Ed Pentagon - TruthMakesPeace

[Clayton Moore]

Seems to me that there has to be a common starting point for all mechanical instructions for a plane to insure that they are properly synchronized and that data/feedback is returned to a central processor.

That shoves the 1500 man hours down the poopshute.

 

[DGM]

Seems to me that there has to be a common starting point for all mechanical instructions for a plane to insure that they are properly synchronized and that data/feedback is returned to a central processor.

That shoves the 1500 man hours down the poopshute.

And this has what to do with a 757/767?

You just say whatever pops into your head.

 

[twinstead]

And this has what to do with a 757/767?

You just say whatever pops into your head.

Or whatever poops into his head...

 

[dafydd]

Lucky you. But I can assure you, Dafydd, that they are alive and well and living not too far from the Taff....

Flanders is a sensible country. I like it here.

 

[jaydeehess]

None of them have presented even a fiction to me.

The aforementioned CiT have a fiction they hold dear. They contend that the aircraft seen by the witnesses flew low and fast at the Pentagon and,,,,, missed! It, according to the CiT, and with no witnesses saying anything to back this up, no radar data, nothing, that this aircraft pulled up at the last second and flew over the Pentagon and that the explosion was caused by some other means, that the damage to the structure was caused by some other means. They promote this partial theory despite having no evidence whatsoever to back these claims.

TMP, in this thread, promotes another fiction, that the crew and passengers of Flt 77 were disabled by rapid decompression at 30,000 feet asl and that the aircraft was flown by remote control into the Pentagon. He has said that the hijackers were real, that they were prepared to die for their cause. Despite the myriad of problems with this theory and absolutly no evidence backing it he still adheres to it.

 

[jaydeehess]

Seems to me that there has to be a common starting point for all mechanical instructions for a plane to insure that they are properly synchronized and that data/feedback is returned to a central processor.

That shoves the 1500 man hours down the poopshute.

You would still need
a) a system by which you can get real time telemetry from the aircraft for most if not all flight data and controls systems. This would require a radio frequency channel and a transmitter and a data collection system coupled into the aircraft system.

b ) a radio control frequency with enough data speed to allow real time control signals to be received at the aircraft from the ground. This would require a radio frequecy channel and receiver on the aircraft and it would have to be coupled into the existing aircraft systems.

You need data on engine rpm, thrust, temp
you need data on control surface position, flaps, ailerons, elevator, and rudder, trim settings,
you need positional data, horizon, pitch rate, yaw, heading, track, altitude(radar and altimeter), air speed, and lat/long
I would think that a good resolution video of the view out the cockpit would be of quite some use as well.

you need to be able to control all flight surfaces and all aspects of engine management.

certainly not a plug and play

 

[fess]

Seems to me that there has to be a common starting point for all mechanical instructions for a plane to insure that they are properly synchronized and that data/feedback is returned to a central processor.

That shoves the 1500 man hours down the poopshute.

I guess the common starting point would be to place your hands and feet on the controls of the aircraft. If you have half a brain, and the cables are connected properly, then synchronization should not be a problem. If you want to turn, then move the control yoke in that direction and fees in a little rudder. If you want to go faster, push on the control yoke, your speed will increase and houses will get bigger. If you want to go slower, pull back on the control yoke, you will go slower and the housed will get smaller. Keep pulling back on the yoke, and the houses will get bigger much faster than you want them to.

What central processor are you referring to?

How does it feel to have all of that **** pushed back up the poopshute?

 

[vtbub]

Seems to me that there has to be a common starting point for all mechanical instructions for a plane to insure that they are properly synchronized and that data/feedback is returned to a central processor.

That shoves the 1500 man hours down the poopshute.

Ever flown a flight simulator?

Are you even familiar with the basics of flight?

You do realize that automated flight is impossible on that scale now, let alone ten years ago.

 

[twinstead]

You do realize that automated flight is impossible on that scale now, let alone ten years ago.

