Merged Apollo "hoax" discussion / Lick observatory laser saga

[tsig]

The point is made in the answering of this simple question Apollognomon, take a shot at it'

Did the Apollo 11 astronauts see, or did they not see, stars from the surface of the moon?

delete

 

[Patrick1000]

Sorry couldn't be me

You can try here if you need a chuckle. Patrick1000/fattydash/HighGain/DoctorTea/BFischer/BSpassky/mvinson/piersquared/maryb/sicilian/etc. rather incontinently reverted to his obsession with eliminatory functions (who knows? perhaps his toilet training went badly? or perhaps is a work in progress?) and was banned for sock-puppetry.

He's a prolific liar, but due to his immaturity, ego, and general incompetence, not a very good one; in addition to serial lying to register yet another sock-puppet, he claimed to have little interest in Apollo, and not long before had said he'd "attended a small ad hoc symposium on Quantum Cosmology". I guess that's what you call chatting with the other workers at McDonald's while waiting for the deep fryer to do its thing.

Sorry couldn't be me sts60. But for what it is worth, and despite my confidence and math/science background, I haven't the slightest clue as to what "Quantum Cosmology" might be. Though sounds sorta' cool !! QUANTUM COSMOLOGY!

Epidemiology yes cosmology no.

Anyway, back to business, same question fopr you buddy, want in on this sts60, stars or no stars. Neil? or Alan? or neither? why not!

 

[drewid]

Nothing is difficult, so why change your story? Collins made a big point about why it is/was that one cannot see stars from cislunar space. Why say that, why tell that lie unless there is something huge behind it?

Children know Collins is wrong. So why would the pilot of the Columbia simulator lead kids astray like that? Of course they have the Lunar Science for Kids Web site now, a web site run by reputable NASA scientists, but back in the day, back in the day when Collins wrote his book CARRYING THE FIRE, about the epic mission of the Apollo 11 simulator "Columbinot", children did not have such good resources. They might actually believe that an observer could not dark adapt and look out the windows, maybe even when trying to crack a window to escape the simulated stench, and not see stars.

My Grief you might be right!
This is important, you should write a paper about this and submit it to Nature post-haste.
They're bound to publish what with you being an accomplished scientist and all, especially once they see your qualifications.

I'm sure it would make it though peer review unscathed.

 

[Patrick1000]

That guy/gal is funny!

You can try here if you need a chuckle. Patrick1000/fattydash/HighGain/DoctorTea/BFischer/BSpassky/mvinson/piersquared/maryb/sicilian/etc. rather incontinently reverted to his obsession with eliminatory functions (who knows? perhaps his toilet training went badly? or perhaps is a work in progress?) and was banned for sock-puppetry.

He's a prolific liar, but due to his immaturity, ego, and general incompetence, not a very good one; in addition to serial lying to register yet another sock-puppet, he claimed to have little interest in Apollo, and not long before had said he'd "attended a small ad hoc symposium on Quantum Cosmology". I guess that's what you call chatting with the other workers at McDonald's while waiting for the deep fryer to do its thing.

Thanks for the BAUT reference sts60. The HighGain guy is very funny! Hate to admit it, much funnier than me, much much much funnier, and he/she seems smart too. But he/she doesn't seem to really do HB stuff, not sure why they kicked him off??????

His jokes right before he got kicked off were terrific. Heck of a lot better than anything I do. Not to mention, the math stuff, way over my head. You guys shouldn't have booted him.

Back to business, stars or no stars sts60??????

 

[Patrick1000]

We are not going to let you squirm out of this drewid

My Grief you might be right!
This is important, you should write a paper about this and submit it to Nature post-haste.
They're bound to publish what with you being an accomplished scientist and all, especially once they see your qualifications.

I'm sure it would make it though peer review unscathed.

WE ARE NOT GOING TO LET YOU SQUIRM OUT OF THIS DREWID.

