Lucid Dreaming - Consciousness During Sleep.

[Philosaur]

http://www.oddee.com/item_95629.aspx

Won the lottery twice after a dream

Many successful lottery entrants have said their winning combinations came to them in dreams;

Many, many more unsuccessful lottery entrants also have their numbers appear to them in dreams--they just don't get recorded, because nobody cares that someone DIDN'T win the lottery.

that they awoke with five or six numbers dancing in their heads, jotted the combinations down, played them, and won. Sometimes the dreamed-of numbers paid off right away, and sometimes the dreamers played those combinations for years before hitting the jackpot.

What if I walk around town telling people I can guess their birthday, and keep telling people it's May 30th. I'll be wrong oh, 50 times or so, before I find a person born on that day. Does that qualify as psychic ability?

So, that 86-year-old Mary Wollens of Toronto won the Ontario Lottery on 30 September 2006 after seeing "a lotto ticket and a large cheque" in a dream a couple of days before the drawing wasn't all that unusual — the remarkable part was that her prophetic dream enabled her to win the same lottery twice.

How did the dream of a ticket and a check "enable" her to win?

 

[BigTex71]

It's been a while since my last lucid dream, but for me they usually happen when I am close to waking up. I assume my brain is just about to come out of REM sleep and that is why a bit of woken-up consciousness starts to creep in, and I realize I am dreaming. That's why for me lucid dreams are usually quite short and end up with me waking up.

They can be quite fun while they last, though. I can control things as well.

Usually that is when my lucid dreaming occurs.

This brings back some of my early memories when I started lucid dreaming at the age of 15 (now 39) so make that 24 years of exploring this fun sleep induced activity.

When I first started to fly, I admit I did the whole dog paddle or frog swim to get started at first. Eventually it was the classic superman pose with arms stretched out and we've all seen that. Eventually, I started to get more influenced by X-Men comics as I started to do the whole Magneto vertical hover and fly while standing. Then it evolved to teleportation.

All of these are merely self-induced limitations in an area where no-limits need apply. We are the dreamers of our dreams so surely we can do what ever our imagination can express.

For me, the fun and adventurous nature of lucid dreaming is why it has such an appeal. To this date, no man made technology has been able to replicate the virtual reality nature of a first-person lucid dream experience. Perhaps I've spoiled myself too much with exploiting this natural holodeck of the mind.

I had similar flying experiences in my dreams.

Imagine if one could replicate putting a person in a lucid dream state and 'stream' details (earphones or some way) to help create a lucid 'virtual reality' experience? This sounds like something from the movie Strange Days or Total Recall.

As for using dreams to predict future events, I have absolutely no way to know if a dream is precognitive or not. The obvious ones that do not match anything remotely close to my waking life can easily be dismissed, the ones that match waking life now become good candidates but clearly not all of those are predicting future events. I've learned that all one can do is simply realize the relationship after the dream actualizes as there honestly is no way to say with any certainty what dream is precognitive and what dream isn't.

I may suspect and yes it may come true, or not. But I don't hold my breath and base my life on it. I'm still struggling with understanding it, the mechanics and how such a seemingly impossible event can exist. It really challenges my understanding of time/space and hints very strongly at predeterminism.

If you don't already do this, you should go beyond a dream journal. Input data into a database with tags. Then, when an event occurs that you know you dreamt about, you can easily find the dream in the database to verify if it was precognitive or not.

 

[lopeyschools]

I've had a couple of lucid (flying and jumping), semi-lucid (aware I'm dreaming), extremely vivid (woke up convinced I had to take the kids to school, I don't have kids) and a very uncomfortable morning of sleep paralysis ( which if I hadn't read about before would have terrified me).

I used to think some of my dreams of pre-cognitive. however the more I thought about and tried to make it work the more I realized I was deceiving myself.

 

[YouAreDreaming]

I am honestly glad I have joined this forum. This topic is of great personal interest to me and having this open talk about dreams is very welcomed. Judging by all the lucid dreamer enthusiasts, which I have to say is a pleasant surprise, even the general attitude and appreciation for dreaming is noted.

As a lucid dreamer, and one who appreciates the natural ability this dreaming part of ourselves to construct, model and render out a first-person 3D dream reality is admirable. I have a deep respect for that art.

Now, we have OT into precognitive dreams also which is great. Like lucid dreaming which has still not been fully accepted skeptically, we do have this first-person experience model that presents a case historically for precognitive dreams that not ever person experiences in their lifetime.

These experiences are both within a realm that is as much a part of actually having first-person experience with as it is to simply explore and study what this dream reality is. Taking stock in my precognitive dream experiences and seeing this relevance to future events turns my intellectual interests into a scientific desire to understand it.

Research has been on going into the precognitive nature of dreams since the late 1800's and many studies all leading up to Daryl Bem's current research is a good sign that some other people are looking at it with a similar interest in mind.

It a hard problem for science, the subjective boundaries are just not starting to be breached where images can be extracted from the visual cortex. The day that man invents dream reading technology is the day the true science of dreaming will be realized.

Until then, it's always ancetodtal subjective experience. Nothing wrong with that, we all dream.

