What's so fantastic about Apple?

[Stray Cat]

Nor do they make any of the other value-added components.

That stuff is made by ASUS (mobo), Intel (CPU, mobo chipset, audio chipset, etc.), ATI (video/graphics adapter), Seagate (hard drives), etc.

That's why I find it so ironic when people talk like Apple's stuff is so much better, more reliable, etc. than any other computer, when all their stuff is made by the same manufacturers in the same factories right alongside the parts that go into all the other companies' computers.

I think Apple customers talk that way because they paid so much more for the Apple stuff, they really need to believe it's that much better, when in fact it's really pretty much the same. It's just designed to look different and marketed as if it's different.

Of course, the OS is different, but that's another issue entirely.

Then I'd have to ask why you made this statement in the first place:

Guess Apple hardware might not be so robust as you're so eager to give it credit for.

Optical drives sometimes fail no matter which computer they are installed in. Because one person mentions theirs failed in an Apple computer you're making out like it's a big deal instead of pointing out to Fast Eddie that Apple don't make the optical drives...

Just sayin'

 

[OCaptain]

Here's a perfect example:

17" Macbook Pro:
http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MD311LL/A

$2499

2.4GHz quad-core
Intel Core i7
4GB 1333MHz
750GB 5400-rpm1
Intel HD Graphics 3000
AMD Radeon HD 6770M with 1GB GDDR5
Built-in battery (7 hours)


The current version of my Laptop:

Clevo X8180 (18.4")

http://www.sagernotebook.com/index.php?page=product_customed&model_name=NP8180

$2009

18.4" Full HD (1920 x 1080) LED-Backlit Display
Dual Nvidia GeForce GTX 560M GPU with 1.5GB GDDR5 Video Memory in SLI Mode
i7-2760QM Processor ( 6MB L3 Cache, 2.40GHz)
8GB Dual Channel DDR3 SDRAM at 1333MHz
750GB 7200rpm SATA 300 Hard Drive
8X DVD±R/RW/4X +DL Super-Multi Drive & Software
802.11 B+G+N Wireless LAN + Bluetooth Combo Module

(mine cost about what that macbook cost...but has dual 5870 video cards, a quad core i7 Q720 (1.6Ghz), 3 hdd (2x500GB raided, 1x120GB SSD) for $2500 a year ago. (I would have waited a few months, but needed to replace my old laptop))

And the only options I had to change on that Sager laptop were the HDD and CPU to match them to the Macbook's.


ETA: Or for a fair 17" comparison, the 8170 model from Sager:

http://www.sagernotebook.com/index.php?page=product_customed&model_name=NP8170

$1559

17.3" Full HD LED-Backlit Display with Super Glossy Surface (1920 x 1080)
Nvidia GeForce GTX 560M GPU with 1.5GB GDDR5 Video Memory
i7-2760QM Processor ( 6MB L3 Cache, 2.40GHz) [$160.00]
8GB Dual Channel DDR3 SDRAM at 1333MHz
750GB 7200rpm SATA 300 Hard Drive [$50.00]
8X DVD±R/RW/4X +DL Super-Multi Drive & Software
802.11 B+G+N Wireless LAN + Bluetooth Combo Module

And, again, the only changes I had to make on the ordering screen was the HDD and CPU to match that of the Macbook (coincidentally, should you order a Macbook, you'll have to go through a similar set of options).

Um, who is Sager?

 

[Chris L]

When was the last time you built a notebook computer, mobile phone, tablet or portable media player ?

Just saying ... desktops are not the extent of what there is. They also comprise apples smallest sales market, IIRC.

Again, I use the tools that fit my need. If I want/need a notebook, mobile phone, tablet, or portable media player, I can buy one that isn't made by Apple and will do what I need it to do. Really, Apple isn't the only (or even best depending on what you're looking for) company in the consumer electronics business. Liking another company's products is not an act of blaspheme.

 

[OCaptain]

**** Apple

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...pple_n_1243369.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003

Hahahaha!!!!!!

 

[Stray Cat]

I can buy one that isn't made by Apple

For now you can... but wait until Apple's marketing department get on to gummint legislation makers and they make it illegal to buy non Apple products.

ETA: It's already happening, see the post above.

 

[OCaptain]

Thank you, banquetbear, for making my point for me that marketing is the primary reason why Apple charges 150-200% of the price of any comparable computer.

Documentation for that allegation?

 

[OCaptain]

For the rest of the story, you have to turn to Apple's marketing department.





What is an "ultrabook" anyway? Sounds like marketing BS to me.

What it really is, is a computer.