Our dear friend Clayton doesn't appear to realize pretty much anything.

 

[TruthMakesPeace]

Remote Control of Cabin Pressure Outflow Valves (CAPOV)

In other words, the inconvenient ones, such as Everest being climbable without oxygen.

Mt. Everest is 29035 feet above sea level (fasl). Climbers report being short of breath, and very cold. Occupants in a plane flying higher than that would have less air, and would be colder, impairing their ability to function.

and trigger the masks.

They would be so consumed in getting air and warmth, they could not try to find and close the CAPOVs nor deactivate the RC of the FMS

If it's rapid, you're not talking "air release", you're talking a pump.

At 35000 fasl the air escapes naturally and rapidly. No need for a pump.

Forget the logs for a second. There is no way to tamper with the masks without conspicuously entering the plane.

The theory presumes there was a covert ground crew, probably a few per plane. Any one know of an investigation about who they were and how long they were employed? Why have there been no news interviews with "the guys who ground prepped the 9/11 planes"? (Similarly, no interviews with the Ace Elevator workers who were in the WTCs months before 9/11).

If that plane is in a terrorist attack, someone who's not in on the 'spiracy is going to say, "wait a minute, there were these suspicious guys..."

If they connected the dots, and don't have a "heart attack" or an "accident". Agents would have been well trained to not look suspicious, and blend in like normal workers.

So you admit the Rover comparison was pointless?

The point is that if technology exists to control Mars Rover devices up to 250 million miles away, then controlling devices mere hundreds of miles away is easier. RC of planes is well established, and even a popular hobby.

No it's not. It would require extensive modification. As in, installing a new computer.

If the ground crew were covert agents, they had the opportunity to do extensive modifications.

Well, if they had to modify the oxygen masks and the flight control systems as well, someone might find that suspicious.

The Oxygen masks may well have been triggered by the lowering of cabin pressure. But they are useless against freezing. The theory still works if the occupants were still alive and huddled in blankets as the Remote Controlled planes hit the buildings.

Good questions 000063.

 

[TruthMakesPeace]

Cabin Air Pressure Outflow Valve (no need for windows)

What altitude was the aircraft at when your bombs blew the windows out?

Yes, Captain. I dropped the "blown out windows" hypothesis like a hot Vulcan potato, thanks to JREFers like you. Explosives could have been detected. They might blow too much. Blown windows could cause navigation problems. So I kept looking, and found a better answer. There already is a hole for air to escape - the Cabin Air Pressure Outflow Valves (CAPOV). If they were forced open by a remote control device at high altitude, the air would rush out, suffocating and freezing the occupants. Then Remote Control of the FMS could steer the panes into the buildings - at computer controlled speed, accuracy, and without human emotions. I'm not saying this did happen, just that it is one explanation of how it could have been done. That's why we need a real, logical investigation of 9/11.

 

[beachnut]

... That's why we need a real, logical investigation of 9/11.

Because you can't figure out 911 given the answers and 9 years? You make up moronic fantasy and spit on those who died on 911; is it out of hate and ignorance? You have failed, and continue to fail over and over. What is this called when you diverge from reality?

Proved wrong by people on the seat back phones and the FDR on 77 and 93. You failed. The remote control is the dumbest claim when we all know the evidence. Why do you fail to check the evidence? Why do you fall for lies from 911 truth? Why do you make up moronic lies? Blowing the windows was the dumbest claim yet, and the outflow value is dumber since we know people were talking on phones, and pilots your buddies who you apologies for were making inputs on the controls. You can't stop spewing fantasy for what reason? Are you trying to be disrespectful spreading lies about 911, or is it a product of your ignorance on 911?

 

[fess]

I am almost sorry I oiled the coasters on the goalposts. You really seem to be able to shift them rapidly now.

Reading your post proves to me that you have either ignored my previous posts, or you have me on ignore.

Mt. Everest is 29035 feet above sea level (fasl). Climbers report being short of breath, and very cold. Occupants in a plane flying higher than that would have less air, and would be colder, impairing their ability to function.