This anomaly of precognition is difficult to accept or understand if you haven't had convincing first person experience with it. Much like lucid dreaming for the first time it's a point where your own self encounters the fact of that argument.

I've encounter fact. It's pretty black and white at this point. Quite a revolutionary experience.

 

[BigTex71]

I can usually initiate a lucid dream by pinching myself in my dream. A hard pinch to the fleshy (flabby) area of skin over my triceps. That normally hurts quite a bit, but in my dreams I can't really feel it at all. Then I know I am dreaming and I am free to take over and do what I want. It doesn't always work, but when it does I get to have some really cool dreams.

If I want to wake up, I usually find the highest point around in the dream and jump off. Normally, this causes me to wake up.

I really need to start a dream journal. Sometimes I will wake from a dream and think, "Wow, that would make for a really cool movie." Then I try to wrangle up some paper and pencil to start jotting stuff down before I forget. So I have about 5 potential scripts lying around (or potential books... whatever.)

 

[Pixel42]

If you don't already do this, you should go beyond a dream journal. Input data into a database with tags. Then, when an event occurs that you know you dreamt about, you can easily find the dream in the database to verify if it was precognitive or not.

All that will tell you is that you had an experience which was similar to a dream you once had. But you're bound to have a few experiences which are similar to dreams you once had, purely by chance. That doesn't make the dreams precognitive.

To establish that your dreams are precognitive you'd need to show that they correspond with later experiences more often, and more exactly, than you would expect them to do by chance alone. We went into this in detail in YAD's last thread on this topic, and were unable to come up with any reliable way of doing so.

 

[YouAreDreaming]

All that will tell you is that you had an experience which was similar to a dream you once had. But you're bound to have a few experiences which are similar to dreams you once had, purely by chance. That doesn't make the dreams precognitive.

To establish that your dreams are precognitive you'd need to show that they correspond with later experiences more often, and more exactly, than you would expect them to do by chance alone. We went into this in detail in YAD's last thread on this topic, and were unable to come up with any reliable way of doing so.

I agree Pixel, and I think we had some good progress on that thread. It's difficult to maintain that energy, and sadly I've been away since my split with my wife. Now in a custody battle with my 2 year old and a lot of change. Whole new reality to tag along in.

On other interesting matters however I did put out an abstract that has some other experiences and shapes my thinking on this topic greatly. If you want to have a look it's right here.

http://www.youaredreaming.org/assets/pdf/deja_reve.pdf

 

[I Ratant]

It seldom occurs during a dream, but sometimes the name of some celebrity will pass through the head bone... and sometime later.. that day or later, that celebrity.. usually a very minor one, will make some news.
Like a day or three ago I flashed on LaToya Jackson.. and last night, channel surfing, there she was, being interviewed by Pierce Brosnan (or whoever Larry King's replacement is)..
Can't rely on these things to occur or repeat... just something that sticks in the mind for a day or so, then is brought to my attention.

 

[YouAreDreaming]

It seldom occurs during a dream, but sometimes the name of some celebrity will pass through the head bone... and sometime later.. that day or later, that celebrity.. usually a very minor one, will make some news.
Like a day or three ago I flashed on LaToya Jackson.. and last night, channel surfing, there she was, being interviewed by Pierce Brosnan (or whoever Larry King's replacement is)..
Can't rely on these things to occur or repeat... just something that sticks in the mind for a day or so, then is brought to my attention.

Same day, next day type of precognition from my expeirences can usually denote a lot of dream symbolism. The best descriptor is a "Symbolic Precognitive Dream" to separate this from "Literal Precognitive Dreams"

In my neck of the woods, the literal lucid precognitive dreams probably summarized the extent of what potential appears within this anomaly. It's one thing to have a non-lucid precognitive dream, but that can all be remedied by a lucid precognitive dream.

That my friend seems very rare, I have a difficult time finding many people who can even admit to that particular arena of the dream experience.

It's one more level to this enigma and a point of focus indeed.

 

[Senex]

Same day, next day type of precognition from my expeirences can usually denote a lot of dream symbolism. The best descriptor is a "Symbolic Precognitive Dream" to separate this from "Literal Precognitive Dreams"

Symbolic woo vs. Literal woo. Hmmm...

In my neck of the woods, the literal lucid precognitive dreams probably summarized the extent of what potential appears within this anomaly. It's one thing to have a non-lucid precognitive dream, but that can all be remedied by a lucid precognitive dream.

You live in the woo neck of the woods.

That my friend seems very rare, I have a difficult time finding many people who can even admit to that particular arena of the dream experience.

That's hard to believe

It's one more level to this enigma and a point of focus indeed.

Enigma or foolish post.

 

[YouAreDreaming]

I was waiting for the Woo, thanks Senex. It brings a lot to the table.

 

[Senex]

I was waiting for the Woo, thanks Senex. It brings a lot to the table.

