• Security incident: ISF was recently accessed by intruders. Please change your password, and change it anywhere else you used it. Read more

Vaccines: how do I talk to my anti-vac wife about it?

Why doesn't anyone complain when the government says you can't defecate in the streets or sell contaminated food, but they complain about required vaccines? Same issue.
 
Stomatopoda said:
Why doesn't anyone complain when the government says you can't defecate in the streets or sell contaminated food, but they complain about required vaccines? Same issue.
Click to expand...

Because the first case is a law preventing people doing some things and in the latter it's a law forcing people to do something. Apples and oranges.
 
Professor Yaffle said:
1. What has autism got to do with anything we were discussing?

2. There have been changes in the rate of *diagnosed* ASDs, not necessarily in the rate of ASDs
Click to expand...

I saw a program on CNN where they said that vaccines were a possible cause of autism in children. I haven't researched it myself though.
 
Stomatopoda said:
Certainly, but why are you using the future tense? It was worth investigating, and it was investigated.
Click to expand...

Ok, the CNN program I watched was several years ago. So it was perhaps investigated sometime after that. Was the investigation successful, or did the investigators all get suicided?
 
TheGoldcountry said:
Quackery is a derogatory term used to describe the promotion[1] of unproven or fraudulent medical practices. Random House Dictionary describes a "quack" as a "fraudulent or ignorant pretender to medical skill" or "a person who pretends, professionally or publicly, to have skill, knowledge, or qualifications he or she does not possess; a charlatan."[2]

Which I happen to believe applies to people who think viruses can be ignored through the practice of good hygiene and a specific diet.
Click to expand...

Then call me a quack because I'm living the dream! In case you error causes confusion to anyone else, it's not a "specific" diet but a species-correct, wholesome food diet.
 
The cause of the autism - vaccine debate is probably this:

"The MMR vaccine controversy was a case of scientific misconduct which triggered a health scare. It followed the publication in 1998 of a paper in the medical journal The Lancet which presented apparent evidence that autism spectrum disorders could be caused by the MMR vaccine, an immunization against measles, mumps and rubella.[1]

Investigations by Sunday Times journalist Brian Deer revealed that the lead author of the article, Andrew Wakefield, had multiple undeclared conflicts of interest,[2][3] had manipulated evidence,[4] and had broken other ethical codes." -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMR_vaccine_controversy

It was clearly an attack on the vaccine manufacturers. But why? The Wikipedia article talks about how parents saying that MMR had damaged their children had sponsored the study. But why did the parents do that? :confused: There seems to be a deeper root behind this. Maybe we should start a thread about it in the conspiracy section? :D
 
Anders Lindman said:
The cause of the autism - vaccine debate is probably this:
Click to expand...

Welcome to the party, pal.

You're only a decade or so late.

It was clearly an attack on the vaccine manufacturers. But why? The Wikipedia article talks about how parents saying that MMR had damaged their children had sponsored the study. But why did the parents do that? :confused:
Click to expand...

Lawyers representing the families contacted Wakefield in order to bolster their chances of a big payday. In addition, Wakefield was also working on his own, "safer" version of the MMR vaccine, so he had his own financial interest.
 
trusetheeker said:
Holy crap, I can't believe you locked into the name "Wakefield" and completely disregarded Deers' comments about "scientists"
---



Personally I want scientists and the medical industry to stop their Frankenstein experiments with our health and well-being.

---


Either there's a bit of confusion here or you've lost your marbles due to the "Wakefield" name! I was merely agreeing that you could prove that the vaccine does what you want it to in a lab test. What you can't do is prove that it won't have any adverse affects when unleashed on the general public. And before you argue with that point, remind yourself how many licensed drugs (yes, you don't believe that vaccines count as drugs!) get pulled off the shelves when the body count finally stacked up enough to get serious attention.

