Merged What the quran really says.

[NekoTheCat]

I'd agree that this is basically a thread of "how I read and interpreted the Qur'an." More interesting I think, is what is likely to have been meant by statements in the Qur'an based on the time period, cultural beliefs of the area, potential motivations of the authors, and how Arabic was viewed/read/used at that time. All of which I would say require a lot of historical research and knowledge that you can't get from just simply reading the book (presumably in English.)

 

[mikeb768]

I can't deal with all that tonight as its time for bed. But I will deal with it tomorrow. In the meantime I see you are agreeing with me that the quran says the sun has an orbit?

Well... It does actually. ...

There is nothing like starting a thread to make a point only to find out that the point which you are trying to make cannot be supported. Not only that, but managing to prove your lack of knowledge regarding the subject at hand.

Our Sun orbits the center of our galaxy, just like all the stars which inhabit the Milky Way. Maybe the provided video will help to shed some light on this subject for you and others.
Location of the Sun in the Milky Way And lastly you also managed to bring to light one of the many miracles of the book which you were trying to discredit.


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[Frozenwolf150]

There is nothing like starting a thread to make a point only to find out that the point which you are trying to make cannot be supported.

Take it from the expert, Scorpion. He knows what he's talking about.

 

[mikeb768]

Take it from the expert, Scorpion. He knows what he's talking about.

Yeah, that thread was actually pretty good.

Although even scientists seem to agree regarding the similitude of Black holes which are often found at the center of galaxies and that of ocean eddies (An eddy is a circular current of water).

"Ocean Eddies Are Mathematically Equivalent to Black Holes", the research which was used to come to this determination was conducted by George Haller, Professor of Nonlinear Dynamics at ETH Zurich, and Francisco Beron-Vera, Research Professor of Oceanography at the University of Miami.
Link

Anyone notice a Similarity?

 

[Craig4]

There is nothing like starting a thread to make a point only to find out that the point which you are trying to make cannot be supported. Not only that, but managing to prove your lack of knowledge regarding the subject at hand.

Our Sun orbits the center of our galaxy, just like all the stars which inhabit the Milky Way. Maybe the provided video will help to shed some light on this subject for you and others.
Location of the Sun in the Milky Way And lastly you also managed to bring to light one of the many miracles of the book which you were trying to discredit.

[qimg]http://s30.postimg.org/s92ld3btp/timeline.jpg[/qimg] [qimg]http://s11.postimg.org/hcq1ezun3/timeline.jpg[/qimg]
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In fairness to Scorpion it is pretty clear that Mohamed made the whole thing up. There's no serious argument to be made that there was anything supernatural in the writing of the Quran. I know some of us would like to know if these is merely a case of Scorpion saying "my made up fairy story is better than the Muslim made up fairy story."

 

[realpaladin]

In fairness to Scorpion it is pretty clear that Mohamed made the whole thing up. There's no serious argument to be made that there was anything supernatural in the writing of the Quran. I know some of us would like to know if these is merely a case of Scorpion saying "my made up fairy story is better than the Muslim made up fairy story."

I second that.

As I said, I suspect Scorpion of trying to rouse us into an anti Islam frenzy.

Scorpion, you are correct in that the quran is incorrect in a lot of things.

That is no surprise.

But what do you want to do with that knowledge?

 

[Craig B]

As I said, I suspect Scorpion of trying to rouse us into an anti Islam frenzy.

I suspect it very strongly.

Muslim Imams ... are liars who must know this is what the Quran really says, however there would be no money in the mosques coffers, and the 50 or more Muslim country's would collapse ... So Muslim Imams conspire to deceive the population with carefully crafted lies ... Imams falsely claim ... But this is utter lies ...

Scorpion, you are correct in that the quran is incorrect in a lot of things. That is no surprise.

Yes. As regards the motion of the sun, how about this?

Qur’an 18:83-86—And they ask you about Dhul-Qarnain. Say: “I shall recite to you something of his story.” Verily, We established him in the earth, and We gave him the means of everything. So he followed a way. Until, when he reached the setting place of the sun, he found it setting in a spring of black muddy (or hot) water.

But what do you want to do with that knowledge?

Rouse us into an anti Islam frenzy, I suspect.

 

[Nay_Sayer]

In fairness to Scorpion it is pretty clear that Mohamed made the whole thing up. There's no serious argument to be made that there was anything supernatural in the writing of the Quran. I know some of us would like to know if these is merely a case of Scorpion saying "my made up fairy story is better than the Muslim made up fairy story."

