Continuation: Discussion of the George Zimmerman case

[Rare Truth]

Thanks for backing up your statements and responding to my questions.

Your posts exhibit to me an inability to even read. The "second request" I referred to was about the shell casing - and you DID NOT quote it in your link.

Further, if you found it difficult to read that report and CANNOT conclude they found the casing under the body, I don't know what to tell you.

This is what I meant before by chasing tail around - you complain about things not being backed up - when they are - what it appears you want is someone to read it and comprehend it for you too.

When it gets as simple as what was posted:

After a visual search of the area failed to turn up the cartridge, I got the metal detector and began to scan the area where the victim had lain. I did one sweep of the area with negative results and then reset the sensitivity of the metal detector. As I started again I heard a strong tone and looked in the area. I did not see anything so I marked the area and instructed CST smith to check the area again visually and I moved on.

Before I got to the end of the sweep CST Smith told me she had found [the] casing just inches from where I had placed the marker.​

And then you ask: "Highlight the part that demonstrates the cartridge was underneath the body, please:"

Well, it just tells me your intent is more to instigate, and not really learn.

I bore quickly of such games.

 

[triforcharity]

http://timenewsfeed.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/rtr328bf.jpg

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/dam/news/images/2012/05/zimmerman-top-head-0517.JPG

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/dam/news/images/2012/05/zimmerman-nose-closeup-0517.JPG

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/dam/news/images/2012/05/zimmerman-chin-scrape.JPG

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/dam/news/images/2012/05/GEORGE-ZIMMERMAN-FACE-CLOSEUP-0517.jpg

Hopefully the high-res photo links still work.

They work, thanks. Just had a chat with some of my coworkers, and none believe that GZ was savagely beaten, nor was his head slammed on any sidewalk, let alone repeatedly.

A fall, sure, not a repeated slamming. No swelling, no bruising around the area, nothing.

Superficial scratching on his face, but again, no bruising, no swelling (other than his nose) no evidence of a savage beating.

Sorry, not buying HZ's story of any kind of beating like he describes.

 

[Bob001]

He saw TM in the side yard, not 'walking down the street'.....
Your post is very ignorant of the facts.
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/17/v-fullstory/2700249/trayvon-martin-shooter-a-habitual.html

The "side yard" was apparently a shared backyard 70 yards from where TM was staying, and part of a recognized shortcut to the 7-11:
http://www.miamiherald.com/trayvon/
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...eading-to-the-shooting-of-trayvon-martin.html [Be sure to click the arrows for individual close-ups and a time-line.]

The link you posted isn't very flattering to GZ, or the Sanford police:

"..... At the focal point of a shooting scandal: a mild-mannered neighbor who fixated on crime and focused on young, black males. .... Zimmerman went door-to-door asking residents to be on the lookout, specifically referring to young black men who appeared to be outsiders.... “These a--holes always get away,” Zimmerman complained. .... In 2010, police waited seven weeks to arrest a lieutenant’s son who was caught on video sucker-punching a homeless black man.....In 2005, two security guards — one the son of a longtime Sanford police officer and the other a department volunteer — killed a black man they said was trying to run them over. Black leaders complained of a lackluster investigation....."

 

[TheL8Elvis]

After a visual search of tOe area felled to turn up the cartridge I got the metal deleolor and began to soan the area where the vicflm had lainlain. I did one sweep of the area with negative results and then reset thesensitivity of the metal det$ctor. As I s;tarted again I neard a strong tone and looked In the area. I did not seeanything so I marked the area, ahd Instruoted CST Smith to check ttDe 31'$8 again visually and I moved on. Before t got to the end of the sweep CST Smith told me that she had found casing just Inches from where I hadp.aeed the marker. CST Smith documented and recovered a 9mm Luger S&B cartridge oase.

If you think that means under the body , *shrugs*

Your posts exhibit to me an inability to even read. The "second request" I referred to was about the shell casing - and you DID NOT quote it in your link.

See above, where I quoted the report. Then reconsider your remark about inability to read.

Further, if you found it difficult to read that report and CANNOT conclude they found the casing under the body, I don't know what to tell you.

This is what I meant before by chasing tail around - you complain about things not being backed up - when they are - what it appears you want is someone to read it and comprehend it for you too.

When it gets as simple as what was posted:

After a visual search of the area failed to turn up the cartridge, I got the metal detector and began to scan the area where the victim had lain. I did one sweep of the area with negative results and then reset the sensitivity of the metal detector. As I started again I heard a strong tone and looked in the area. I did not see anything so I marked the area and instructed CST smith to check the area again visually and I moved on.