Collins said he, meaning ANY OBSERVER!!!!, could not and cannot see stars from cislunar space. That is a lie. Collins intentionally mislead and we all know that.

 

[drewid]

As I have said before, Apollo Fraud is much less about rocks and photos than it is about ICBMs and Lasers. I fancy myself pretty good at that stuff too Michael, the lasers and ICBMS, and satellites, and numbers stuff. I haven't really showed you any of my math tricks yet. Have been saving those, but they'll come up soon.

Not to mention, the math stuff, way over my head.

har de har har

 

[drewid]

WE ARE NOT GOING TO LET YOU SQUIRM OUT OF THIS DREWID.

Collins said he, meaning ANY OBSERVER!!!!, could not and cannot see stars from cislunar space. That is a lie. Collins intentionally mislead and we all know that.

So you are going to publish? Great I can't wait!

 

[Patrick1000]

Drewid, you should go over there and read the stuff at BAUT

har de har har

Drewid, you should go over there and read the sts60 HighGain reference stuff at BAUT. The LRO jokes are silly, but very good, better than mine. He posts in the pure science section mostly about subjects such as entanglement, unified field theories, the Poincare' conjecture, Andrew Wiles solving Fermat and so forth. He even wrote about Wittgenstein, Russell, Frege, Turing, Godel. In my mind, this guy/gal is most decidedly NOT an HB type. He/she has other concerns.

His/her presentation, brief, most unlike mine, dealing with unified field theories in general was very articulate. He is obviously a genuine mathematician, probably works in a teaching capacity in addition to whatever else he claimed to be doing as a programmer, and yes , ICBM trajectories and lasers are nothing compared to what that guy is dealing with, understands. Grothendieck topos? Do you know how hard that stuff is to even begin get a handle on? I can barely pronounce the stuff let alone work with it. Wish he/she was an HB and posting over here at JR, we could use his help. Who knows, maybe he will turn to our side. Somehow I very much doubt it. That boy/girl has better things to do with his/her time.

 

[drewid]

That's as believable as everything else you've posted.

 

[Garrison]

Drewid, you should go over there and read the sts60 HighGain reference stuff at BAUT. The LRO jokes are silly, but very good, better than mine. He posts in the pure science section mostly about subjects such as entanglement, unified field theories, the Poincare' conjecture, Andrew Wiles solving Fermat and so forth. He even wrote about Wittgenstein, Russell, Frege, Turing, Godel. In my mind, this guy/gal is most decidedly NOT an HB type. He/she has other concerns.

His/her presentation, brief, most unlike mine, dealing with unified field theories in general was very articulate. He is obviously a genuine mathematician, probably works in a teaching capacity in addition to whatever else he claimed to be doing as a programmer, and yes , ICBM trajectories and lasers are nothing compared to what that guy is dealing with, understands. Grothendieck topos? Do you know how hard that stuff is to even begin get a handle on? I can barely pronounce the stuff let alone work with it. Wish he/she was an HB and posting over here at JR, we could use his help. Who knows, maybe he will turn to our side. Somehow I very much doubt it. That boy/girl has better things to do with his/her time.

Oh that is so cute, pretending you aren't one and the same but hey if anyone wants to check out your other comedy routines why not?

 

[drewid]

Here's a comedy one.
A while ago I pointed out that they wrote in exactly the same style, Highgain suddenly went all yoof, writing u instead of you and so on.

He went away for a while, then when he came back he had reverted to his usual posting style, presumably having forgotten his street cred.

Priceless.

 

[godless dave]

Armstrong's statement is historic, etched in phony lunar stone, he said AT NO TIME did he or the other Apollo 11 astronaut(s) see stars from the surface of the moon. Maybe he did not "lie", but the astronauts collectively sure did change their minds. Just ask the astronauts' friend, Jay Barbree, the "reputable Apollo journalist of 50 years". He wrote that the astronauts told him they could EASILY see stars afterall. Wrote the astronauts could see stars at least twice.