You post tomorrow''s lottery numbers or the closing price of Microsoft stock and I'll reconsider your "precognitive" abilities. Maybe you need to take a nap first

 

[YouAreDreaming]

You post tomorrow''s lottery numbers or the closing price of Microsoft stock and I'll reconsider your "precognitive" abilities. Maybe you need to take a nap first

Seems like some people are already laughing to the bank on dreaming lottery numbers. Scroll up. I'm not so lucky I'm afraid. Haven't had a dream with winning lottery numbers but if I do, and win I'll let you know.

 

[lopeyschools]

I don't really see how lucid dreaming can be seen as paranormal. We know that the brain simulates reality on a daily basis, we know that people can hallucinate(with or without drugs) and we know that consciousness is significantly altered by the sleep cycle. Having a degree of consciousness while asleep seems perfectly within the bounds of reality. I don't think we should accept all lucid dreaming stories as fact as they are by their nature subjective. I don't know for sure if my own lucid dreams were actually lucid dreams or a dream of what a lucid dream might be like. I must also accept that my interpretation of these dreams takes place during a period which, by definition, consciousness is altered and therefore so is my preception.

Now pre-cognitive dreams cross the line into paranormal/supernatural claims and as no such thing has been demonstrated before I remain unconvinced that anyone holds such an ability.

 

[Senex]

Seems like some people are already laughing to the bank on dreaming lottery numbers. Scroll up. I'm not so lucky I'm afraid. Haven't had a dream with winning lottery numbers but if I do, and win I'll let you know.

Do you really believe anyone laughs to the bank after dreaming lottery numbers?

How old are you? I'm sorry to be the one to tell you but life is cold and guided by physics and math. Wishful thinking may or may not make you happier but it doesn't increase your chance of being lucky.

Sorry to be the bearer of this news.

 

[YouAreDreaming]

Do you really believe anyone laughs to the bank after dreaming lottery numbers?

How old are you? I'm sorry to be the one to tell you but life is cold and guided by physics and math. Wishful thinking may or may not make you happier but it doesn't increase your chance of being lucky.

Sorry to be the bearer of this news.

Mary Wollens is.

There is no bad news, only opinions and beliefs being expressed here.

 

[MinnesotaBrant]

If it was all fill in the blanks, I would be happy with that however some have been very literal and coherent to the future event so much so that it makes the future event feel like a re-run of reality which isn't right. More intense then any deja vu, especially when lucidity was present in these types of dreams.

Also having journals over the years in addition to other events related to this I have as skeptical as I am seen this precognitive aspect of dreaming clearly present and laid out in stone. Do I fully understand it, no. It certainly didn't make me go run off and believe in Santa God or the Jesus Bunny rather perks my interests into the nature of dreams and how such non-linear and non-localized events like precognition can occur.

If I had any doubts, the lucid precognitive dreams ended any skeptical debate I had with the genuine nature of precognitive dreams. It's a real phenomena that I've experienced in great depth. Hopefully it's something that science will be able to explore and understand but I am very skeptical that this won't happen in my lifetime.

Dreams are very fascinating, especially when there is relativity to actual future events. Most intriguing.

Do you have more evidence? This evidence is not very convincing. You really do need to fill in the blanks.

1. What is your relationship to the two girls?
2. Why did you perform CPR on a person long dead?
3. Did anybody die in the car crash?
4. Did you do anything to influence the outcome? Please do not just say no.
5. Please be honest. You are not going to win anything on a JREF forum. Not even converts.

You are talking to someone to plays with the devil on a fairly regular basis. The probability that you influenced the outcome is great.

 

[Senex]

Mary Wollens is.

There is no bad news, only opinions and beliefs being expressed here.

OK, you believe dreams can predict the future and Mary Wollens is the best case you have for an argument given anything you might have gleaned from the history of the world.

We will have to agree to disagree.

 

[gnome]

Seems like some people are already laughing to the bank on dreaming lottery numbers. Scroll up. I'm not so lucky I'm afraid. Haven't had a dream with winning lottery numbers but if I do, and win I'll let you know.

And ones that won lottery numbers without regard to dreams are laughing the way to the bank too. In about the same likelihoods.

Nobody's claiming that you have never dreamt about something and had it happen. I think you're not paying attention.

The argument is that the alignment between events that happen and that you dreamed about before they happened is by chance, and for a person that pays a lot of attention to dreams, coincidence will happen often.

To convince, you will have to find a way to demonstrate that your "precognitive" dreams enable you to predict the future with greater reliability than someone who just has normal non-precognitive dreams.

If you can't describe a way to distinguish, is it possible that you think it's one when it's actually another?

A good way to start (studying it for yourself) would be to actually write your dreams down and date them.

Then when something happens you can compare it to what you wrote down, instead of your memories.

 

[Maurice Ledifficile]

[snip]

A good way to start (studying it for yourself) would be to actually write your dreams down and date them.

Then when something happens you can compare it to what you wrote down, instead of your memories.

What happens next is a game of shoehorning, like psychics and profilers play. To be honest a jerk, I will say that the OP was interesting at first, but since YAD lost all credibility* with me, I realized I don’t believe a word of anything he/she types.

Hint: A lot to do with an easy acceptance of precognition and shared dreams. Okaybye.


Edited: I had not realized that I was addressing Gnome as though he was the OP, my bad...