B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join the ACLU."

[Ladewig]

B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join the ACLU."

Media Matters

Discussing the American Civil Liberties Union's (ACLU) objections to the Dover, Pennsylvania, school district's plans to include "intelligent design" theory in their high school biology curriculum, FOX News host Bill O'Reilly declared: "Hitler would be a card-carrying ACLU member. So would Stalin. Castro probably is. And so would Mao Zedong."

On the January 19 broadcast of The Radio Factor with Bill O'Reilly, O'Reilly read portions of the statement about "intelligent design," which the Dover Area School District requires its biology teachers to read, and complained that even this statement does not directly mention God:


O'REILLY: They won't even tell you in the statement what intelligent design entails. They won't mention a creator, a deity, a God. You know why? Because the ACLU then can haul them into court and cost them $100,000 to defend themselves. Fascism, fascism, fascism. Okay? Ah, drive me nuts! Hitler would be a card-carrying ACLU member. So would Stalin. Castro probably is. And so would Mao Zedong.

The man is losing it.

 

[DavidJames]

It's Al Franken's fault

 

[hgc]

Fascism

Dictionary definition (m-w.com): a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

O'Reilly definition: anyone who pisses off O'Reilly

 

[Lurker]

Did anyone see O'Reilly interview that guy from the ACLU? The transcript is on the foxnews website. O'Reilly uses the internal feud at the ACLU to use this guy to hammer the ACLU itself.

I felt bad that this guy let himself be used by O'Reilly so badly. Frankly, I don't think he should have let his anger at the ACLU leadership influence him to go on to O'Reilly's show. Bill really used they poor buy to promote his rabid anti-ACLU agenda. I don't think the guest will be proud once his anger abates.

Lurker

 

[corplinx]

If the school district had to explain what ID really is in the school, then it would be apparent that it isn't science.

Bill O claims students in religion classes should have to hear about evolution so at least he gets the inverse/converse thing. However, ID isn't science and has no place in a science class.

If there was a class on "origins of man", perhaps religious or alien or other ideas about origins could be fleshed out. But not in a _science_ class.

Mr. O suffers from the same cognitive dissonance that many religious people do. They know what a theory means and is as they were taught in school, yet they refuse to acknowledge it and instead associate "theory" with its vernacular meaning which is "idea".

 

[KelvinG]

They won't even tell you in the statement what intelligent design entails. They won't mention a creator, a deity, a God.

Well, c'mon Bill, of course they don't mention a creator, deity, or God. We all know those rightful and honest intelligent design folks don't want to speculate on the nature of the designer, just that there is one.
Of course, nudge nudge, wink wink, it's a Christian God. We don't want to come out and say it lest we break state/church seperation, but how could it be anything else.

 

[Tmy]

I heard that show. Bill at his foolish worst. He said that since ID is a theory, it shoud be in the sci books. Like the theory of evolution. One problem, the theory of evolution HAS factual basis to it. Its not 100% but close. Where as ID has no real evidence behind it.

THe dumbest thing he said: HE complained how the ACLU forced a school to remove "Evolution is a theory" stickers from the science books. He said that move was somthing "The Taliban wouldve done." WHAT!!?!?! Im thinking the exact opposite. THe Taliban would toss out science and replace it with religious dogma.

 

[hgc]

...

Mr. O suffers from the same cognitive dissonance that many religious people do. They know what a theory means and is as they were taught in school, yet they refuse to acknowledge it and instead associate "theory" with its vernacular meaning which is "idea".

I wonder about that. If I had to guess, I'd say that BOR believes in evolution, has little sense of the definition of a scientific theory, has no idea that the ID movement is creationism in new clothing and reflexively jumps on the anti-anti-religion bandwagon, especially when the ACLU, his super-dooper boogaboo, is involved.

Just a potent mix of ignorance and anger.