Which astronauts, on which missions?


Last time I was in the Boundary Waters in northern Minnesota, I couldn't see northern lights.

The time before that I could.

 

[drewid]

I'm looking out of my window now and I can't see any stars, I guess the Earth must be a big fake.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

The point is made in the answering of this simple question Apollognomon, take a shot at it'

Did the Apollo 11 astronauts see, or did they not see, stars from the surface of the moon?

Whateve's

I decided to test the Gemini Fecal Containment system today, so I grabbed a plastic bag and headed out to the "lab," ie, the 24' travel trailer in my yard that I use for an office. At first I just grabbed a sandwich baggie, but I could feel the rice-a-roni and corn moving so I grabbed an empty bread bag instead. I also grabbed a pack of baby-wipes from my Army stuff.

With the trailer doors and windows well closed I headed to the back of the trailer and got nekkid. When I was all done I tied the bag containing the "sample" and wipes into a knot and left it in the back of the trailer, got dressed and went to the garage to fire up another project (involves yeast followed by applied thermodynamics; PM if interested in further details). When the, uh, pressure cooker was filled and sealed, I went back to the trailer (I call it my "space station in extremely-low-altitude geosynchronous orbit") to check on the atmospheric conditions.

Bleah.

So I tossed the bag into my neighbor's trashcan and opened the doors and windows, an atmospheric management technique not recommended for higher orbits.

 

[Southwind17]

I also grabbed a pack of baby-wipes from my Army stuff.

Jeez - what in the hell type of Ops Unit are/were you in?!

 

[Southwind17]

Last time I was in the Boundary Waters in northern Minnesota, I couldn't see northern lights.
The time before that I could.

I'm looking out of my window now and I can't see any stars, I guess the Earth must be a big fake.

With respect, guys, there are scientific explanations that can account for these that patently don't apply to lunar conditions, I would suggest.

 

[Patrick1000]

What does an Argon Laser Look Like from the Surface of the Moon godless dave?

Which astronauts, on which missions?


Last time I was in the Boundary Waters in northern Minnesota, I couldn't see northern lights.

The time before that I could.

Do you see this here godless dave?



Those 2 little dots there at the left are coming from 1 watt argon lasers. Surveyor VII took this photo with its camera in January of 1968.

So Neil Armstrong was said to have had a better cammera than Surveyor's, and they were supposedly shining an argon laser at him stronger than this one here from time to time. The laser was at the McDonald Observatory in El Paso. Just check the Apollo 11 Mission
Voice Transcript godless dave, search "laser", a bunch of hits will pop up related to this.

So this was one of the many problems for Neil godless dave, one of many problems having to do with seeing stars.

These laser images here according to the scientists that studied them, were brighter than Sirius, the brighest star in the sky.

So if you could see stars, you could see this, see the argon laser light coming from El Paso during the Apollo 11 Mission. Not only could you see it, but you could also photograph it, just like above there, or even better.

But Neil wasn't there. He wasn't on the moon, so he had to pretend not to see anything. Get it?

 

[TjW]

Whateve's
When I was all done I tied the bag containing the "sample" and wipes into a knot and left it in the back of the trailer, got dressed and went to the garage to fire up another project (involves yeast followed by applied thermodynamics; PM if interested in further details).

Are you building an osmotic bomb?

 

[mrbusdriver]

Do you see this here godless dave?

Those 2 little dots there at the left are coming from 1 watt argon lasers. Surveyor VII took this photo with its camera in January of 1968.

So Neil Armstrong was said to have had a better cammera than Surveyor's, and they were supposedly shining an argon laser at him stronger than this one here from time to time. The laser was at the McDonald Observatory in El Paso.

Patrick...a question if I may...

This argon laser which was "shining" on Neil and Buzz...how long did it shine on the site? A few seconds? 20 seconds? A minute?
Your answer would be appreciated.