There’s that word “fasl” again, you didn’t do well in school did you?

Why would they have less air? We aren’t talking SCBA or SCUBA systems here. they were being fed 100% oxygen through those masks. The air inside the cabin would have been cold, but no where near frigid. Bleed air from the engines is still being pushed into the cabin area.

They would be so consumed in getting air and warmth, they could not try to find and close the CAPOVs nor deactivate the RC of the FMS

See the above. You still haven’t explained how they hooked up an RC system to the FMCS.

At 35000 fasl the air escapes naturally and rapidly. No need for a pump.

No. Go back and read my previous posts. I see we are now at FL350.

The theory presumes there was a covert ground crew, probably a few per plane. Any one know of an investigation about who they were and how long they were employed? Why have there been no news interviews with "the guys who ground prepped the 9/11 planes"? (Similarly, no interviews with the Ace Elevator workers who were in the WTCs months before 9/11).

How many people do you think are on a maintenance crew during a layover? You seem to think these guys, who work with each other every day, don’t know each other. You also forget that there are other people onboard the air craft cleaning and prepping the aircraft for the next flight that may be a little suspicious of these covert maintenance guys.

If they connected the dots, and don't have a "heart attack" or an "accident". Agents would have been well trained to not look suspicious, and blend in like normal workers.

Bulldust.

The point is that if technology exists to control Mars Rover devices up to 250 million miles away, then controlling devices mere hundreds of miles away is easier. RC of planes is well established, and even a popular hobby.

More bulldust.

If the ground crew were covert agents, they had the opportunity to do extensive modifications.

No, they wouldn’t! So far, the only thing you haven’t tried to modify is the thrust reversers. But they weren't going to be needed anyway.

The Oxygen masks may well have been triggered by the lowering of cabin pressure. But they are useless against freezing. The theory still works if the occupants were still alive and huddled in blankets as the Remote Controlled planes hit the buildings.

Wrong again. Your theory is full of holes… big ones at that.

 

[TJM]

Yes, Captain. I dropped the "blown out windows" hypothesis like a hot Vulcan potato, thanks to JREFers like you. Explosives could have been detected. They might blow too much. Blown windows could cause navigation problems. So I kept looking, and found a better answer. There already is a hole for air to escape - the Cabin Air Pressure Outflow Valves (CAPOV). If they were forced open by a remote control device at high altitude, the air would rush out, suffocating and freezing the occupants. Then Remote Control of the FMS could steer the panes into the buildings - at computer controlled speed, accuracy, and without human emotions. I'm not saying this did happen, just that it is one explanation of how it could have been done. That's why we need a real, logical investigation of 9/11.

Peter Hansen was talking to his father from the airphone on Flight 175 as it was approaching WTC 2.

 

[TruthMakesPeace]

RCoCAPOV&FMSIPCE&DHHBCE theory proposes DH

The aforementioned CIT have a fiction...They promote this partial theory despite having no evidence whatsoever to back these claims.

I agree the Fly Over is only a partial theory. There are at least 5 points of evidence that a complete theory should cover:
1. Aircraft - what was it that resulted in the damage at the Pentagon
2. People - what happened to the passengers? How to explain DNA?
3. Building damage - Why smaller than expected E Ring hole, and large C Ring hole?
4. External damage - How did plane parts and light poles land on lawn?
5. Aircraft approach direction - North of Citgo or South? Steep or shallow angle?

If a theory can cover all 5 points, without merely discounting evidence as "staged", then it "fits like a glove", and is worth considering. For example, CIT provides credible witnesses for a NoC on #5, but needs more explanation for #2, #3, and #4. For #4, CIT describes how lamp posts could have been staged, but not all the airline debris. The OCT provides credible evidence and explanation for #1, #2, #3, #4, but fails on #5, contradicting even Pentagon Police officers.

