Moderated Obama birth certificate CT / SSN CT / Birther discussion

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ArmillarySphere said:
Back in the day, the Postscript printers could be substantially more powerful than the workstations the cash-strapped computer department would provide for the students.
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Yes. At the University of Michigan we were working either on the IBM 3090 mainframe or on sickly little HP 3000 workstations. The massive Postscript page printer, however, could crank out fully-rendered PS print jobs at the rate of about two pages per second. Sure, it was the size of a small car, but it was dang powerful.

...someone decided to test it by generating a 4000x4000 matrix ... and computing its inverse. The admin was not amused.
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That's a small test job by my standards. The HPC solutions I design, provide, and use in computational engineering have solved matrices in up to 1017 unknowns. In case you're wondering, it was a complete CSD model for a large-scale oceangoing vessel.
 
Border Reiver said:
Robert, you realize that NO ONE has their original BC right? Every BC issued by every state, province, territory, nationstate, etc on this planet is a COPY of the Original, which is maintained by the appropriate government body.
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Of course he does. That's why he hasn't responded to anyone pointing it out.

JayUtah said:
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The Birthers loved technicalities when they thought the technicalities were on their side. It was fun to listen to them foam about "layers" and "bit masks" as if they suddenly knew what these things were. Nowadays it's hard to get a Birther to talk about them. Why? Because the world saw them shoot themselves in the foot. "PDFs from scanned documents ever only contain the one layer!" they said. And after quickly realizing that that was a most inexpert position from which to argue, they've been backpedaling ever since and hoping the technical argument would go away.
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"Luncheon meat!" they cry, whenever someone makes an argument they don't understand.
 
Belz... said:
I love conspiracy theorists. Any mistake is evidence of a conspiracy. Anything they can interpret as part of the conspiracy is evidence of a conspiracy. Anything they can't intepret as part of the conspiracy is just more cleverly part of the conspiracy, and therefore evidence of a conspiracy.
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And just to add a level of recursiveness to your comment. If people point out all the things you just pointed out, that's more evidence of a conspiracy.
 
Mojo said:
How would attempts to replicate a pdf image produced by the White House have any bearing on whether the state of Hawaii has committed fraud?
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One out of 1200 replicated might tend to prove innocence. But no such luck.
 
Belz... said:
Maybe they're a bit tired of being asked, you know ?
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They had already answered it officially, in writing, in the appropriate way, to the appropriate people. There is nothing to be gained by having someone provide the same answer, verbally, to people who pretended to represent an irrelevant sheriff's department but really had no legal or statutory authority to make any such request.
 
Alferd_Packer said:
OK, I'll bite. What are the impacts?
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He answered his own question here http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=8591035#post8591035 , since Robert refused to. The distilled version is that since the language in which PDF documents are expressed is a rich, interpreted language with several different ways to accomplish the same visual result, and several different tool chains to produce and prepare PDF files for publication, the Maricopa County Sheriff's ignorant and misguided suggestion that the PDF is valid only if they can exactly reproduce the represented structure of the document is a red herring.

This is, of course, their desperate backpedal from their previous, and ludicrous, position that a scanned document would ever only appear as one object containing the scanned bitmap. Faced with the utter ineptitude expressed in their expectations, they have to try now to save face and come up with new standards that can't be met by legitimate PDFs, whether they're realistic and technically valid or not. So the new MCSO "standard" is that a valid PDF can have only one particular set of objects in it for any one given visual rendering.

Sigh.
 
Thanks. I figured it would be something like that.

I was also wondering when someone would bring up the concept of sensitive dependence on initial conditions, which you did.

Good job.
 
Larry Klayman of Judicial Watch Weighs In on BC Fraud

Larry Klayman of Judicial Watch Weighs in on Obama Birth Fraud

OBAMA LAWYER WARNED AGAINST CERTIFYING ELIGIBILITY
'For any party official to do so would be to perjure him or herself'
Sept., 4, 2012


Altered

Klayman said the only Hawaii statute allowing birth certificates “to be non-legally binding” is the law regarding “late” or “altered” certificates, which states: “The probative value of a ‘late’ or ‘altered’ certificate shall be determined by the judicial or administrative body or official before whom the certificate is offered as evidence.”

“Unless and until Mr. Obama’s original birth record, on file with the Department of Health in Hawaii, is presented as evidence to a judicial or administrative body or official, it cannot legally be considered to have probative value. In other words … it cannot stand alone without further corroboration, as required by an ‘administrative body or official,” Klayman wrote.

"Klayman’s conclusion is that “no one can state with any legal certainty that candidate Obama is even old enough to be president, much less that he meets the exclusively high bar of ‘natural-born citizen’ status, required by Article II, Section I, Clause 5.”

http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/obama-lawyer-warned-against-certifying-eligibility/?cat_orig=us

Larry Klayman of Judicial Watch Warns Dem Officials of Perjury

August 29, 2012

http://www.wnd.com/files/2012/09/BauerLetter.pdf
 
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Robert Prey said:
One out of 1200 replicated might tend to prove innocence. But no such luck.
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fail on your part and why the Cold cuts pOsse was nothing but a joke. they didn't even bother to investigate exactly the computer, setup, machine/copier to even attempt to replicate down to a minute details of what was done to scan the ORIGINAL CERTIFIED Paper copy provided to the White House staff by the State of Hawaii.

Oh and btw, not all scans are the same. You can scan a document 5 times on the same machine, and each time the software or even the processing will process it differently.
 
Using world nut daily as your source, and known right wing nut job Larry Klayman about eligibility is like asking a janitor to perform brain surgery.
 
Robert Prey said:
“altered” certificates, which states: “The probative value of a ‘late’ or ‘altered’ certificate shall be determined by the judicial or administrative body or official before whom the certificate is offered as evidence.”
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You'd need to provide evidence that causes reasonable doubt that it's an original and unaltered document first, don't you think?

But let's say for the sake of argument you were able to provide the evidence that holds up to scrutiny and manage to get the original birth certificate and it comes to light that he really was born in America... What are you going to do then?
 
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