No Fly zones over Libya?

[geni]

Phase 1 seems to be specifically targeting Libyan air defenses which would be radar and anti-aircraft facilities. I would speculate that Phase 2 might be to target the ability to put any Libyan Air Force into the air at all. Once the Libyan airspace is fully safe for allied aircraft then there is nothing much Gaddafi can do of any scale.

Gaddafi's airforce has only been a fairly limited factor so far. It's his ground forces that matter.

 

[JihadJane]

I'd say there is nothing in the US responce that suggests dreaming.

That was my point. The dreams Obama claimed to have before he was elected are nowhere to be seen. it's business as usual.

There are still some bits of the french empire left so this can't reasonable be classified as a last gasp.

Wrong empire (as you know, presumably).

 

[Pardalis]

The last "gasp" here is the one JJ is having. It still thinks it's fighting the Cold War, so like a good soldier, every chance it gets it attacks the US (well, attack is a strong word, posting links on the internet is as much as it can do). At every occasion, be it a military intervention, or an earthquake, it sees it as an opportunity to fight its personal war against the capitalists.

There's an Earthquake in Haïti and the US, among other nations, is sending help? It's seen by JJ as an imperialist move.

There's a tsunami in Japan and their nuclear reactors are melting? JJ sees it at proof that the evil capitalist system is dying.

For once international forces will strike a dictatorship upon request of the Arab League? It's about the oil, according to JJ, and the US is obviously lying.

So predictable.

 

[William Parcher]

Gaddafi's airforce has only been a fairly limited factor so far. It's his ground forces that matter.

That is correct but his ground forces are dead meat when his skies are filled with allied warplanes.

 

[Bell]

The last "gasp" here is the one JJ is having. It still thinks it's fighting the Cold War, so like a good soldier, every chance it gets it attacks the US (well, attack is a strong word, posting links on the internet is as much as it can do). At every occasion, be it a military intervention, or an earthquake, it sees it as an opportunity to fight its personal war against the capitalists.

There's an Earthquake in Haïti and the US, among other nations, is sending help? It's seen by JJ as an imperialist move.

There's a tsunami in Japan and their nuclear reactors are melting? JJ sees it at proof that the evil capitalist system is dying.

For once international forces will strike a dictatorship upon request of the Arab League? It's about the oil, according to JJ, and the US is obviously lying.

So predictable.

Referring to JihadJane as "it"... classy

 

[William Parcher]

Does he still have his female personal bodyguards?

 

[Checkmite]

That was my point. The dreams Obama claimed to have before he was elected are nowhere to be seen.

Reality has this effect on dreams.

 

[Pardalis]

Got nothing to add Bell?

Why do you think JJ is singling out the US, when it's an international operation with Arab League backing?

There's a cognitive dissonance there that JJ is unwilling to address.

<snip>

Edited, breach of rule 0, rule 12.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Locknar

 

[JihadJane]

Still, the road to quagmire is often paved with good intentions. As the sun set over Libya on Saturday, it was not yet clear how this new coalition might halt the country's civil war, nor how long it would take, or at what cost. Retired U.S. general Wesley Clark, who oversaw the Bosnia campaign in the 1990s as NATO's top military commander, told CNN on Saturday that the new coalition on Libya was now on "the slippery slope of intervention," saying, "Once you start this you have to finish."

'Libya: How a No-Fly Zone Can Become a Red Hot Mess'

 

[Pardalis]

'Libya: How a No-Fly Zone Can Become a Red Hot Mess'

From your link:

As U.S., European and Arab officials met in Paris to coordinate military strategy[...]

Led by Britain and France, and backed by the U.S., the U.N. vote came five days after a vote to support no-fly zone by the Arab League

So you recognize that it's not a US operation? If you read your own links, you must have read that, right?

Respond.

 

[Pardalis]

What's your plan JJ? Let Qhaddafi crush the resistance and then go back to being a dictatorship?

 

[Thunder]

There's a cognitive dissonance there that JJ is unwilling to address.

Unless JJ stops acting like a mindless ideological drone, I will refer to it as such.

 

[little grey rabbit]

"Once you start this you have to finish."

This is unfortunately true. When the opposition took up arms when they found they could not energise large masses of demonstators, possible good outcomes for Libya narrowed dramatically.

When the Security Council passed its resolution, with the implication that Britain, France and the US will unleash any carnage to bring the opposition to power the options narrowed even more.

If the Libyan Government can't regain control of Benghazi very soon then politically UK, France and USA will be obliged to keep escalating forces until the regime is overthrown.

Everyone knows this equation, so the first likely result of the UN Security Resolution will be a no holds bar attempt to retake Benghazi. Bad though that would be in terms of death tolls, it is still probably better than the other option.

I wonder how long it will be before Libya again knows the security and prosperity it had in January 2011?

 

[Pardalis]

I wonder how long it will be before Libya again knows the security and prosperity it had in January 2011?

The what?

 

[Caustic Logic]

Shot down by Gaddafi's genocidal forces to curb their efforts at protest?

Well, I've read that that fighter jet was pro-Gaddafi Libyan Air Force and was shot down by rebels at Begazi. There are photos of it going down in flames with the pilot ejecting.

I saw that before going to bed and guessed that someone claiming to be the pilot would be shown on TV, insisting he was sent to bomb protesters, perhaps a hospital or pre-school, but he hesitated, let himself get shot down, and now wants to join the rebels.

Sky TVs correspondednt said it was a regime fighter going to bomb rebel bases to the south, shot down by rebels in the city. Now we hear it was a rebel-flown craft, shot down by Gaddafi's forces near the city, "confirmed" by high-level rebel leader Younis. This version is a third one I didn't hear yet - Gaddafi's jet, but gone rogue, shot by rebels.

Funny how the first act makes no clear sense when the second act is cancelled for some reason.

 

[little grey rabbit]

The what?

You right Pardalis, having a civil war is a real riot and nothing makes a real festival atmosphere like having tomahawk missiles rain down and with a completely uncertain timepoint before the West has slacked its humanitarian bloodlust.

Yeap, things are on the up and up for Libya!

 

[William Parcher]

Funny how the first act makes no clear sense when the second act is cancelled for some reason.

Well, there are some clear photos of the jet in various positions. Could the origin be identified by somebody? Are rebels and pro-Gaddafi using identical jets?

 

[Thunder]

I wonder how long it will be before Libya again knows the security and prosperity it had in January 2011?

wait, so you would sacrifice all freedom & liberty, in order to have a little stability & security?

huh.

 

[Pardalis]

Yeap, things are on the up and up for Libya!

So you prefer Qhaddafi to remain in post, for a few more decades.

Got it.

 

[little grey rabbit]

So you prefer Qhaddafi to remain in post, for a few more decades.

Got it.

Its not my decision.

I would also like to bring to the rule of law and wipe out corruption in America and Australia, but I don't feel at the time is right to call in air strikes.


Yet.