 

[corplinx]

I wonder about that. If I had to guess, I'd say that BOR believes in evolution, has little sense of the definition of a scientific theory, has no idea that the ID movement is creationism in new clothing and reflexively jumps on the anti-anti-religion bandwagon, especially when the ACLU, his super-dooper boogaboo, is involved.

Just a potent mix of ignorance and anger.

Most people I know vaguely recall that there is a process by which a hypothesis becomes a theory. Even believers. They may not be able to give you a webster worthy definition of the word theory in a scientific context but they know a theory isnt just a mere suggestion or idea.

 

[Kerberos]

B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join the ACLU"

Yeah, cause we all know how much Hitler and Stalin loved civil rights.

 

[Tmy]

He tries to spin it that its not even a religious thing. They are just pointing out theories. Yeah OK, then why arent there stickers attacking the validity of the theory of relativity?

 

[pgwenthold]

As far as I can see, Bill OReilly has absolutely NO clue about what "liberty" is. No one who did would ever, ever, ever suggest that Hitler would be a civil libertarian. What sort of individual liberty was Hitler defending when he decided to carry out genocide? And Stalin? Same deal. A police state is exactly what the ACLU is fighting against, you knob!

Similarly, Bill OReilly can't distinguish between the government and citizens. As noted, the comparison between the ACLU and the Taliban is about as loopy as you can get. The Taliban is the friggin government. The ACLU fights government intrusion.

The ACLU weren't the ones who created the whole "evolution stickers" mess. That was started by the government, who are trying to force religious thought on the citizens. The ACLU says, "We don't want a government that forces religious thought on its citizens, and we have the constitution on our side." Now which one is like the Taliban again?

 

[HarryKeogh]

He tries to spin it that its not even a religious thing. They are just pointing out theories. Yeah OK, then why arent there stickers attacking the validity of the theory of relativity?

or blood flow
or gravity
or germ theory
or ...yeah Tmy, drives me nuts too!

 

[pgwenthold]

or blood flow
or gravity
or germ theory
or ...yeah Tmy, drives me nuts too!

Atomic theory is just a theory.

Put it on every chemistry text.

 

[hgc]

...Now which one is like the Taliban again?

You are, Fascist. Because you support the ACLU. I got the word straight from Bill, and he's looking out for the Folks. The ACLU isn't looking out for the Folks. They're just pushing their extreme anti-religious agenda. The folks want religion. You Fascists can't stand religion. DIE VÖLKER ZERQUETSCHEN IHRE KUGELN!!!!!

 

[Upchurch]

Quick aside.

My parents have a friend that is a card-carrying member of both the ACLU and the NRA. Apparently, he keeps both visible, side-by-side, in his wallet just for the reaction he gets from people.

 

[Tmy]

NRA, ACLU, NAACP, NOW they are the same thing. They look to defend our rights with vigor. The NRA just focus' on the 2nd amendment. Even though I may disagree with some of what they do, Im glad we have them.

THese groups protect our rights, not our governemt. Usually the govt is trying to limit our freedoms.


The ACLU has a # of top notched debaters. I dont see why they donthave a guy represent them on teh Oreilly show. I understand he controls his show, but at least have SOMEONE to counter his on air rants. I think theyd do well againstthat bonehead.

 

[Chaos]

Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join the ACLU."

Media Matters



The man is losing it.

I humbly suggest that you are wrong. For BOR to be losing it, he would have had to have it before...

 

[corplinx]

And hence, we are discussing a man who really isnt worth it. Perhaps some people on this forum will tune in to see what he says next. I wonder if he has thought of that?

Nah, not him. He's Looking Out For You.

 

[Hutch]

Never watched him, probably never will..but that doesn't stop me from having a therory....

I think he's like a drug addict in that he's always searching for a new "High", something that will make him talked about and even more famous/nortorious. And after each 'hit', he needs to be even more outrageous the next time to gain our attention.

Until finally he self-destructs and ends up on the lecture circuit or the guy they bring out the Sunday talk shows for entertainment value now and then....

