iPhone 5

[TheL8Elvis]

No, you'll refuse to accept fact. This isn't a matter of conflicting opinions, it's a matter of you being entirely wrong.

How many people do you know using an android device with no Gapps on it ? I don't know any.

Especially a phone.

 

[SatansMaleVoiceChoir]

The few people I know with an Android device don't even know what a widget is - they just bought it because 'the screen was big'. YMMV.

 

[Babbylonian]

How many people do you know using an android device with no Gapps on it ? I don't know any.

Especially a phone.

That wasn't in any way your previous assertion. Your assertion was that Android is "useless" without Google's applications. That is entirely false. An Android phone or tablet can absolutely work just fine (and be just as useful) without the Google applications. Whether the people I know are doing so is entirely irrelevant.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

That wasn't in any way your previous assertion. Your assertion was that Android is "useless" without Google's applications. That is entirely false. An Android phone or tablet can absolutely work just fine (and be just as useful) without the Google applications. Whether the people I know are doing so is entirely irrelevant.

You are correct, it was an overly broad generalization, but I didn't really intend to go down the rabbit hole.

It's possible to use it that way. Nobody actually does because it would be a poor experience, unless you create your own entire ecosystem, like Amazon. Which is not really an option for most users.

Which all ties it in to the tag line about android being "open source" is true, but misleading. Because all the androids anyone actually uses contain all the closed source Gapps.

 

[Babbylonian]

Which all ties it in to the tag line about android being "open source" is true, but misleading. Because all the androids anyone actually uses contain all the closed source Gapps.

Which, again, is utter nonsense. It would be like saying a Steam-based game machine running Linux means that Linux is no longer really open source.

You're completely wrong and I'm out.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

Typical in so many responses we see here on JREF - a comment is made, and certain people try to dig right down in the weeds to prove a point, ignoring the original comment and it's context.

Let me drag you back up into the light - my original comment which sparked this thread of discussion was "I know - they just keep making their products more and more attractive - damn them!"

Can you explain why I don't find Apple products attractive, a clearly subjective term? I'd love to know, because the last time I checked, I found them VERY attractive. I can check again right now, if you like? Hang on....

Yep. Still finding them attractive.

You then replied to my original comment with, "Er, no, that is rather the opposite."

Actually, no it's not. I'm pretty sure I still find Apple products attractive. I did just check too.

I don't presume to speak for others, but I will stick my neck out and assume the 9 million+ people who bought an iPhone 5S/5C in the first 3 days after launch found them quite attractive also. But I could be wrong; after all, attractiveness is a subjective quality...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...ales-break-Apples-records-launch-weekend.html

It is very curious that you are claiming that that statement was the "original comment" when anyone looking at it can tell that it was replying to something. This is self-evidentially a farce.

I know what it was replying to because it was my post.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

The few people I know with an Android device don't even know what a widget is - they just bought it because 'the screen was big'. YMMV.

And yet it doesn't change how useful I find them every day. You're point?

Can I share anecdotes about the silly reasons people have gotten iPhones for ?

 

[SatansMaleVoiceChoir]

It is very curious that you are claiming that that statement was the "original comment" when anyone looking at it can tell that it was replying to something. This is self-evidentially a farce.

I know what it was replying to because it was my post.

This is what happens when you take a facetious reply to a facetious post seriously, or at face value.

So given that you started it, would you care to finish it by explaining why I apparently don't find Apple products more and more attractive? Because I'm still convinced I do.

 

[SatansMaleVoiceChoir]

And yet it doesn't change how useful I find them every day. You're point?

Can I share anecdotes about the silly reasons people have gotten iPhones for ?

Go for it. It'll be fun!

 

[funk de fino]

No, it just means the maps debacle, was, as I claimed, a tempest in a teapot.

While Google maps are still better, I have been using Apple maps in the US for the last year without a problem, and they seem to continually be improving. I can't say for the rest of the world.

No, it was a serious fubar.

 

[quadraginta]

The few people I know with an Android device don't even know what a widget is - they just bought it because 'the screen was big'. YMMV.

It certainly does. Most of the people I know with Android smart phones have a relatively average sized screen. Often they express interest in my Note 2, but usually say that it sure is nice but they don't really want a screen that big. A few say they'd probably get one like it next time they get a new phone.

Whether someone knows exactly what a widget is (as in a correct technical definition) is pretty much meaningless. If they have a weather update on their home screen, or badges on their email or msg icons letting them know they've got incoming unread then they are using widgets. If they want others that do different things then they can add them. It isn't mandatory, but it is available.

Sure, everybody isn't a power user that takes advantage of all the potentials of a computer, but that's always the case. You seem to think of it as some sort of indictment against Android. That makes no sense.

Are iPhones utterly widget free? Well no. At least they didn't used to be, but judging from the number of complaints I've read by iPhone users missing their weather widget in iOS 7 I expect that one will probably resurface.

Will most people with an Apple device know what it is?

 

[quadraginta]

You are correct, it was an overly broad generalization, but I didn't really intend to go down the rabbit hole.

It's possible to use it that way. Nobody actually does because it would be a poor experience, unless you create your own entire ecosystem, like Amazon. Which is not really an option for most users.

Which all ties it in to the tag line about android being "open source" is true, but misleading. Because all the androids anyone actually uses contain all the closed source Gapps.