---


As a species, we should have "had it" with this nonsense by now but each time we start to win, the real quacks use their influence with politicians and the superstitious to bring us back under their thumbs. I tend to agree with those who say, take the profit out of vaccinations and it's supporters would soon desert it.



Name calling? That really makes your point.
Click to expand...

Yes, it does.

You are ridiculous.

You are total Poe, you are scientifically ignorant, yet try to claim it for your retarded, backward ideology.

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions.
Click to expand...

You don't believe that bacteria and viruses cause disease.

You don't believe in vaccination.

You don't believe in any expertise in the medical field beyond, the reluctant, repair of people after trauma.

You provided a paper that stated less that 2% of scientists had done anything fraudulent with their research.

If this is not blatent cretinism, I don't know what it.
 
Anders Lindman said:
No, but I think it could be worth investigating a possible cause between vaccines and autism. Just in case.
Click to expand...


You mean beyond the millions of children that have been studied.

You do realise that this entire autism-vaccines link started with Wakefield, but he claimed that there was a link between enterocolitis and autism, and that the enterocolitis was caused by the MMR jab.

Of course, it was just the measles in the combined vaccine, not the measles in the single jab, as if that makes any sense at all.

At the time he released his study, using his own recommended molecular techniques, there was no trace of measles found in the bowel biopsy, blood, CSF samples of any of the children in his study.

He was unethical and fraudulent in this small study.

He refused to do any further research beyond the initial pilot study even though the Royal Free offered a year's salary and access to 300+ children.

Instead, he continued to try and market his diagnostic kit to isolate measles in the body fluids of children and do more media promoting his pet hypothesis of 'autistic enterocolitis', which has NEVER been identified as a syndrome.

One of the children in his initial study was just awarded £ 50, 000 as his bowel was punctured 12 times during his unecessary ileoscopy.

All of the children's records were altered in the study, it was pure fraud to try and make money from his own vaccine and diagnostic kit.
 
Tatyana said:
You mean beyond the millions of children that have been studied.
Click to expand...

I can't see how such study could be difficult. Just compare vaccinated children with children who haven't taken the vaccine and compare the autism statistics! Maybe that's what they have done, but then why did it take so long time for the fraud article to be exposed? :confused:
 
Anders Lindman said:
Ouch. As Tomblvd wrote, I'm a bit late about this. I guess I could contribute to that thread but it would take a lot of research to learn about possible conspiracies. Alex Jones has talked a lot about vaccine conspiracies for example and I recently happened to watch a video where Bill Gates said that vaccines reduced populations! :eek:
Click to expand...

When are you going to realize you cannot get away with lying around here?

Gates did NOT say "vaccines reduced populations", he said that with vaccines, improved health care and reproductive services, we could reduce the worlds population. Meaning that with a greatly reduced child mortality rate, families would have less reason to have so many children. Large number of pregancies being the main strategy to assuring survival of at least some kids.
 
Anders Lindman said:
I can't see how such study could be difficult. Just compare vaccinated children with children who haven't taken the vaccine and compare the autism statistics! Maybe that's what they have done, but then why did it take so long time for the fraud article to be exposed? :confused:
Click to expand...


Some people suspected it quite soon, I would suggest you read through Brian Deer's site.

Those studies have been done.

The media played a huge part in promoting the fallacy and not presenting the evidence that demonstrated no link between MMR and autism.
 
Tomblvd said:
When are you going to realize you cannot get away with lying around here?

Gates did NOT say "vaccines reduced populations", he said that with vaccines, improved health care and reproductive services, we could reduce the worlds population. Meaning that with a greatly reduced child mortality rate, families would have less reason to have so many children. Large number of pregancies being the main strategy to assuring survival of at least some kids.
Click to expand...

Ok, it was no conspiracy, but Bill Gates DID say that vaccines reduced populations! As you yourself wrote that he said: "vaccines, improved health care and reproductive services, we could reduce the worlds population." That means that vaccines reduce populations. He he.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom