Proving the Aurora Theater Shooting's official story false

[Anders Lindman]

I mean, it is, in fact, possible to explain the bullet trajectory NOT going through three walls to hit Gage and his teacher, I'm just wondering who is going to be brave enough to actually do it.

Don't underestimate the power of magic bullets. Those are real, according to the government and its yes-sayers, believers and worshipers.

 

[Ladewig]

Hahahahaha. Well, please don't stop.

OK. We won't stop.

Please do the best you can to prove the official story correct in light of my last post.

If you insist on saying there was a bomb under that seat, is there a reason the bomb could not have been planted by Holmes?


I still don't understand why you place so much emphasis on eyewitness testimony. I can find people who say that aliens levitated them and made them float through walls. Is that eyewitness testimony enough to begin searching for aliens?

I also don't understand how you pick whom to believe when there is conflicting eyewitness testimony.


ETA: also, how did you eliminate rifle spalling as the source of the bomb damage to the wall? The two things look remarkably alike to people who are not combat engineers.

MORE ETA: Is it your contention that the vast majority of mass killings in the past few years were influenced, initiated, or otherwise controlled by a specific cabal? I.e. the same people were behind Newton and Aurora and the Boston Marathon.

 

[Regnad Kcin]

Hahahahaha. Well, please don't stop. Please do the best you can to prove the official story correct in light of my last post.

Save for the usual handful of details, the chain of events, along with the participants, have been well established. You say there's an alternate to the conventional wisdom, so it's up to you go articulate and demonstrate and provide evidence for it.

The moon is currently barren of life. However, you say there's a Jiffy Lube 10-Minute Oil Change shop on the far side. Since you're the challenger to established reality, you have to do the work, nobody else.

Prove = demonstrate with proof. Y'know, like you promised in the thread title.

 

[Biscuit]

Hahahahaha. Well, please don't stop. Please do the best you can to prove the official story correct in light of my last post.

So you don't know the provenance of the quotes you are using to "prove" the official story false and you don't have any physical evidence to back up your unsourced quotes.

I can't even give you an A for effort on this one.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Hahahahaha. Well, please don't stop. Please do the best you can to prove the official story correct in light of my last post.

...aaaaaaand we're well into the "dodge every question, throw mud at your opponents and declare victory" stage. It can only go down from here.

I mean, it is, in fact, possible to explain the bullet trajectory NOT going through three walls to hit Gage and his teacher, I'm just wondering who is going to be brave enough to actually do it.

Yeah, really, everyone knows they build theatres to be bullet-proof. Next they'll claim skyscrapers aren't designed to withstand impacts from huge, fully fuelled airliners. They really need to get better at these Official Stories, don't they.

 

[Neveos]

You insistence that the bullets must have passed through 3 walls means you fail geometry.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002989849

This post includes a commonly-reported diagram of where the shooter was in theater 9. There is a significant range of locations near the door he entered (upper right corner of this diagram) that would allow a shot to not hit the "stair well" wall in 9, thus only needing to penetrate 2 walls at most.

Depending on which row the person in theater 8 was in, the angle might only require passing through one wall.

Hahaha. So you wish to redesign the crime scene? That diagram is very much out of date (up to date, now, however, because the theater was redesigned and now somewhat resembles the diagram). Also, that is not an exact layout, and the original website that hosted that image even said so. Here's another diagram that looks more like the actual layout, but you shouldn't accept this one either: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1_QwrYGbvc

Before I show you images you will tell me are out of date, one must also note the blatant problem with the diagram you show simply because the theater was large enough to hold well over 400 people. It is also being said, now in recent hearings, that only one canister was recovered from inside the theater (they appear to want to claim the canister bounced off a railing, causing a smoke trail to appear to come from the "middle light" as was reported, and Seeger and Dates only saw him throw one, and that a second canister was recovered from inside the car).

