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Barrack Obama, liar.

Dumb All Over said:
Does watching the entire speech live as it happened three years ago count?
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Actually, no. A vague, three year old memory is something I do not assign much weight to, even when it's my memory -- much less an anonymous character on the internet.
 
Mike! said:
I don't know that I've ever heard the question asked before
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Do you suppose that might be because we've never had a President who had large amounts of money in Swiss bank accounts?

it sure sounds a lot like, 'Can you name any other President who had to show a birth certificate before?
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Do you see the factual basis for the observation that Romney has a history of sequestering funds in offshore accounts to be on an equal par with the factual basis for questioning Obama's citizenry status?
 
Dymanic said:
Do you suppose that might be because we've never had a President who had large amounts of money in Swiss bank accounts?
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I don't know where the other presidents kept their pocket money or anything else for that matter. I seriously don't recall ever hearing anything about it before. I'm one of the little people, so all I know is, for as long as I can remember, there hasn't been a guy in the White House who didn't have a serious scad of cash before he got the job, including the cat that lives there now. Why has it suddenly become an issue? I'm fairly sure Obama is a millionaire too. Have we quized him on where he keeps his sock full of money?
 
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Mike! said:
Why has it suddenly become an issue?
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Really? You don't see why it's an issue?

I'm fairly sure Obama is a millionaire too. Have we quized him on where he keeps his sock full of money?
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For one thing, unlike his opponent ("presumed" it suddenly seems prudent to begin adding again), Obama has released 12 years of tax returns (as I see someone has just pointed out). For another, Obama has often taken care to include himself among the affluent segment of our society whom he believes should be paying more in taxes. If evidence emerged that he had money squirrelled away in offshore accounts, that would be very politically damaging to him indeed.

Now. Two important questions:
(1) Do you see any basis for any such claim?
(2) Do you see any basis for disputing Romney's history of stashing money offshore (especially considering that he has openly admitted it)?

Unless you can answer yes to both, it's a false comparison.
 
Dymanic said:
Really? You don't see why it's an issue?

For one thing, unlike his opponent ("presumed" it suddenly seems prudent to begin adding again), Obama has released 12 years of tax returns (as I see someone has just pointed out). For another, Obama has often taken care to include himself among the affluent segment of our society whom he believes should be paying more in taxes. If evidence emerged that he had money squirrelled away in offshore accounts, that would be very politically damaging to him indeed.

Now. Two important questions:
(1) Do you see any basis for any such claim?
(2) Do you see any basis for disputing Romney's history of stashing money offshore (especially considering that he has openly admitted it)?

Unless you can answer yes to both, it's a false comparison.
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Offshore accounts, if any, are routinely reported with the 1040 on a form designed for that purpose. Income such as interest from those accounts is so reported, and US tax is paid on those income streams.

Laws on reporting of offshore accounts changed in 2010, but have also changed over the years several other times.

I have to admit to finding it puzzling as to why any one would think there was something "patriotic" about keeping money in US on-shore accounts versus off-shore. I own stock in an English liquor distributor. Does that make me unpatriotic, and should I only own stock in a US liquor distributor?

Maybe there's a sort of aura of illegality associated with "offshore bank accounts". But for a great many people, both in small business or way up there in big business, they are routine and are related to sound business or personal reasons.

These aren't the Droids you are looking for.

:)
 
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mhaze said:
I have to admit to finding it puzzling as to why any one would think there was something "patriotic" about keeping money in US on-shore accounts versus off-shore.
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Are you equally puzzled as to why anyone might consider it unpatriotic (as well as thoroughly dishonest) for a US Presidential candidate who places great emphasis on his track record as a "job creator" turns out to have been actively engaged in the dismantling of companies in the US and sending the jobs overseas, or why business activities that might be considered routine for a great many people might be considered inappropriate for a US Presidential candidate?

ETA: Your Jedi tricks don't work on me.
 
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Dymanic said:
Are you equally puzzled as to why anyone might consider it unpatriotic (as well as thoroughly dishonest) for a US Presidential candidate who places great emphasis on his track record as a "job creator" turns out to have been actively engaged in the dismantling of companies in the US and sending the jobs overseas, or why business activities that might be considered routine for a great many people might be considered inappropriate for a US Presidential candidate?

ETA: Your Jedi tricks don't work on me.
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I think the Romney campaign has well answered the smear attempt based on the Bain Capital issue, so I'm not really sure what you're asking...for repetition of well understood facts and positions?

FYI, some time ago I read the entire business history of Romney, and although in many ways he does not impress me, that history did. Just trying to answer you honestly here.
 
mhaze said:
I think the Romney campaign has well answered the smear attempt based on the Bain Capital issue, so I'm not really sure what you're asking
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I guess what I'm asking is whether you acknowledge the simple reality that a US President -- or any candidate for that office -- is held to a higher standard than "a great many people" (whether "in small business or way up there in big business" or whatever).
 
Sometimes I think Hillary was right about a vast right-wing conspiracy.

