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Boycott Israel

Complexity said:
Not correct.
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Are you boycotting the Palestinian olive oil because of the PA law which has the death penalty for anyone selling property to a Jew? Perhaps I misunderstood when you were gushing over bikerdruid's link... surely that law is a bit more unjust than one allowing civil suits against those who call for a boycott? And I wouldn''t hold my breath waiting for a PA court to overthrow it. They don't roll that way.
 
WildCat said:
Who pays for the damage inflicted on Israel? Or is Israel liable for all damages after they were repeatedly attacked for merely existing?
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The people who founded Israel did not have the right to found it where it is located, taking land that belonged to others. I reject the 'argument' that 'god' gave the land to their ancestors. There are no 'gods'.

What has happened over the years to many Jews, especially during World War II, is horrible, but that didn't justify their being allowed to take land that belonged (and continues to belong) to others. They are not the only people who have suffered.

No one should pay Israel for any 'damages' - it is an intruder, a conqueror, and the people who were living there before have every right to resist it.

Israel has lost any moral high-ground that some have attributed to it because of the inhumane way that it treats people.

I'm not sure how the situation may justly be resolved, but the current state of affairs is unjust and should not stand.
 
WildCat said:
Yet you singled them out over China over a freedom of speech issue? :boggled:

Is this the double higher standard for Israel again that has nothing at all to do with anti-semitism?
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Nonsense.

I didn't single Israel out over China or over any other badly behaving country.

I posted an OP condemning Israel's behavior. This does give you any basis for inferring an ordering of evil in my assessment of the behavior of governments.
 
WildCat said:
Complexity, the Palestinian Authority has a law that provides for the death penalty for any Palestinian who sells land to a Jew (not a "zionist", not an Israeli, but Jews).

Why aren't you boycotting the PA? Surely that is far more draconian than an Israeli law that allows lawsuit (not death, not even imprisonment or a fine) against those calling for a boycott, and will likely be ruled unconstitutional by Israel's Supreme Court?

Or is this the "higher" standard for Israel again? :confused:
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I'm opposed to both Israel and the Palestinian Authority.

You make many inaccurate assumptions in your rush to judgement, WildCat. I don't think this is merely carelessness on your part.
 
Complexity said:
The people who founded Israel did not have the right to found it where it is located, taking land that belonged to others.
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What taking of land are you describing? You mean paying for it? Because that's how Israel was founded.

Complexity said:
I reject the 'argument' that 'god' gave the land to their ancestors. There are no 'gods'.
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No, but there is a UN. Why you confuse them with a god I have no idea.

Complexity said:
What has happened over the years to many Jews, especially during World War II, is horrible, but that didn't justify their being allowed to take land that belonged (and continues to belong) to others. They are not the only people who have suffered.
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You really don't know that the zionists immigrating to what is now Israel from the 1880s until Israel's founding bought the land, do you? Or maybe you agree with the PA that selling land to Jews should be a capital crime?

Complexity said:
No one should pay Israel for any 'damages' - it is an intruder, a conqueror, and the people who were living there before have every right to resist it.
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Explain this conquering. It sounds to me like you really don't have the slightest clue about the history of Israel and the zionist movement. It's as if you think a bunch of ships showed up one day in 1947 full of armed Jewish soldiers who invaded and took the land like Conquistadors of old?

Complexity said:
Israel has lost any moral high-ground that some have attributed to it because of the inhumane way that it treats people.
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Which people?

Complexity said:
I'm not sure how the situation may justly be resolved, but the current state of affairs is unjust and should not stand.
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And what responsibility do the Palestinians and other Arab countries have to resolve this?
 
Pardalis said:
Tell me, where in the Middle East are you most likely to be able to live your live freely as a homosexual, without fearing for violence, repression, imprisonment and death?

Which state protects you by law?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country_or_territory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country_or_territory#Western_Asia
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I would have more rights as a gay man in Israel than I would be in any of the countries with Islamic governments.

This does mean that I should give the Israeli government and state any slack in challenging them on their record on human rights. They continue to behave horribly and should be opposed, as should the Islamic governments.

Simply because people that you favor aren't behaving quite as monstrously as some of their opponents doesn't mean that they all shouldn't be called on their evil ways.
 
Complexity said:
As noted earlier, all of them. I boycott all countries that are theocracies or effective theocracies.
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Complexity said:
I'm opposed to both Israel and the Palestinian Authority.

You make many inaccurate assumptions in your rush to judgement, WildCat. I don't think this is merely carelessness on your part.
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Can you link to the threads you started advocating boycotts of the PA or any theocracies? Did you buy any PA olive oil?

How about China, are you boycotting them?

I'm just really curious how you prioritize human rights violations around the world. How does Israel move up to the top of the list because of that law?
 
WildCat said:
Are you boycotting the Palestinian olive oil because of the PA law which has the death penalty for anyone selling property to a Jew? Perhaps I misunderstood when you were gushing over bikerdruid's link... surely that law is a bit more unjust than one allowing civil suits against those who call for a boycott? And I wouldn''t hold my breath waiting for a PA court to overthrow it. They don't roll that way.
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I didn't 'gush' over BikerDruid's link - I thanked him for providing it. I haven't had time to visit it yet, but I appreciate his effort - I like him.
 
I am aware of how Israel was resettled, how it was founded, and the role of the UN and the British. I am also aware that, regardless of what compensation may have been payed for land, there was no choice in the matter. I don't approve of how it was founded.

As to the "god gave this land to us" argument, it is disingenuous of you to suggest that it hasn't frequently been invoked as an argument for the establishment of the state of Israel where it is currently located.
 
WildCat said:
Can you link to the threads you started advocating boycotts of the PA or any theocracies? Did you buy any PA olive oil?

How about China, are you boycotting them?

I'm just really curious how you prioritize human rights violations around the world. How does Israel move up to the top of the list because of that law?
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Hearing of that law really pissed me off and I posted about it.

I haven't posted on the extent to which I am angry at most countries here with the exception of the USA.

My lack of posting history on a topic shouldn't lead you to any conclusions with respect to my thoughts and feelings on that topic.

I think you are behaving dishonestly.
 
Complexity said:
I am aware of how Israel was resettled, how it was founded, and the role of the UN and the British. I am also aware that, regardless of what compensation may have been payed for land, there was no choice in the matter. I don't approve of how it was founded.
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Please provide evidence of this claim.

Complexity said:
As to the "god gave this land to us" argument, it is disingenuous of you to suggest that it hasn't frequently been invoked as an argument for the establishment of the state of Israel where it is currently located.
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No one here is arguing that. The fact remains it was set aside as a Jewish homeland by the UN, not god.
 
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Complexity said:
I would have more rights as a gay man in Israel than I would be in any of the countries with Islamic governments.
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No, in Islamic countries you would have no rights, while in Israel you would have every right (except marriage, but it is likely as time goes by they will grant you that right).

There is a huge difference.

This does mean that I should give the Israeli government and state any slack in challenging them on their record on human rights
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Why? I find it strange that I see you often post in threads that relate to gay rights, but here it seems to take a back seat. Why is that?

Don't you find that a society that is prone to give rights to homosexuals is a healthy one?

They continue to behave horribly and should be opposed, as should the Islamic governments.
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Israel may have its fault, but it has a massively better track record in human rights than its neighbors.
 
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WildCat said:
Why would that particular law piss you off so? Doesn't it seem out of scale to your outrage?
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Figure that out for yourself, if you can.

I don't think my reaction to it is out of proportion in the least.

Let's face it - you can't stand that I'm criticizing something that you hold dear (for reasons I can't fathom). Your concerns have been noted. You are not persuasive.
 
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