 

[bigred]

Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join the ACLU."

The man is losing it.

Because........?

I'm hardly his biggest fan and not getting into the whole "creation vs evolution" bit, but I think he has a point here, ie they are very nazi-like in their tactics and have to be one of the - if not the - most counter-productive, self-licking ice cream cone organizations in the world.

They are also not terribly brilliant (successful nazi tactics aside). Do you know they recently endorsed an UNSUPERVISED teenage nudist camp in VA?

 

[LostAngeles]

Ah, Bill. Looking out for us with his fair and balanced reporting and commentary. Eris, how I love those that buy into that.

Crap. I just remembered, you go to hell for lying as well as stealing. Ignore that paragraph then.

Hitler, Stalin, Castro, and Mao would likely not join the ACLU. However, the ACLU would defend them, a la Voltaire.

That's what I find amusing about this.

 

[pgwenthold]

Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join the ACLU.&qu

Because........?

I'm hardly his biggest fan and not getting into the whole "creation vs evolution" bit, but I think he has a point here, ie they are very nazi-like in their tactics and have to be one of the - if not the - most counter-productive, self-licking ice cream cone organizations in the world.

Again, they _can't_ be nazi-like. They aren't allowed to be. They aren't the government.

You have it completely backwards. What they are doing is to PREVENT the GOVERNMENT from becoming nazi-like.

The government is the one that is trying to do things it is not allowed to do. It isn't "nazi-like" in any way to insist that they follow the constitution of the US. And saying that the GOVERNMENT can't do something is not the same as prohibiting anyone from doing it. The ACLU is a staunch protector the rights of citizens. Citizens have freedoms. Saying the government can't violate the constitution protects those freedoms.

They are also not terribly brilliant (successful nazi tactics aside). Do you know they recently endorsed an UNSUPERVISED teenage nudist camp in VA?

I'm guessing this is a massive distortion of reality, as most anti-ACLU rants generally are. I'm guessing if you look at the case, you will find it to be protecting people against an unfair law. Just a guess.

But you know what? This is the best part of the ACLU. They protect the rights of all citizens, even those with whom we disagree. This includes Illinois Nazis and Rush Limbaugh.

 

[Cleon]

Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join th

Because........?

Erm, because he said that Hitler, Stalin, and Mao would be ACLU members, and that "Castro probably is." I'm sorry, that's either extremely stupid, or completely insane.

I'm hardly his biggest fan and not getting into the whole "creation vs evolution" bit, but I think he has a point here, ie they are very nazi-like in their tactics and have to be one of the - if not the - most counter-productive, self-licking ice cream cone organizations in the world.

Yeah, because nothing says "Nazi-like tactics" like trying to preserve free expression and keeping the church out of schools.

They are also not terribly brilliant (successful nazi tactics aside). Do you know they recently endorsed an UNSUPERVISED teenage nudist camp in VA?

No, no, they didn't "endorse" any such thing. You should seriously consider researching something, rather than swallowing a soundbite you hear from some TV pundit or talk radio host.

Virginia passed a law saying that children couldn't attend nudist camps without their parents. This was in reaction to a weeklong summer camp for 11-18-year-old teenagers by a nudist colony. The ACLU charged that the law went too far and was an attempt to keep families from making their own lifestyle choices. They didn't "endorse" the camp, they feel that the law was overextensive.

Nor was the camp "unsupervised." That's simply not true. Link to story here. (Note the quote "the camp is very highly supervised.")

 

[pgwenthold]

Re: Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join th

No, no, they didn't "endorse" any such thing. You should seriously consider researching something, rather than swallowing a soundbite you hear from some TV pundit or talk radio host.

Man, I think I should win the million dollars. I posted before Cleon, and I called it perfectly.

People need to make the distinguish between "don't think people should be prohibited from doing it" and "thinks it is a good thing" or "thinks people should do it."

 

[Cleon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would

Man, I think I should win the million dollars. I posted before Cleon, and I called it perfectly.