Now, as for the interior, we have the following image which shows the interior of theater 9, which we know is theater 9 because only theater's 8 and 9 had emergency exits at the top, according to an exployee interviewed after the shooting ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhUxRD7XNwc ):
http://www.cinematour.com/picview.php?db=us&id=25861
http://www.cinematour.com/picview.php?db=us&id=25860
http://www.cinematour.com/picview.php?db=us&id=25859

And, just for reference, this woman claims to be a resident of Aurora, and claims she used to be a manager at the theater, and posted this image saying it is theater 9, and "shows the shooter's vantage point":
http://amandakrause.fsimbs.com/century-16-shooting-another-colorado-tragedy/

From the images, you can clearly see the stairwell walls greatly cover the seated section adjacent to them. A person of standard height standing up out of the chair might barely clear the top of the wall.

However, congratulations. You successfully attempted what I referred to as the way to explain this trajectory. The shooter had to shoot the wall from the ground level. Now you simply have trajectory issues, not to mention the shooter exhausted a shotgun before he switched to the AR, and probably did so after he got on the stairs (I have to find the interview that mentions when the guns were switched).

Hankins was seated four seats in and obviously behind people. His forearm was hit, and it was hit near the elbow, with the bottom half described as "where the shrapnel ended up", lol. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DieJN9ZUD8

oh just found this cover up attempt. Never could find these articles before, and boom. Brings back memories...:

"“At first we thought it was special effects. We saw the floor smoking ... then something flew past my neck,” he said.

It turned out to be a bullet."

http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20120720/news/707219924/print/

"But quickly, Ostergaard realized he was mistaken — when debris began to whizz by his head. It was too dark to see, but what Ostergaard thought was the sound of firecrackers was actually bullets coming through a partition wall into the theater."

http://lakeforest.suntimes.com/news...-man-describes-scene-at-colorado-tragedy.html

Which is in direct contradiction to his interview, and this article:

"Ostergaard was unsure of where the shrapnel came from that struck the teen in his group. He couldn't say whether it was from stray bullets in the neighboring movie theater or if it was from what he described as an "explosion" in a nearby stairwell."

http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Steven-Ostergaard/1824075834

I rather enjoy the position that is occurring at this point. Ok, good. So now the official is that the shooter fired from ground level, and the bullet whizzed by Ostergaard's head... Now it's a simple matter of diagramming the shooter's position...

Anyway, gj. That is how you keep the bullet from passing through 3 walls. Sucks for the official they are actually trying to make it look like Ostergaard experienced a bullet whizzing by his neck despite everything he's already said... That's a big lol. Well, we'll just have to position the shooter, now.

 

[Neveos]

If you insist on saying there was a bomb under that seat, is there a reason the bomb could not have been planted by Holmes?

Like I said, it would work. Hilarious, like most of this thread, but it would work. Obviously a fall-back position that they've already taken precautions for.

 

[Muc]

Well, Golditch's ear was ringing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-7e6paqtII

How is a video of a guy telling how his ear was ringing after a bullet hit him right under it evidence of an "explosion"?

Let me just get this straight:

1) Student hears a "bang" and gunshots.

2) A bit later student is hit by something in the arm.

3) Footballer in another part of the theater turns around, sees that student is hit.

4) Footballer doesn't think much of it and turns back to the movie.

5) Footballer gets hit under the ear.

Is that right? Because that's what the accounts of two of the witnesses that were unfortunate enough to be cherry picked by you suggest. Let me ask you this: Are we talking about a Matrix style slow motion "explosion" here?

 

[Muc]

I mean, it is, in fact, possible to explain the bullet trajectory NOT going through three walls to hit Gage and his teacher, I'm just wondering who is going to be brave enough to actually do it.

Do you need to lie now to hold your story together? I already told you that the teacher's injury was unrelated.

Steven Ostergaard was having a rough trip at a convention in Colorado. He fell and broke his arm Wednesday, but was excited to see the new Dark Knight movie in Aurora, Colorado.

At no point does he say that he was hurt in the shooting.

 

[Muc]

However, congratulations. You successfully attempted what I referred to as the way to explain this trajectory.

