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Does God ever fail to keep his promises?

I'm too lazy to read the thread.

My opinion: depends which god you're talking about.
 

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rustypouch said:
I'm too lazy to read the thread.
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Not any different from most, who have all the time in the world when it comes to entertainment, but are too lazy to open their eyes or to look into the claims which the scripture puts forth.

I think the God takes a similar stance to the Government in that "Ignorance of the law is no excuse".

In fact I'm sure of it when God ask the reader following question: "Has there reached you the story of Moses?" [Quran 79:15].

The Gospel of Barnabas shows additional insight regarding this matter of "I'll be OK if I just play dumb or pretend that never heard or saw anything". "And so on the day of judgment none will be able to make any excuse for their sins, seeing that it will then be manifest to them how much God has done for their conversion, and how often he has called them to repentance." [GB:166]

-While ignorance may be bliss, that does not mean that it is without consequences.
 
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sowhat said:
No God = No promises = nothing not to be kept.
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mikeb768 said:
-While ignorance may be bliss, that does not mean that it is without consequences.
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Just as in this life it is possible for someone to drive their vehicle over a cliff, despite the fact they are fully capable of reading and had passed multiple (clear) waring signs before reaching the end of the road.
 
mikeb768 said:
I think I have a solution which we can all agree on. Those who claim my words to be "numerology" can print out the original post and then blacken out the formulas to include any addition "+" symbols, as well as any strange and mystical words such as "phenomenon" or others, leaving only the initial witty poem, the reference to the where the verse is found [89:3] and the following numbers 6555, 6236, 50, 27, 27, and 50. Happy? Are you Happy now!
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Happy? Nope. Numerology is arbitrary because it is based on language and on alphabets.

If you change the spelling of a word when going from one dialect of English to another (e.g. neighbor to neighbour), the numerological value is different.

If you transliterate from one alphabet to the next (e.g. Greek with 24 letters versus English with 26) the value changes again.

And finally, the significance of the numbers themselves is subjective.

Numerology: The ultimate crosswoo puzzle for people who want everything to hold Divine Significance.
 
Astreja said:
Happy? Nope. Numerology is arbitrary because it is based on language and on alphabets.

If you change the spelling of a word when going from one dialect of English to another (e.g. neighbor to neighbour), the numerological value is different.

If you transliterate from one alphabet to the next (e.g. Greek with 24 letters versus English with 26) the value changes again.

And finally, the significance of the numbers themselves is subjective.
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I think what you may be referring to is "cryptography" as in cypher text with your reference to letters which hold numerological values and vice versa. That is a different subject.

Also there is not a whole lot of wiggle room or or "subjectivity" when it comes to counting numbers which are even, and then counting numbers which are odd.

Maybe you can provide an example of the portion which you believe to be subjective?
 
mikeb768 said:
Not any different from most, who have all the time in the world when it comes to entertainment, but are too lazy to open their eyes or to look into the claims which the scripture puts forth.

I think the God takes a similar stance to the Government in that "Ignorance of the law is no excuse".

In fact I'm sure of it when God ask the reader following question: "Has there reached you the story of Moses?" [Quran 79:15].

The Gospel of Barnabas shows additional insight regarding this matter of "I'll be OK if I just play dumb or pretend that never heard or saw anything". "And so on the day of judgment none will be able to make any excuse for their sins, seeing that it will then be manifest to them how much God has done for their conversion, and how often he has called them to repentance." [GB:166]

-While ignorance may be bliss, that does not mean that it is without consequences.
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And you're too lazy too even read the rest of my post.

Why focus on the god of Abraham, and ignore the others?
 
mikeb768 said:
No two Numerologists produce the same results? What are you talking about? I never claimed to be a "Numerologists", and no Numerologists is here claiming to have reproduced these same results.

Now is it possible for someone to count and add numbers in the same manner as I have done, sure it is I actually invited people to do this in my OP. If the results are different then lets find out why, so that we can rule out any mistakes and get closer to the truth.

Can you clarify your post because as it stands it makes no sense and does nothing to add to the discussion. Who is claiming to have done the same thing which I have shown but which produces different results?
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You may not claim to be a numerologist, but you are doing Numerology.

You've taken the number of suras (or whatever) leaving some out (why?) added them up or whatever come out with some other number and said: "Therefore Allah". Some other Numerologist could just as easily use those numbers to "prove" that Mohammad was Chinese.

It's ridiculous. If your faith in your religion is so weak that it needs this kind of psuedo-maths to prop it up, maybe you should think about that.
 
mikeb768 said:
Maybe you can provide an example of the portion which you believe to be subjective?
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The fact that the Qur'an authors decided to select particular passages of verse (no idea how many there might have been initially) and call them "suras," then put them in size order.

I don't think any gods were involved at all. I think it was a group of mullahs and sheikhs playing at being clever with words, and selectively editing them to make the Qur'an seem more divine. The contents certainly don't sound like the work of a deity -- Too vengeful and petty.
 
