in some good ones but went over the top in a couple of instances. At one point he started looking around and yelling about the transcript (record?) to be checked, as if some stenographer were going to start reading off a list of Romney's prior statements. No Candy Crowley to ride to the rescue this time. His response to the Navy topic was incredibly childish and condescending; it made me cringe. YMMV of course - if you enjoyed Biden's antics in the VP debate then you probably loved it.

Bob did okay, I prefer the moderator to generally keep his/her trap shut. The candidates got off on domestic tangents a couple of times, but both seemed more than willing to engage when given the opportunity. Interruptions were minimal and I've heard that speaking time was just about even.

I give Obama this round in fairly comfortable fashion, with Romney being a bit too conciliatory. Mitt's team must feel that he either 1) has built a decent but fragile lead; or 2) has peaked and is hoping to win an squeaker.
 
I have to confess that I tuned in late. (I slept late - just exhausted from a seventeen hour day yesterday and Marcello's got a holiday today so we could sleep in...) When I tuned in on CNN, I thought they were re-running the previous debate. It was the last question before closing and Mitt was re-living his Town Hall Moment when he itemized all the things that are wrong... and it was all economy and domestic policy. He really has an empty hand when it comes to Foreign Policy, so kept trying to shift back to the economy and jobs.


I watched the whole thing on Thai TV (in English with Thai subtitles), though. I know that Obama will make great play of this in the aftermath but I wish he'd stopped him cold every time he moved further to the center. I think if you charted him on one of those "Where Do You Stand" four segment graphs, he's now further to the left than Obama!

But it's good to know that he loves teachers.
 
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