People need to make the distinguish between "don't think people should be prohibited from doing it" and "thinks it is a good thing" or "thinks people should do it."

Wanna start a countdown until bigred decides that the ACLU or some other nefarious group is "promoting homosexuality?"

 

[corplinx]

It's Al Franken's fault

You earned a spot on my ignore list David. You are a just a fool. Goodbye.

For anyone who doesn't know, in another thread I defended Bill O against what I thought was an unfair criticism from Al Franken. David flippantly accused me of being an apologist for Bill O which I don't get since I've criticized him in other threads here (as well as defended him against some criticisms I thought were unfair).

I think David probably suffers from a common malady people like Bill O himself suffer from. They see a black/white world. In David's case its from the left end of the spectrum when he sees it.

If you say a criticism is unfair, it makes you a right wing shill apologist. If you compare how people react under a republican administration to how they did under a democrat, you are "blaming Bill" or "Bill did it first".

This sort of rabidly closed minded discussion has been littering the forum more often lately and frankly I've been tired of it a while.

 

[headscratcher4]

“Nazi” like tactics would include – pre-government – beating up opponents, sabotage, harassing jewish citizens, parades in full military regalia, mass-ralies, propaganda rags that use racist lies to denigrate the opposition, etc.

In-government: closing down all free press and outlets fro free speech, arresting all opposition and putting them into prisons. Murdering the opposition. Mass murder of "inferior" races. State control of all media. State control of all private social affairs such as religion, education etc. Big lies. Fear, terror, torture, etc.

Much the same could be said for Stalinism.

ACLU Tactics…file law suits based on a well formed premise that the law or the constitution is being violated, asserting a legal principal and appealing when they lose to a higher court. Oh, yes, going on TV and radi0 to complain about efforts to suppress free speech, dissent or the imposition of state supported religion generally on media programs like BORe’s that are often inherently hostile.

Yes, you are right, these are nasty Nazi-like tactics. They are practically indistinguishable from real Nazis. Good call…..

 

[shecky]

For anyone who doesn't know, in another thread I defended Bill O against what I thought was an unfair criticism from Al Franken.

Well, we all know now. So noted.

 

[Tmy]

Hitler, Stalin, Castro, and Mao would likely not join the ACLU. However, the ACLU would defend them, a la Voltaire.

.

How ironic. The reason those guys gained power was because they did not have a strong ACLU-ish organization in their respective countries to stop them. And if they did, youd be sure those dictators wouldve dismantled them the first chance they got.

This thread has inspired me to dontate to the ACLU. YEAH, now I can be placed on govt blacklists.

 

[Upchurch]

This thread has inspired me to dontate to the ACLU.

This thread has inspired me to actually sit down and read a little bit of the ACLU's website (as have other threads in the past).

Allowing that they only present their side of any issue, it is still interesting to read because it is often the "other side of the issue" that is provided by other (shall we call the "Fox-ish"?) sourses.

 

[crimresearch]

This thread has inspired me to actually sit down and read a little bit of the ACLU's website (as have other threads in the past).

Allowing that they only present their side of any issue, it is still interesting to read because it is often the "other side of the issue" that is provided by other (shall we call the "Fox-ish"?) sourses.

Whereas it has done nothing to inspire me to waste a single moment listening to O'Reilly.

 

[Number Six]

It might be my imagination but I think the The O'Reilly Factor has gotten worse lately. It was always mostly (but not entirely right wing) but Bill would at least usually have opposing views on and let them talk a bit, sometimes even a lot.

But lately when I watch it it's just softballs lobbed up for Bill to knock out of the park...the guests are already on Bill's side or else they're against Bill and completely incompetent and inarticulate or else they're against Bill and competent and articulate but not allowed to talk. As a result I've been watching less and less. (I was never a regular viewer of The O'Reilly Factor but rather I'm a channel flipper...flip channels and see what is interesting...but it's just that now I stop less and less on The O'Reilly Factor.)