Before I got to the end of the sweep CST Smith told me she had found [the] casing just inches from where I had placed the marker.​

And then you ask: "Highlight the part that demonstrates the cartridge was underneath the body, please:"

In the area where the victim had lain is not the same thing as underneath where the victim had lain. No matter how much you want it to be, you are reading more into the statement than is written there.

It means they found the cartridge in the area where the victim had lain. A few inches to the left, a few inches to the right, above, underneath ... I don't know, because the report isn't specific.

Well, it just tells me your intent is more to instigate, and not really learn.

I bore quickly of such games.

It has to do with being accurate, not just making assumptions.

Now, the second question you haven't answered.

You really like avoiding answering. You don't believe the first picture is accurate. So....

If you don't believe the second picture is accurate, please, don't feel like you have only two options. Tell us what position you think they were in when GZ shot TM.​

 

[Natural Born Skeptic]

Now, on the issue of self-injuring. Is that somehow impossible?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-letter-B-face-robbery-story-police-say.html

And she didn't have a motive to do this.

OK, now that we all know that crazy woman self-injured herself cutting a backwards B into her face while looking in the mirror, that changes everything! You proved it! For a moment there I was worried that you'd choose some completely ridiculous example that not only has 0 relevance but isn't even in the same universe.

BTW, she did have a motive, that's why she did it.

Does someone really need to explain to you the difference between a self-injuring woman carving a latter in her face, versus a person who we know for a fact was in a physical struggle, who was photographed minutes after his encounter, and examined by emergency medical personnel?

BTW, you have asked countless times throughout this thread why there isn't certain DNA evidence on TM or GZ etc. Please explain and reference why we should expect there to be, other than you thinking there should be. A research paper or similar explaining what you are basing your assumption on. Not some webpage article written by some guy who figured out how to write a blog.

 

[crimresearch]

I think we all get that GZ had the sense not to call the cops and say "I see black people!" What he did do is see black people and conclude that they were suspicious. He saw TM walking down the street at 7 p.m., and told police that he was "a suspicious guy... looks like he's up to no good or he's on drugs .... just walking around and looking about." It would be interesting to know how many, if any, of GZ's calls resulted in arrests, or even any direct contacts between police and GZ's "suspects." And if it was as crime-ridden as you say, it sounds like the Neighborhood Watch wasn't very effective. It wouldn't have cost much to install some cameras at the community access points, or even locked gates with passcard access.

And if GZ wasn't paying rent to somebody who was not the owner, was he paying it to somebody who was? Or did he expect a free ride?

And yet, that is exactly what you claimed he reported... and argue in support of *after* it was disproven.

And since you already know that arrests resulted, your choice to keep regurgitating these stale falsehoods is a waste of time.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

The "side yard" was apparently a shared backyard 70 yards from where TM was staying, and part of a recognized shortcut to the 7-11:
http://www.miamiherald.com/trayvon/
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...eading-to-the-shooting-of-trayvon-martin.html [Be sure to click the arrows for individual close-ups and a time-line.]

That doesn't change the fact you claimed TM was on the sidewalk, GZ says he saw him in the side yard, looking about.

Is there something wrong with trying to being accurate in your claims?

The link you posted isn't very flattering to GZ, or the Sanford police:

"..... At the focal point of a shooting scandal: a mild-mannered neighbor who fixated on crime and focused on young, black males. .... Zimmerman went door-to-door asking residents to be on the lookout, specifically referring to young black men who appeared to be outsiders.... “These a--holes always get away,” Zimmerman complained. .... In 2010, police waited seven weeks to arrest a lieutenant’s son who was caught on video sucker-punching a homeless black man.....In 2005, two security guards — one the son of a longtime Sanford police officer and the other a department volunteer — killed a black man they said was trying to run them over. Black leaders complained of a lackluster investigation....."

Did you know GZ tried to organize support for that homeless black man ?
http://www.scribd.com/doc/87688384/Zimmerman-family-member-letter-to-NAACP

 

[crimresearch]

Well, I mean actually underneath the fingernails. But if what you say is correct then it's not impossible.

It isn't impossible if George had a trunk monkey.

In the seconds between the time we can hear the shot, and the arrival of the police, the evidence of Zimmerman breaking his *own* nose, and inflicting those injuries wouldn't be washed away by some first aid at the scene.