 

[Patrick1000]

Neil hates lasers. He's like a vampire tuned to wilt if hit with monochromatic light

Which astronauts, on which missions?


Last time I was in the Boundary Waters in northern Minnesota, I couldn't see northern lights.

The time before that I could.

Neil hates laser light godless dave. I would too were I only pretending to be in cislunar space and not really there to see and/or photograph the light.

From the Apollo 11 Voice Transcript;

Time: 01 11 25 49

"CC: Roger. We got a little laser visual experiment
we'd like to - for you to do for us. If - if
you got the Earth through any of your windows or
through the telescope, would you so advise?
Over.

CMP: Stand by one, Charlie.

CMP At this roll attitude, what should our highgain
angles be? Maybe that would help us locate
you. We don't see you in the lens

CC: Stand by.

CC: Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. Those high gain
angles are pitch minus 70, yaw 90. We think
the Earth is apparently pretty close to
plus z-axis. Over.

CMP: Okay.

CMP: Okay, Charlie. I got you in the telescope.

CC: Roger, Apollo 11. We've got a laser that we're
going to - It's a blue-green laser that we're
going to flash on and off at a frequency of on
for a second, off for a second. It's coming out
of McDonald Observatory near El Paso, which is -
should be right on the terminator --or right
inside the terminator. We are going to activate
that momentarily. Would you please take a look
through the telescope and see if you can see it.
Over.

CMP: Telescope? Or sextant?

CC: Either one. Over.

CMP: Okay, I'll try it with the telescope; and if I
don't see it there, then I'll try the sextant.,

CC: Roger. We'll give you the word when they've got
it turned on. Over.

CMP: Okay.

CC: 11, Houston. They don't have it turned on yet.
We'll give_ you the word when they got it turned on.
Over.

CMP Okay.

CC: Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. We noticed the CR¥O
pressure dropped a moment ago. Did you stir up
the CRYO' s? Over.

CDR: Roger. We've finished our cycling operations.

CC: Roger. Copy. Out. '

CC: Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. McDonald's got the
laser turned on, Would you take a look?, Over.

CMP: Okay, Charlie.

CC: It's bluish-green.

CC: 11, Houston. We got some shaft and._trunnion for
you that might tweak it up a little bit. Shaft
of 141.5, trunnion of 39.5. Over.

CDR: Okay. Stand by. ..

CC Apollo 11, Houston. If you see it it should be
coming up - appear to be coming up, throutgh the
clouds. McDonald reports that there's a break in the clouds that they're beaming this thing
through. Over.

CDR: Roger.

CC: Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. You can terminate
the exercise on the Laser. Our rates are steady
enough now for - to commence the PTC. Over.

LMP: Okay Houston. Neither Neil nor Mike can see it.
Incidentally_ those shafts and trunnions just
missed pointing at the world.

CC: Roger. Thank you.

LMP: As we are looking at it through the scanning
telescope, it would be about an oh, maybe a
third of an Earth radii high and to the left.

CC: Roger.

LMP: But, we did - but we did identify the El Paso
area and it appeared to us to be a break in the
clouds there, and we looked in that break and
saw nothing.

CC: Roger. Thank you much. Out.

CMP: Houston, Apollo 11. Over."


So they couldn't see the laser godless dave, but they could identify El Paso. I wonder if that is because they heard Marty Robbins voice wafting up through that break in the clouds there. You know the song "El Paso" don't ya' godless dave......?

" Out in the west Texas town of El Paso, I fell in love with a Mexican girl. Night-time would find me in Rose's Cantina, music would play and Felina would whirl"

Great song. But somehow I don't think these guys are/were hip enough to relate.

Anyway, they do this throughout the trip, try and hit the not so very Eagle scouts with laser light. Neil ducks and says, "MISSED ME!!!".

Laser tag in outer space, only it's not really tag cuz' they're not in outer space. That's why they never get hit. See?