Merged Are you now or have you ever been

[Tsukasa Buddha]

What I love is that the CP-USA acknowledges that this would be a bad thing for Democrats:



Cast a shadow?

In fact, West simply pointed out that the House Progressive Caucus might as well be the Communist Party. It's fair to say that's a bit over the top, but only a bit.

That is all.

 

[jj]

Given that by the current Republicon standards Eisenhower, Nixon, Ford, and even Reagan were "socialists", I'm not particularly surprised. The FUD (that's Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt, the modern equivelent of "BOMFOG" [look it up]) put out for the sole and only purpose of enflaming and alarming the ignorant after 9-11 has done more damage to this country, its people, its economy, and its politics than the vile terrorists themselves.

This is just more FUD, more fearmongering for the frightened masses who have been taught that creationism is science by their religious and political leaders.

 

[leftysergeant]

This is just more FUD, more fearmongering for the frightened masses who have been taught that creationism is science by their religious and political leaders.

West is both. Dominionist whacktard, that one.

 

[Virus]

How do you stand it living with those socialist police and fire departments? And that commie built highway system, that must drive you nuts.

Socialism is state ownership of the means of production. Not state ownership of the police.

 

[Chaos]

Socialism is state ownership of the means of production. Not state ownership of the police.

Then you admit that there is nothing socialist whatsoever about the Democrats and their policies?

 

[Cleon]

In fact, West simply pointed out that the House Progressive Caucus might as well be the Communist Party.

Wow. Look, I know you feel compelled to try and spin this somehow, but really? That's not remotely what he said, and you know it.

I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party.

 

[Cleon]

Politifact's take on the issue is rather entertaining. (Naturally, they rated Allen's claim a "pants on fire.")

Applicants have to apply through the national or local organizations and pay dues. Even if prospective members applied through a local group, Piana said he’d hear about it. (Generally, the party no longer issues cards. If someone asks for them, there are some older cards on hand.)

"Trust me -- if a member of Congress applied to join the Communist Party we would know about it," Piana said. "It would set up some red flags -- pardon the pun."

The Progressive Caucus promotes policies that the Communist Party thinks are better for the country than some promoted by other caucuses, but "our support of their policies does not mean they support us or our policies. That is pretty much guilt by association on steroids,’’ Piana said.

Gotta hand it to the CP for having a sense of humor, at least.

 

[Spindrift]

What I love is that the CP-USA acknowledges that this would be a bad thing for Democrats:



Cast a shadow?

In fact, West simply pointed out that the House Progressive Caucus might as well be the Communist Party. It's fair to say that's a bit over the top, but only a bit.

Every member of the Republican party is a racist since the KKK likes the Republicans. Okay maybe that's a bit over the top, but only a bit.

 

[eeyore1954]

Wow. Look, I know you feel compelled to try and spin this somehow, but really? That's not remotely what he said, and you know it.

I don't agree with him but I think it is more than remotely what he was trying to say.
In my reading it was exactly what he was trying to say.


From the politifact article

"It's a good question. I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party. ... It’s called the Congressional Progressive Caucus."

but just look at the words and actions of the Progressive Caucus. You can call them socialist, Marxist, communist or whatever you want, but the point is, they oppose free markets and individual economic freedom, they want to redistribute wealth, and they want to see the nation fundamentally transformed.

 

[DavidJames]

I love the smell of apologists in the morning.

 

[Cleon]

I don't agree with him but I think it is more than remotely what he was trying to say.
In my reading it was exactly what he was trying to say.

"I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party."

Your spin might have some legitimacy to it if he'd said "78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are Communists." But he said, specifically, "members of the Communist Party." Words mean things.

but just look at the words and actions of the Progressive Caucus. You can call them socialist, Marxist, communist or whatever you want, but the point is, they oppose free markets and individual economic freedom, they want to redistribute wealth, and they want to see the nation fundamentally transformed.

You know that was after the fact, right? The fact that he's using the same spin you are doesn't magically make it accurate.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

I don't agree with him but I think it is more than remotely what he was trying to say.
In my reading it was exactly what he was trying to say.


From the politifact article

"It's a good question. I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party. ... It’s called the Congressional Progressive Caucus."

but just look at the words and actions of the Progressive Caucus. You can call them socialist, Marxist, communist or whatever you want, but the point is, they oppose free markets and individual economic freedom, they want to redistribute wealth, and they want to see the nation fundamentally transformed.