What you responded to is just more conspiracy theorist's mirroring, in order to pretend that the real world matches their imaginary TV script

 

[LTC8K6]

They work, thanks. Just had a chat with some of my coworkers, and none believe that GZ was savagely beaten, nor was his head slammed on any sidewalk, let alone repeatedly.

A fall, sure, not a repeated slamming. No swelling, no bruising around the area, nothing.

Superficial scratching on his face, but again, no bruising, no swelling (other than his nose) no evidence of a savage beating.

Sorry, not buying HZ's story of any kind of beating like he describes.

I actually think it's very obvious that he was punched many times and his head was banged on something hard many times.

I have no trouble believing TM beat the crap out of GZ that night.

 

[Bob001]

That doesn't change the fact you claimed TM was on the sidewalk, GZ says he saw him in the side yard, looking about.

Is there something wrong with trying to being accurate in your claims?

By "on the street" I meant outdoors in a public place where he had a right to be. (When Springsteen sings about being "Out in the Street" he doesn't necessarily mean the marked pavement.) Although I didn't say "sidewalk," I get your point and I appreciate your correction. We should all strive for precision. Let's say TM was walking "outdoors in a public place where he had a right to be."

Did you know GZ tried to organize support for that homeless black man ?
http://www.scribd.com/doc/87688384/Zimmerman-family-member-letter-to-NAACP

Yes, I did see those reports, and also the reports that he served as a "mentor" to some black kids. That tells me that, like most of us, GZ is a complex human being with multiple motivations. But I think that in this case, GZ decided that somebody who fit a profile must be a criminal, and then he decided it was his right and duty to "protect" his community from that criminal. If he had just called the cops and stayed in his truck TM would be alive and GZ wouldn't be in jail.

 

[bynmdsue]

If TM hadn't punched GZ in the face he'd still be alive. If TM hadn't gotten suspended from school for drugs, he'd still be alive. How far far back should we go with the if's?

 

[crimresearch]

They work, thanks. Just had a chat with some of my coworkers, and none believe that GZ was savagely beaten, nor was his head slammed on any sidewalk, let alone repeatedly.

A fall, sure, not a repeated slamming. No swelling, no bruising around the area, nothing.

Superficial scratching on his face, but again, no bruising, no swelling (other than his nose) no evidence of a savage beating.

Sorry, not buying HZ's story of any kind of beating like he describes.

I haven't seen where GZ was the one proclaiming Trayvon's MMA expertise and 'impossible to defend against' use of 'the mount'... those seem to have been fabricated by the CT internet tough guys around here.

His actual choice of overly dramatic modifiers to describe his perceptions of being on the receiving end of a battery, isn't that significant. It happened, the injuries are real.

The crux of the matter is what happened next. Either Martin went for the gun (or made some move that was interpreted as such)... or he didn't.

 

[Amazer]

I actually think it's very obvious that he was punched many times and his head was banged on something hard many times.

I have no trouble believing TM beat the crap out of GZ that night.

And like Triforcharity you are an experienced EMT?

 

[LTC8K6]

And like Triforcharity you are an experienced EMT?

I'm an experienced board poster.

I'm sure the defense can find a friendly EMT to counter the prosecution's unfriendly EMT.

So then we will be down to asking if any jurors are, or have been...

 

[TheL8Elvis]

And like Triforcharity you are an experienced EMT?

I think we all know how well the "internet doctor" thing worked out earlier in the thread.

 

[LTC8K6]

Besides, GZ doesn't need to have any bad injuries, or even any injuries at all...

 

[bookworm]

I actually think it's very obvious that he was punched many times and his head was banged on something hard many times.

I have no trouble believing TM beat the crap out of GZ that night.

I agree. The witness said he was beating the crap out of him. (Not his exact words)

 

[LTC8K6]

I agree. The witness said he was beating the crap out of him. (Not his exact words)

IMO, the case is almost exactly the same, even if GZ appears to be uninjured, and was only punched in the nose once.

GZ's injuries are almost irrelevant to his case, imo.

 

[crimresearch]

And like Triforcharity you are an experienced EMT?

I've got some experience in EMS. Rescue squad, wilderness rescue, police 1st responder.

The MDs and paramedics have made their reports, the photos have been cleared up from the fakes, and I agree with them. Zimmerman was battered. He wasn't beaten severely.

Do you have some facts, or are you simply playing the game it looks like you are playing, of running away between these drive-by pooh flingings?

 

[Amazer]

IMO, the case is almost exactly the same, even if GZ appears to be uninjured, and was only punched in the nose once.

GZ's injuries are almost irrelevant to his case, imo.

So it all hinges on GZ's claim that TM went for his gun?