I regard computers on the basis what they're capable of, not what they look like or what kind of jargon the marketing departments have attached to them.

You can be willfully ignorant of the Ultrabook spec, if you prefer, but you can't say you weren't told. Check with Intel about it. They know what makes an ultrabook.

 

[Kid Eager]

Documentation for that allegation?

good luck with that - Logic Has Left The Building.

He really should have worn sunblock...

 

[BobTheDonkey]

Um, who is Sager?

A high end custom laptop manufacturer.

But if you'd prefer, I could find Dells, Lenovos, Fujitsu, et al for lower prices than Apple MacBook Pros.

 

[OCaptain]

Nope, that was the only one I could find on Newegg that was 32GB. *shrug*

ETA: And the Acer, Samsung, Asus, and Motorola tablets are all still less expensive than the 32GB Apple iPad 2 without 3G. Some by $50, some by $100 (ruling out Motorola because the price I found is refurbished). And most have bigger screens with higher resolutions (due, in part, to the larger screens).

All the others tablets? They have USB ports. How many does the iPad have? 0
And what about RAM? How much does the iPad have? 512MB. Most of the other tablets have 1GB, some 2GB.

You guys who are trying to argue that specs should win in the tablet space just don't get it.

The whole tablet experience is what wins converts for Apple, and this is largely about the GUI, which Microsoft never really understood with Windows, nor now does Google with Icecream Sandwich. If people get frustrated while trying to find things buried 3, 4, 5 clicks deep, do you think they're having a good experience or a bad experience? If you find a tablet by another manufacturer with better specs for the same or less money than an iPad, so what? What have you learned about how easy it is to use? What are you going to run on it? How intuitive is the interface? How well does touch, swipe, pinch and other gestures work on it?

It is IMPOSSIBLE to overstate the success of the app store for iPad. The sheer number of good, curated apps has no equal in the Android App Market, and all I hear are crickets coming from MIcrosoft on it.

But go on ahead, thinking success in Tablets is all about specs. That should help the other guys win.

 

[OCaptain]

A high end custom laptop manufacturer.

But if you'd prefer, I could find Dells, Lenovos, Fujitsu, et al for lower prices than Apple MacBook Pros.

Please do. Shouldn't be hard.

 

[BobTheDonkey]

You guys who are trying to argue that specs should win in the tablet space just don't get it.

The whole tablet experience is what wins converts for Apple, and this is largely about the GUI, which Microsoft never really understood with Windows, nor now does Google with Icecream Sandwich. If people get frustrated while trying to find things buried 3, 4, 5 clicks deep, do you think they're having a good experience or a bad experience? If you find a tablet by another manufacturer with better specs for the same or less money than an iPad, so what? What have you learned about how easy it is to use? What are you going to run on it? How intuitive is the interface? How well does touch, swipe, pinch and other gestures work on it?

It is IMPOSSIBLE to overstate the success of the app store for iPad. The sheer number of good, curated apps has no equal in the Android App Market, and all I hear are crickets coming from MIcrosoft on it.

But go on ahead, thinking success in Tablets is all about specs. That should help the other guys win.

So you mean my Windows tablet can't set icons on the desktop to one-click open whatever program I want to run? Nor can Android?

Must have missed that notice when I was setting up my Android and Windows tablets...

 

[Mumbles]

My view on this is simple. I've owned four macs in the past twelve years, an iMac, a G4, and two Mac Minis. Every last one of them has worked perfectly, and done what I need them to do for years. I switched over to iTunes when Apple first purchased it, because it managed my music files for me, and gave me a very quick way to search through them. I bought an iPod because it worked with iTunes, and an home for the same reason.

I've also used seven PCs over the same period - five through work, and two laptops, by Toshiba, Dell, IBM, and HP. And every single one of them developed a major issue within tWo years. The best is my current HP laptop, with the dead battery. But the rest either had dead hard drives, dead motherboards, or or just randomly became so corrupted that the HD had to be reformatted - despite not going to questionable sites, using company-provided anti-virus software, and so on.

So yeah, I'll stick with Apple, thanks.

 

[Rat]

My view on this is simple. I've owned four macs in the past twelve years, an iMac, a G4, and two Mac Minis. Every last one of them has worked perfectly, and done what I need them to do for years. I switched over to iTunes when Apple first purchased it, because it managed my music files for me, and gave me a very quick way to search through them. I bought an iPod because it worked with iTunes, and an home for the same reason.