Early on in his administration, President Obama was called a liar by conservatives. Remember member of Congress Wilson shouting out "you lie" during a truthful statement by the President during a joint meeting? Politicians, pundits, talk-show hosts, and the grassroots from the right are very comfortable calling the President a liar and do so often.

At my place of employment, a truck-driver came in the door one day shaking his head and saying "there goes Obama again, lying!" I was curious. What is the lie he's telling, I asked. The driver said that Rush Limbaugh was exposing Obama's lies about the Statue of Liberty, the comments made by the President during a speech on immigration.

When I got home I looked up Obama's speech and Limbaugh's comments. Rush was criticizing the President's mention of the Statue as a symbol of immigration. Other conservative commentators I found (along with the driver's comments) argued that Obama was misrepresenting the Statue by linking it to pro-immigration sentiment when in fact the "original intent" of the Statue was as a beacon of "Liberty."

Obviously, President Obama was not lying about the Statue of Liberty. Since the early 1900's the Statue has been a symbol of immigration because of its proximity to immigrants' port of call, Ellis Island, and because of the famous pro-immigration poem, "The New Colossus," dedicated in 1903 and placed on a plaque inside the Statue's base.

The President's remarks were not a lie but seemed so to anti-immigration, anti-Progressive Age conservatives who accept only original intent while disallowing changing views and meanings. By such lights, it would be a lie to say the swastika was a symbol of the Third Reich, given that originally it was a theosophy symbol.

Why is the right seeing lie in everything Obama? Some of it I think is just bitter retaliation. Many on the left were willing to define George W. as a liar when it came to his administration's stated justification for waging unprovoked war against Iraq. Comedians like left-leaning Al Franken were habitually calling Fox News channel talk-hosts liars. (IMHO, there is much more lying going on in conservative media and politicians than in their liberal counterparts.)

And, since the machinery of the conservative/Republican movement was set up in the eighties (think-tanks, take over of talk radio, cable news channels, political solidarity, etc.), the Regressives have tried to create a social panic whenever a Democrat achieves high office (with such claims as unAmericanism, covert murder -Vince Foster, anyone?-, covert Muslim, Manchurian Candidate, etc.) This allows Regressives to have base support in trying to stop Democratic Presidents' agendas by never ending harassment, via several congressional investigations during Clinton's administration and Republican obstruction during Obama's.
 
jerrywayne said:
Early on in his administration, President Obama was called a liar by conservatives. Remember member of Congress Wilson shouting out "you lie" during a truthful statement by the President during a joint meeting? Politicians, pundits, talk-show hosts, and the grassroots from the right are very comfortable calling the President a liar and do so often.
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At a family dinner tonight, my father was telling me about how he had to get blood work done. He does not have health insurance, so he went to a lab and they said it would cost $447 and fifty cents. Dad always gives exact figures. He asked the Guy behind the counter...

Dad: Why so much? I came here four years ago and it was three times less.
Guy: You can thank your president for that.

My father, a hard-core Democrat, said he wanted to

Dad: rip his throat out.
Pause, afterthought...
Dad: Mexican guy, too.
Me: Oh...

My father's an immigrant, so he thinks in racial terms. Like all immigrants. Anyway, he calls the doctor who then recommended a lab across the street. This place offered to do it for

Dad: One-hundred and sixty-seven dollars.
Me: Flat?
Dad: Flat.
Me: See Dad, that's the beauty of the free market.
Dad: **** you and the free market.
 
Dymanic said:
See, the thing is, we're talking about a guy who's running for President of the United States. Any person with such aspirations must expect to be held to a different standard (right down to avoiding careless statements regarding his preferences in vegetables). That's just the way it is.

Can you name any US President in history who had money stashed in a Swiss bank account?
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I can't imagine what would be wrong with that.

Now, if it was a Cuban bank account...
 
Chaos said:
Conspiracy, huh?

A conspiracy implies secrecy. The right-wing hatred of Obama is right there in the open.
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You could make a case that there is a conspiracy to harm the country. Only Rush Limbaugh was brave enough to come right out and say he wanted America to fail, but practically every Republican in Congress is doing as much as they can to prevent anything good from happening. That goes beyond just hating Obama. It is damn near treason. Obviously they won't come out and admit this, so you could justifiably call it a 'conspiracy'.
 
Tricky said:
You could make a case that there is a conspiracy to harm the country. Only Rush Limbaugh was brave enough to come right out and say he wanted America to fail, but practically every Republican in Congress is doing as much as they can to prevent anything good from happening. That goes beyond just hating Obama. It is damn near treason. Obviously they won't come out and admit this, so you could justifiably call it a 'conspiracy'.
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"The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president." -Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell
 
Monketey Ghost said:
Will I be ripped off if I try to buy this used President?
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You can't. The DNC already "bought" him, in about 2008. You snooze, you lose.

Get up earlier and line up to buy one in the 2016 primaries. That's where the bargain shoppers go.
 
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