Has scorpion revealed his/her beliefs?

 

[realpaladin]

Has scorpion revealed his/her beliefs?

Nah, he/she is a hit and run poster.

If the direction of the discussion is not to their liking, they leave.

 

[Craig4]

Has scorpion revealed his/her beliefs?

No, though he's been asked by more people than just me. It really has no impact on what the Quran says but it would be nice to scope what he's trying to accomplish.

 

[Scorpion]

There is nothing like starting a thread to make a point only to find out that the point which you are trying to make cannot be supported. Not only that, but managing to prove your lack of knowledge regarding the subject at hand.

Our Sun orbits the center of our galaxy, just like all the stars which inhabit the Milky Way. Maybe the provided video will help to shed some light on this subject for you and others.
And lastly you also managed to bring to light one of the many miracles of the book which you were trying to discredit.

Either you have not read the opening post, or you fail to comprehend it. I have proved that the quoted hadith says the sun orbits the earth, and it does not speak of the suns orbit in the galaxy. The quoted hadith is a well reputed one and it is a fuller explanation of verse 36.38 from the quran.

 

[Scorpion]

Nah, he/she is a hit and run poster.

If the direction of the discussion is not to their liking, they leave.

I am not a hit and run poster, I am just a late riser. Also I am in England so there may be a time delay. As for my personal beliefs, I do not see what they have to do with this thread.

 

[Scorpion]

I second that.

As I said, I suspect Scorpion of trying to rouse us into an anti Islam frenzy.

Scorpion, you are correct in that the quran is incorrect in a lot of things.

That is no surprise.

But what do you want to do with that knowledge?

That you agree with me is reward enough, I do not need you in a frenzy.

 

[A'isha]

I am not a hit and run poster, I am just a late riser. Also I am in England so there may be a time delay. As for my personal beliefs, I do not see what they have to do with this thread.

Then what is the point of these threads? That the sacred scriptures of an Abrahamic religion aren't actually all that much use as a modern science textbook? Duh...tell us something we don't know.

So...what?

 

[Craig B]

Then what is the point of these threads? That the sacred scriptures of an Abrahamic religion aren't actually all that much use as a modern science textbook? Duh...tell us something we don't know.

So...what?

So ... Muslim literalists are as mistaken as Jewish or Christian ones. But literalism is more prevalent in Islam than in the other faiths. I think that's the message.

 

[Craig4]

I am not a hit and run poster, I am just a late riser. Also I am in England so there may be a time delay. As for my personal beliefs, I do not see what they have to do with this thread.

Great, now what are your religious beliefs? Are you playing a game of "my made up fairy story us better than your made up fairy story"?

 

[Dcdrac]

Ok, so, let's assume the Quran is full of factual errors. Now what?

I mentioned in another thread that I have not found a single religious bible/quran/whathaveyouholyscripture that is correct with the world as we experience it.

The muslems are not unique in this. Have you ever read what Mormons believe? Or Scientology? Or, if you want to really have a jawdrop, Hindu's? Or Buddhists?

It makes sense to defend against people stating actively that the claims in these scriptures are true and that we experience a world that is incorrect.

It makes no sense to try and find something wrong in books written aeons ago and then ask unsuspecting believers to defend those errors.

Imams, Rabbi's, Priests, Yogi's, Politicians... they all do the same thing everybody does:
Being a poor old schmuck, shlepping through life, trying to have a better day than yesterday.
(I am not jewish, I just like some of their words with attached connotations)

I am in complete agreement with this it deserves a bump

 

[Dcdrac]

Then what is the point of these threads? That the sacred scriptures of an Abrahamic religion aren't actually all that much use as a modern science textbook? Duh...tell us something we don't know.

So...what?

Other than a hidden anti Muslim agenda I cannot think of any real reason to focus on just one of the three Abrahamic religion's beliefs and books.

 

[Belz...]

DC

Muslims think the entire quran is the absolute words of God sent down as dictation throught the angel Gabriel. Therefore to show the quran says the sun orbits the earth would utterly destroy this, and leave muslims with no ground to stand on.

No. They'll adapt. Faith is nearly impossible to kill, because humans are mostly predisposed to it.

 

[Scorpion]

Great, now what are your religious beliefs? Are you playing a game of "my made up fairy story us better than your made up fairy story"?

My beliefs are probably best dealt with on another thread, as I can imagine the storm of derision I will create. If I mention I have practical experience of the occult, you will see what I mean, and I do not want to deal with that on this thread.