I've also used seven PCs over the same period - five through work, and two laptops, by Toshiba, Dell, IBM, and HP. And every single one of them developed a major issue within to years. The best is my current HP laptop, with the dead battery. But the rest either had dead hard drives, dead motherboards, or or just randomly became so corrupted that the HD had to be reformatted - despite not going to questionable sites, using company-provided anti-virus software, and so on.

So yeah, I'll stick with Apple, thanks.

In case you don't know what the plural of anecdote is: I've had only Windows PCs at home for about 15 years or more. I have indeed had a hard drive die, and I've had a PSU explode, although I will admit that I had built that machine and put in a very cheap PSU. As has already been discussed, the actual hardware inside Macs and (other) PCs is these days more or less identical. I have no idea what happened to make those machines of yours "so corrupted", but it has not happened to mine at any point. On the other hand, in my last job, I did have to support the partners of the company who all used Macs; they (the Macs) broke in the same ways and at the same frequency as all of the other computers.

So that's two anecdotes. Perhaps some other people would care to add some more. I'm pretty sure that if we get a few million anecdotes gathered together, it might mean something.

 

[Kid Eager]

In case you don't know what the plural of anecdote is.....

duh... it's anecdata.

 

[John Albert]

Then I'd have to ask why you made this statement in the first place:

Guess Apple hardware might not be so robust as you're so eager to give it credit for.

Optical drives sometimes fail no matter which computer they are installed in. Because one person mentions theirs failed in an Apple computer you're making out like it's a big deal instead of pointing out to Fast Eddie that Apple don't make the optical drives...

Just sayin'

I didn't say Apple optical drives were inferior to those sold by any other vendor.

The fact is, I just couldn't resist pointing out the unintentional irony of Fast Eddie applauding Apple hardware for being "robust," and then mentioning in the very next breath that his MacBook Pro had a bum CD/DVD drive. Especially when I have a 7-year-old Dell laptop that is still fully operational, DVD drive and all.

Just sayin'.

 

[John Albert]

Probably that pesky apple marketing dept again ... damn them tricking consumer reports like that.

I never said Apple's marketing tricks Consumer Reports magazine.

I said that Apple's marketing tricks their own consumers.

And I'll give you one guess where Consumer Reports gets their data from.

(I'll even give you a hint: the clue is in the magazine's name)

 

[Mumbles]

In case you don't know what the plural of anecdote is: I've had only Windows PCs at home for about 15 years or more. I have indeed had a hard drive die, and I've had a PSU explode, although I will admit that I had built that machine and put in a very cheap PSU. As has already been discussed, the actual hardware inside Macs and (other) PCs is these days more or less identical. I have no idea what happened to make those machines of yours "so corrupted", but it has not happened to mine at any point. On the other hand, in my last job, I did have to support the partners of the company who all used Macs; they (the Macs) broke in the same ways and at the same frequency as all of the other computers.

So that's two anecdotes. Perhaps some other people would care to add some more. I'm pretty sure that if we get a few million anecdotes gathered together, it might mean something.

That's fine, but I'm not discussing why anyone else should start buying Apple products. I'm discussing my own experiences. If Google or MS or whoever serve your needs, then stick with them.

But I don't care about Steve Jobs controlling the iTunes experience. It does what I want - it makes music quickly available, it gives me an easy-acces way to buy new music/tv shows/movies, and it downloads podcasts automatically. And I didn't really care about DRM that much - iTunes has an option to change older songs into DRM-free for a small fee, I have no reason to take them up on it.

And that's my point. Why should I change? I can sit in my bedroom, and use my phone to tell my living room computer to play the latest podcasts on the speakers in my dresser. Why should I even bother with the alternative?

 

[This is The End]

I never said Apple's marketing tricks Consumer Reports magazine.

I said that Apple's marketing tricks their own consumers.

And I'll give you one guess where Consumer Reports gets their data from.

(I'll even give you a hint: the clue is in the magazine's name)

I agree with you somewhat on this issue John, but you have that one completely wrong.

Consumer Reports does their own testing on almost everything. They basically never get their data from consumers.

When they occasionally get data from consumers it's only for things that require it, mostly health topics.

 

[Stray Cat]

I didn't say Apple optical drives were inferior to those sold by any other vendor.

And neither did I say you'd said that.

The fact is, I just couldn't resist pointing out the unintentional irony of Fast Eddie applauding Apple hardware for being "robust," and then mentioning in the very next breath that his MacBook Pro had a bum CD/DVD drive. Especially when I have a 7-year-old Dell laptop that is still fully operational, DVD drive and all.

Just sayin'.

So you found it ironic that Fast Eddie applauded Apple hardware then mentioned that some non Apple hardware had failed... And all because you have some non Apple hardware that hasn't failed.

OK, cool.