TMP, in this thread, promotes another fiction, that the crew and passengers of Flt 77 were disabled by rapid decompression at 30,000 feet asl and that the aircraft was flown by remote control into the Pentagon. He has said that the hijackers were real, that they were prepared to die for their cause.

The Remote Control of Cabin Air Pressure Outflow Valves and Flight Management System in Planes Containing Explosives and Duped Hijackers Hitting Buildings Containing Explosives (RCoCAPOV&FMSIPCE&DHHBCE) theory proposes that the hijackers were just hijackers - who intended to demand some benefit in return for the hostages - such as closing US military bases in their home country of Arabia. They were duped, decompressed, and died with the crew and passengers. Then the planes proceeded by Remote Control, to crash into the buildings, with computer controlled speed and accuracy - without human emotions, human error, or human survival instinct.

Despite the myriad of problems with this theory and absolutly no evidence backing it he still adheres to it.

Like what "myriad" of problems? This theory is supported by the most evidence and witness testimonies of any I've seen, including the OCT. The theory is supported by all the Radar tracks, phone calls before CAPOV release, airline debris, eye witness testimonies, DNA evidence, etc. Here is a comparison: www.911Pentagon.org

 

[JohnG]

Yes. JohnG once again demonstrates his uncanny ability to translate Trutherese into a language understood by people who know what the **** they're talking about.

Thanks...I think.

 

[TJM]

I agree the Fly Over is only a partial theory. There are at least 5 points of evidence that a complete theory should cover:
1. Aircraft - what was it that resulted in the damage at the Pentagon
2. People - what happened to the passengers? How to explain DNA?
3. Building damage - Why smaller than expected E Ring hole, and large C Ring hole?
4. External damage - How did plane parts and light poles land on lawn?
5. Aircraft approach direction - North of Citgo or South? Steep or shallow angle?

If a theory can cover all 5 points, without merely discounting evidence as "staged", then it "fits like a glove", and is worth considering. For example, CIT provides credible witnesses for a NoC on #5, but needs more explanation for #2, #3, and #4. For #4, CIT describes how lamp posts could have been staged, but not all the airline debris. The OCT provides credible evidence and explanation for #1, #2, #3, #4, but fails on #5, contradicting even Pentagon Police officers.

The Remote Control of Cabin Air Pressure Outflow Valves and Flight Management System in Planes Containing Explosives and Duped Hijackers Hitting Buildings Containing Explosives (RCoCAPOV&FMSIPCE&DHHBCE) theory proposes that the hijackers were just hijackers - who intended to demand some benefit in return for the hostages - such as closing US military bases in their home country of Arabia. They were duped, decompressed, and died with the crew and passengers. Then the planes proceeded by Remote Control, to crash into the buildings, with computer controlled speed and accuracy - without human emotions, human error, or human survival instinct.

Like what "myriad" of problems? This theory is supported by the most evidence and witness testimonies of any I've seen, including the OCT. The theory is supported by all the Radar tracks, phone calls before CAPOV release, airline debris, eye witness testimonies, DNA evidence, etc. Here is a comparison: www.911Pentagon.org

Brian Sweeney tried to call his wife at 8:58 AM from flight 175.

 

[TJM]

Thanks...I think.

Well, it was meant to be a compliment but now that I'm not under the influence it doesn't read that way.

Guess I better get drunk then.

 

[beachnut]

... This theory is supported by the most evidence and witness testimonies of any I've seen, ...

Only for people with delusions. You would have to be dumber than dirt to believe that theory. How did you find such an idiotic web site?

How did you find someone so deranged and mentally ill as the guy who did that web site? He is insane and a moron. How did you find him?

 

[Clayton Moore]

April Gallops "testimony" (found to be cynical delusions and fantasy) or aircraft parts, Body parts of passengers and crew with matching DNA, passengers personal effects..............hmmmmmmmmmm what a difficult choice to make

When I was a little boy my mom used to tell me and the babysitter that she would be back before I could say Jack Robinson. Now I'm the babysitter and the government is telling us that they found matching DNA.