People just suggested possibilities. No one here is attemting to explain an actual trajectory because no one, including you, knows the trajectories and the damages done.

oh just found this cover up attempt. ... Ostergaard ... in direct contradiction to his interview

So your trustworthy eyewitness (slightly) contradicts himself, meaning either there is a "cover-up" (your version) and he is not that trustworthy after all, or his recollections are a bit blurry, which is no surprise as people here keep telling you. I guess none of the two versions really helps you.

 

[Neveos]

Do you need to lie now to hold your story together? I already told you that the teacher's injury was unrelated.

yup, irrelevant, just found that out myself.

 

[Neveos]

How is a video of a guy telling how his ear was ringing after a bullet hit him right under it evidence of an "explosion"?

Let me just get this straight:

1) Student hears a "bang" and gunshots.

2) A bit later student is hit by something in the arm.

3) Footballer in another part of the theater turns around, sees that student is hit.

4) Footballer doesn't think much of it and turns back to the movie.

5) Footballer gets hit under the ear.

Is that right? Because that's what the accounts of two of the witnesses that were unfortunate enough to be cherry picked by you suggest. Let me ask you this: Are we talking about a Matrix style slow motion "explosion" here?

Actually, no, he and the doctors called it a clean "through and through" "flesh wound". It would have made about as much noise, as a razor slashing him and making contact with only flesh. So what was this "firecracker" "like a black-cat" caused incessant "ringing" http://s14.postimg.org/twagqndk1/golditchscreenie.png

But I have you guys to thank for my newest discovery, lately.

Golditch, in order to be hit front left side of his neck, and in agreement with his explanation of turning to his right to look at Gage, is seated somewhere in the middle of his row. Meaning there are tons of people in the way of this bullet that sounded like a black cat fire cracker going off and hitting him "in the back of the head".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FI5J3dt7Ig

 

[Neveos]

Nothing quite says it better than:

"To the right of us, right by the stairwell, all 12 of us, heard hissing, and started seeing smoke, saw a/heard a boom and a flash, we heard what we thought were fire crackers, we thought kids were throwing fire crackers"

ETA:

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHA

 

[FrederickEason]

Oh the laughter, of which i am sincerely experiencing, is coming from the realization of the absurdity possessed by those of you that are trying to explain the experiences they report to have had as a collective illusory episode. For instance, the flashes, the hissing sounds, the firecracker popping noises, the heat, they were all experiencing illusions which coincided with shrapnel injuries, and bullet trajectory inconsistencies...

That is a totally valid conclusion. Not at all very sound, but totally valid. Hmmmm

Explanation: Guns, bullets, smoke bombs, panic, and conflicting and essentially unreliable witness testimonies.

No I actually accept that a bullet penetrated the wall and struck Mickayla Hicks sitting next to her friend, Lori Schaffer. They were sitting at the very top left, and the bullet trajectory allows for that possibility considering where the shooter is primarily firing at first. However, just look at where Ostergaard and Hankins are seated, factor in the heat, the explosion testimony, the flash, the hiss, the smoke, and the numerous testimonies of "bombs" of whatever sort, and you have something else entirely.

Explanation: Guns, bullets, smoke bombs, panic, and conflicting and essentially unreliable witness testimonies.

hahaha. Once you realize that no one is yet explaining or accounting for the experiences and literal admissions of explosive devices in theater 8, it becomes apparent that your rhetorical posts are actually just bumping a thread that is ultimately working in the favor of my case.

Nobody admitted anything. Guns and smoke bombs sounds exactly like high explosives to the untrained ear of your average theater patron.

sry, i tend to accept things like eye witness testimony

Untrained eyes and ears of theater patrons are the worst possible tool for identifying weapons.

lol what a hilarious forum, attacking multiple eye witness accounts...

Nobody in their right mind takes you guys seriously, you should know that,... and you probably do.

Those eye witness accounts perfectly describe gun shots and smoke bombs. What do guns and smoke bombs sounds like, if not bangs and hisses?