Brainache said:
You may not claim to be a numerologist, but you are doing Numerology.
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Yes I am guilty of adding numbers. But even when I remove the formulas from the spreadsheet and just write these same numbers on a sheet of paper you still accuse me of Witchcraft/Numerology!

Well if 1+1=2, (thus creating an even number) then I am guilty!
and if 1+2=3, (thus creating an odd number) then I am also guilty!

I imagine the trials in Salem were not so different.
 
mikeb768 said:
Yes I am guilty of adding numbers. But even when I remove the formulas from the spreadsheet and just write these same numbers on a sheet of paper you still accuse me of Witchcraft/Numerology!

Well if 1+1=2, (thus creating an even number) then I am guilty!
and if 1+2=3, (thus creating an odd number) then I am also guilty!

I imagine the trials in Salem were not so different.
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It's not that you are adding numbers that makes what you are doing Numerology, it's that you assign mystical significance to the answers. So what if it works out odd or even, why on earth do you think this is in any way proof of divine inspiration for that collection of barbaric superstition called the Quoran?
 
Brainache said:
It's not that you are adding numbers that makes what you are doing Numerology, it's that you assign mystical significance to the answers. So what if it works out odd or even, why on earth do you think this is in any way proof of divine inspiration for that collection of barbaric superstition called the Quoran?
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I'm not the one making these claims. The author of the revelation is the one who is making the claims. But you should consider the claims which the Quran makes have yet to be disturbed as with [89:3] and in some cases achieved. The Quran is speaking to the person who is reading or listening and saying if what you are reading was from anyone other than God then it would no doubt contain many errors [4:82]. If you cannot produce a book with similar qualities [17:88], ten chapters with similar qualities [11:13], just one chapter with similar qualities [10:38], then it would be most wise for you to accept the claims which the Quran presents.

Or if you feel more compelled by the evidence which was presented by Astreja (the Springy Goddess) then follow her, or follow nothing at all. We are all free to do as we will. Many people are under the false understanding that God needs us, or that God needs us to worship him. Definitely not the case.
 
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mikeb768 said:
On that great day,
what excuse will they say?
When so often they were shown the clear signs,
but they obstinately pushed them away.

Some say the flames will not touch them,
but for a brief short while.
Others disregard this completely,
and say “Nay we shall remain as dust in a pile”.

When the miracles are mentioned,
They say “I only believe what I see”.
And with that God presents to them chapter eighty nine verse three.
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Come on, three pages and no snarky poem in response? You're losing your touch JREF.


The believers, how they pray
For that arbitrary day
When at last, nothing happens
And the world goes on its way.

Some may cite Revelation,
Others Allah's hidden code,
It's all mental masturbation
'Til they spew their holy load.

The miracles are stories
Nothing less and nothing more,
But all these numbers bore me
Like trash that litters the shore.
 
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Frozenwolf150 said:
Come on, three pages and no snarky poem in response? You're losing your touch JREF.


The believers, how they pray
For that arbitrary day
When at last, nothing happens
And the world goes on its way.

Some may cite Revelation,
Others Allah's hidden code,
It's all mental masturbation
'Til they spew their holy load.

The miracles are stories
Nothing more and nothing less,
But numerology bores me
So with that, I must digress.
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That last line could have been better, although a solid effort.
 
mikeb768 said:
<snip>

Or if you feel more compelled by the evidence which was presented by Astreja (the Springy Goddess) then follow her, or follow nothing at all. We are all free to do as we will. Many people are under the false understanding that God needs us, or that God needs us to worship him. Definitely not the case.
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Assuming you're talking about the Christian god, the Bible explicitly states that god wants to be worshiped.

But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
 
mikeb768 said:
Just as in this life it is possible for someone to drive their vehicle over a cliff, despite the fact they are fully capable of reading and had passed multiple (clear) waring signs before reaching the end of the road.
Click to expand...

At the end of this life, the cliff awaits us all. Read the road signs, not the billboards. Enjoy the ride while you may.
 
mikeb768 said:
I'm not the one making these claims. The author of the revelation is the one who is making the claims. But you should consider the claims which the Quran makes have yet to be disturbed as with [89:3] and in some cases achieved. The Quran is speaking to the person who is reading or listening and saying if what you are reading was from anyone other than God then it would no doubt contain many errors [4:82]. If you cannot produce a book with similar qualities [17:88], ten chapters with similar qualities [11:13], just one chapter with similar qualities [10:38], then it would be most wise for you to accept the claims which the Quran presents.
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So I needn't bother then, because the Quoran is full of errors, so we all know that it doesn't come from any god. We also know that writing books is something that people do, not gods.

Or if you feel more compelled by the evidence which was presented by Astreja (the Springy Goddess) then follow her, or follow nothing at all. We are all free to do as we will. Many people are under the false understanding that God needs us, or that God needs us to worship him. Definitely not the case.
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Tell me, how is it that you can know what god thinks? Or are you just believing someone else who claims to know what is in the mind of god? Personally, I wouldn't trust anyone who made such a claim, but if you feel happy doing that, then good luck to you (you are going to need it).
 
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