It bugged me that the ACLU didn't even bother to send a representative onto the show and instead chose to just let Bill badmouth them. It sounds like the ACLU finally sent a rep on recently, although I missed it because I don't watch much anymore. And it seems the person did a lousy job. I don't get it...just get an intelligent, informed and articulate person to go on the show, speak, and point out when O'Reilly is twisting the meaning of them or not permitting a full explanation. It shouldn't be that hard.

 

[gnome]

It bugged me that the ACLU didn't even bother to send a representative onto the show and instead chose to just let Bill badmouth them. It sounds like the ACLU finally sent a rep on recently, although I missed it because I don't watch much anymore. And it seems the person did a lousy job. I don't get it...just get an intelligent, informed and articulate person to go on the show, speak, and point out when O'Reilly is twisting the meaning of them or not permitting a full explanation. It shouldn't be that hard.

I believe that the ACLU should be more visible, not in the sense of more activism, because they are plenty active... but you don't hear their voice. They need to defend themselves, a face to speak to the American people... or else they'll keep being a dartboard any time they defend something unpopular--WHICH IS THEIR ENTIRE REASON FOR EXISTENCE... if something they were defending were popular, it would scarcely need it.

One example... A story (I think it was on snopes.com) talked about a bad airline security experience. The person said they contacted the ACLU, and were told they could not receive assistance because they were not a minority. Personally, I suspect this is a flat out lie... but statements like this go largely unchallenged.

 

[crimresearch]

The ACLU's standard response mentions scarce resources as the primary reason for not being able to take particular cases on.

And I can assure you that minorities have been turned down too.

 

[Ladewig]

Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join th

Because........?

I'm hardly his biggest fan and not getting into the whole "creation vs evolution" bit, but I think he has a point here, ie they are very nazi-like in their tactics and have to be one of the - if not the - most counter-productive, self-licking ice cream cone organizations in the world.

Welcome to the board.

Allow me to challenge you with those words so often heard on skeptic boards: if you have any evidence for your claim, please present it.

You may not be aware that the ACLU successfully defended a Virginia church that was prohibited from performing baptisms at a local park (info) or that less than twelve months ago, the ACLU helped a student bring a successful lawsuit against her high school because the school censored a Bible quote from the student's yearbook entry (info).


. . . . . . . . . .

Aside: what is a self-licking ice cream cone organization?

 

[hgc]

Re: Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would joi

...
Aside: what is a self-licking ice cream cone organization?

Just a guess here. Whenever I hear something like this I don't understand, I replace the mystery item with a part of anatomy commonly used in insults. Aha... Now it comes together. That's disgusting! And impossible! Sounds like something from BOR's sick fantasy transcript.

 

[Ladewig]

Re: Re: Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would

Just a guess here. Whenever I hear something like this I don't understand, I replace the mystery item with a part of anatomy commonly used in insults. Aha... Now it comes together. That's disgusting! And impossible! Sounds like something from BOR's sick fantasy transcript.

O'Reilly not only wrote a murder mystery book that contained the phrase "hey baby! put down that pipe and get my pipe up" he also released an audio version of the book with his own voice on the tape. Bizarre.

 

[LostAngeles]

Re: Re: Re: B. O'Reilly steps further away from reality: "Hitler and Stalin would join th

Welcome to the board.

Allow me to challenge you with those words so often heard on skeptic boards: if you have any evidence for your claim, please present it.

...

Aside: what is a self-licking ice cream cone organization?

Seconded, seconded, and I think it's a er, "self-gratifying" "Mickey Mouse" organization.

 

[Dorian Gray]

For anyone who doesn't know, in another thread I defended Bill O against what I thought was an unfair criticism from Al Franken.

What about anyone who doesn't care?

Bill the Shill O'Taco Tickler is looking out for YOU, especially if you are an easily impressed and manipulated single female who likes to talk on the phone.

Why hasn't anyone commented on Jerry Springer's radio show?