I mean, it is, in fact, possible to explain the bullet trajectory NOT going through three walls to hit Gage and his teacher, I'm just wondering who is going to be brave enough to actually do it.

Maybe the bullet passed through 3 walls? Bullets are pretty strong, especially the kind of bullets that were being used.

lol, I'll just quote it for you:

"we were sitting on the right side of theater 8, we had a wall for the stair way, and a wall for the hall way" 0:25 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xG-Su7ZIFjA

Bullets have been known to pass through walls before.

You, know just forget about this part:
"To the right of us, right by the stairwell, all 12 of us, heard hissing, and started seeing smoke, saw a/heard a boom and a flash, we heard what we thought were fire crackers, we thought kids were throwing fire crackers"

Guns and smoke bombs look and sound just like that.

From the images, you can clearly see the stairwell walls greatly cover the seated section adjacent to them. A person of standard height standing up out of the chair might barely clear the top of the wall.

Are you saying bullets cannot pass through walls?

Hankins was seated four seats in and obviously behind people. His forearm was hit, and it was hit near the elbow, with the bottom half described as "where the shrapnel ended up", lol.

Are you saying bullets cannot pass through walls?

"“At first we thought it was special effects. We saw the floor smoking ... then something flew past my neck,” he said.

It turned out to be a bullet."

When a maniac is shooting people and throwing smoke bombs, that's the expected result.

"Ostergaard was unsure of where the shrapnel came from that struck the teen in his group. He couldn't say whether it was from stray bullets in the neighboring movie theater or if it was from what he described as an "explosion" in a nearby stairwell."

That "explosion" is most certainly the sound of gun shots and smoke bombs.

So far we have:

• Reports of loud bangs, explosions, flashes, and hissing. These are consistent with gunfire and smoke bombs.
  
• Reports of bullets passing through walls and hitting theater patrons. These are consistent with the known actions of bullets after they are propelled from firearms such as those utilized by the shooter.
  
• A lot of diagrams purporting to show that the bullet could not have made its way through multiple walls, even though there is no evidence that the ammunition utilized would be unable to pass through the walls.

There seems to be very little "proof" to your claims, Neveos.

 

[FrederickEason]

Nothing quite says it better than:

"To the right of us, right by the stairwell, all 12 of us, heard hissing, and started seeing smoke, saw a/heard a boom and a flash, we heard what we thought were fire crackers, we thought kids were throwing fire crackers"

ETA:

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHA

Sounds like guns and smoke bombs to me.

 

[Neveos]

Sounds like guns and smoke bombs to me.

Wow, hey guys, sounds like I have an ally and he doesn't even know it, yet.

Welcome, conspiracy theorist, it's great to have you show up.

 

[Muc]

Actually, no, he and the doctors called it a clean "through and through" "flesh wound". It would have made about as much noise, as a razor slashing him and making contact with only flesh.

That's your opionion, and on page 8 of this thread it appears to me as if your opinion isn't worth that much.

Now, was it a slow-motion explosion or not?

So what was this "firecracker" "like a black-cat" caused incessant "ringing"

The ringing didn't start before he was hit. He also said "black-cats", not "a black-cat", and the answer probably is gunshots.

But I have you guys to thank for my newest discovery, lately.

It's funny how you keep calling things that are pointed out to you "your" discoveries. You're the guy that's obsessed with the topic - you should have known in the first place.

 

[Muc]

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHA

Stop doing that. It makes you look like an immature, snotty idiot before people even read far enough to learn of your delusions.

 

[Neveos]

you should have known in the first place.

Oh, no, I love how this is all playing out. I'm so glad I dropped by. I find this a nice little place to drop by for positive stimulus.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

From the images, you can clearly see the stairwell walls greatly cover the seated section adjacent to them. A person of standard height standing up out of the chair might barely clear the top of the wall.

It seems to me there's a bannister rail a few inches below the top of that wall. What makes you imagine it was so tall?

Having overestimated its height by about 2 feet, do you also think it was designed to be bulletproof? What do you think the construction of that wall was? My guess would be drywall sheet on wooden studding.