No way!

You just claimed that the second quote was the words of the Politifact article writer. They are not! You left out some important quotation marks and attribution. Those are the words of Allen West from his Facebook page.

It is not reasonable to say that the Progressive Caucus are people who "oppose free markets and individual economic freedom" and "want to redistribute wealth".

ETA: Politifact rated this one "Pants on Fire" even with West's post-hoc attempts to spin what he said as something other than what he said.

 

[Brainster]

Wow. Look, I know you feel compelled to try and spin this somehow, but really? That's not remotely what he said, and you know it.

Moderator: "What percentage of the American legislature do you think are card-carrying Marxists or International Socialist?"

West: "It's a good question. I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party. ... It’s called the Congressional Progressive Caucus."

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

"
Your spin might have some legitimacy to it if he'd said "78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are Communists." But he said, specifically, "members of the Communist Party." Words mean things.

More importantly, the question he was answering was made unequivocally clear:

Moderator: "What percentage of the American legislature do you think are card-carrying Marxists or International Socialist?"

West: "It's a good question. I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party. ... It’s called the Congressional Progressive Caucus."

He not only claimed they are members of the Communist Party (not "communists" with a little "c") but that they are card-carrying! He can't wriggle out of this by saying that he only meant that their economic views are progressive.

 

[Biscuit]

I don't agree with him but I think it is more than remotely what he was trying to say.
In my reading it was exactly what he was trying to say.


From the politifact article

Oh god I am getting dizzy!

 

[Cleon]

Moderator: "What percentage of the American legislature do you think are card-carrying Marxists or International Socialist?"

West: "It's a good question. I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party. ... It’s called the Congressional Progressive Caucus."

Yes. He was specifically asked about "card-carrying Marxists or International Socialist," and he specifically said that the Congressional Progressive Caucus were "members of the Communist Party."

Not "may as well have been members" of the Communist Party.
Not "sympathizers" of the Communist Party.
Not "allies" of the Communist Party.
Members of the Communist Party.

There is no ambiguity here.

 

[Cleon]

He not only claimed they are members of the Communist Party (not "communists" with a little "c") but that they are card-carrying!

Seriously. Specific question, specific answer. There's no way to substitute another meaning in here.

There are times when I suspect a Republican could say "I eat babies for breakfast," and people would insist that he was working on a recipe for a new breakfast cereal.

 

[Bikewer]

Back when I started working at the university here, around the early 80s, the local Communists (The Revolutionary Communist Youth Brigade) would come out with their red berets and little megaphones and a stack of pamphlets and copies of the The Worker.
They would set up in front of the chapel and try to get students to listen to them.

It was rather amusing. We had just built the new business school and the law school was getting quite prestigious.... These kids looked at the dedicated young Communists like they were some species of cockroach....
Doesn't seem to me there's much traction for Marx and Engels these days.

 

[Cleon]

Back when I started working at the university here, around the early 80s, the local Communists (The Revolutionary Communist Youth Brigade) would come out with their red berets and little megaphones and a stack of pamphlets and copies of the The Worker.
They would set up in front of the chapel and try to get students to listen to them.

It was rather amusing. We had just built the new business school and the law school was getting quite prestigious.... These kids looked at the dedicated young Communists like they were some species of cockroach....
Doesn't seem to me there's much traction for Marx and Engels these days.

The RCYB are the youth group of a Maoist outfit called the Revolutionary Communist Party. They make the CPUSA seem sane and well-adjusted.

Note of random trivia: For some reason, a couple years ago the RCP was getting really chummy with PZ Myers. He was speaking at their bookstores and frequently sharing a stage with Sunsara Taylor, an out-of-the-closet RCP activist.

 

[Bri]

Well there you go folks, commies like Progressives ergo Progressives are card carrying commies.

Allen West is the same guy who said this:

"If you look at the application for a security clearance, I have a clearance that even the president of the United States cannot obtain because of my background."​

And this:

"We had an amendment in the health care law that said the federal government is going to take over education."​

And this:

"China owns about 29 percent of (the U.S.) debt."​

And this:

The EPA "wants to hire 230,000 new government regulators that will cost the taxpayer $21 billion."​

All "false" or "pants on fire" according to PolitiFact.

-Bri