They include them because they are free, and provide a basic suite of services for the phone. Just like Windows comes with a browser and a note editor (among other things). Only not just like, because Windows isn't free.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

As an example of my experience with maps, about a year ago I went to my grandmother's house. Every mapping solution had it in the wrong location marker. With Google Maps I could report the problem as well as enter Map Maker (which is sort of a more reviewed wiki), and with Apple Maps and Bing Maps I could just report it.

End result is that Apple Maps are still wrong a year out. Why do you hate my grandma ?

 

[SatansMaleVoiceChoir]

It certainly does. Most of the people I know with Android smart phones have a relatively average sized screen. Often they express interest in my Note 2, but usually say that it sure is nice but they don't really want a screen that big. A few say they'd probably get one like it next time they get a new phone.

Whether someone knows exactly what a widget is (as in a correct technical definition) is pretty much meaningless. If they have a weather update on their home screen, or badges on their email or msg icons letting them know they've got incoming unread then they are using widgets. If they want others that do different things then they can add them. It isn't mandatory, but it is available.

Like I said - YMMV. The few people I know with Android phones (all Samsung), all - bar 2 - bought the device based on screen size.

Sure, everybody isn't a power user that takes advantage of all the potentials of a computer, but that's always the case. You seem to think of it as some sort of indictment against Android. That makes no sense.

Nope, that's not what I think. All I'm saying is that (apart from 2) anyone I know who bought an Android device did so based on screen size - not because it was an Android device. One of my S4 owning friends didn't even know his OS was called Android. YMMV.

Are iPhones utterly widget free? Well no. At least they didn't used to be, but judging from the number of complaints I've read by iPhone users missing their weather widget in iOS 7 I expect that one will probably resurface.

Will most people with an Apple device know what it is?

Missing? It's not 'missing' - it has just changed to a more text-based representation, but can still be found by pulling down from the top of the screen.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

Like I said - YMMV. The few people I know with Android phones (all Samsung), all - bar 2 - bought the device based on screen size.

So a self evidentially biased sample then?

 

[quadraginta]

Like I said - YMMV. The few people I know with Android phones (all Samsung), all - bar 2 - bought the device based on screen size.

I think you may need to get outside the garden more often. Merely peeking over the wall from time to time is giving you a distorted view of reality.

Nope, that's not what I think.

If it isn't what you think then why are you saying it?

All I'm saying is that (apart from 2) anyone I know who bought an Android device did so based on screen size - not because it was an Android device.

See above.

One of my S4 owning friends didn't even know his OS was called Android. YMMV.

<snip>

Why do you think this is significant?

I wonder how hard it would be for me to find one of my 5s owning friends who didn't even know their OS was called iOS 7?

Probably not very. Technical proficiency is not a necessary prerequisite for smartphone use in general. Apple has even made that a selling point for their devices. (Remember "The computer for the rest of us."?)

I could probably (as in 'almost certain') find owners of both types of phones without too much trouble who didn't even know what an OS is, much less the name of the one their phone was using.

How significant do you suppose that would be?

 

[SatansMaleVoiceChoir]

So a self evidentially biased sample then?

Did I claim anything else? I'm pretty sure I said 'people I know...'

There may well be lots of people I DON'T know who have Android devices - they just don't seem to be out in public much.

 

[SatansMaleVoiceChoir]

I think you may need to get outside the garden more often. Merely peeking over the wall from time to time is giving you a distorted view of reality.

I'm not sure what you're saying. It's my fault that hardly anyone I know doesn't own an Android device? It's my fault that the offices I work in with about 20 other people, all (bar 2) own some model of iPhone? I'm to blame for the fact that about 80 percent, on average, of people who come into my offices own an iPhone?

If it isn't what you think then why are you saying it?




See above.

And where did I actually say this was an indictment of Andoid devices? Can you show me?

If anything, it's a comment on what motivates certain users to buy particular devices.

Why do you think this is significant?

I didn't suggest it was - can you show me where I did? It was merely an observation on the motivation of some people when it comes to buying devices.

I wonder how hard it would be for me to find one of my 5s owning friends who didn't even know their OS was called iOS 7?

Probably not very. Technical proficiency is not a necessary prerequisite for smartphone use in general. Apple has even made that a selling point for their devices. (Remember "The computer for the rest of us."?)

I'd not be too surprised at all. I have a friend who got a 5S and didn't even know what iMessage was or how to switch it on. It was his first smartphone though, and he was adamant he wanted "the fastest and best".

I could probably (as in 'almost certain') find owners of both types of phones without too much trouble who didn't even know what an OS is, much less the name of the one their phone was using.

How significant do you suppose that would be?

I don't know. I wouldn't presume to assign a value to what you consider 'significant'. I was more interested in what motivates people to buy a device; in my experience it's not usually the OS.

 

[Darat]

I'm not sure what you're saying. It's my fault that hardly anyone I know doesn't own an Android device? It's my fault that the offices I work in with about 20 other people, all (bar 2) own some model of iPhone? I'm to blame for the fact that about 80 percent, on average, of people who come into my offices own an iPhone?

...snip....

No but it is quite interesting that your claimed statistics are widely at odds with the general UK statistics of phone ownership in the UK.

 

[SatansMaleVoiceChoir]

No but it is quite interesting that your claimed statistics are widely at odds with the general UK statistics of phone ownership in the UK.

It's nice that you're interested.

It may also interest you to know that I have 48 contacts on my phone - 31 are idevices; 2 are Android, and the rest are duplicate contacts I've yet to sort out; or landlines.

My point? I dunno - other than I appear to be surrounded by iPhones during my day to day life. YMMV.