2010 Election Results

Incidentally, today after work I had a "beer summit" with a good friend & conservative colleague of mine because I lost a bet we had on a local election and I owed him dinner. Of course, we discussed the election results and where the country is and where we'd like to see it headed. We discussed whether or not we thought President Obama and the GOP would, or even could, work together. We discussed how the GOP establishment is going to deal with the Tea Partiers and how, were it not for some of their TP-backed candidates, the GOP would have taken control of the Senate as well as the House. We talked about health care, taxes, the deficit, and the general state of politics in America.

And you know what? We found that we agreed more than we disagreed, a whole lot more, in fact. Much more than many pundits and political hacks would have us believe. See what happens when you actually have a conversation with people as opposed to simply watching political ads on TV?

Ah, the power of beer :D
 
BeAChooser said:
LOL!


So becoming a single payer system is most definitely where Obama thinks we are headed. Where democrats want us to go. No strawman needed by the GOP. Democrats said it in plain english.
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Yeah, Obama and some Dems want single payer. That's common knowledge, I think.

Supposedly, the health bill as it stands will save us billions of dollars, but to me it seems single payer would be even more streamlined, and certainly more efficient than our healthcare system as it has existed up to now, what with its red tape generated by the multiplicity of billing protocols, to cite just one example--a necessary result of multiple for-profit health insurance companies. If that system is so great, let it compete against a single payer system.
 
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[QUOTE=BeAChooser said, "Except it doesn't appear to be doing that, does it."

Not yet. Patience.
 
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BeAChooser said:
Do you ever actually read what you post or understand the terms in your posts?
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Well, it just seems that why should our current system be afraid of a single payer system if our current system is very efficient? Fiscally efficient.
 
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Obama's healthcare bill has the capability to insure 95% of all Americans, but you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.
 
Whiplash said:
Ahh, but that just translates down into the same stupid thing lefties say EVERY TIME THEY LOSE AN ELECTION.

And that is that the populace is just stupid.

You either didn't explain things well enough.. or people are just too stupid to get it.. or the Republican's lied and manipulated them against you.

It's like some bizarre dream where you actually believe that every sane, intelligent person in the world would (and should) embrace you.. it's just that there are always reasons why they don't. They are stupid.. they are manipulated by others.. you just haven't been able to get your message out well enough.

Denial. It can be very ugly. And you won't actually make any real progress until you come to realize that you are in denial about it. You think they embraced you in 2008 when they actually were just rejecting the other side. And now you make excuses and insults to explain your losses.
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Let me give you an example of a strawman argument against the Health Care bill.

During the campaign, a common charge was that the Health Care bill dropped thousands from Medicare coverage. Reality is that the bill moved people from an HMO program called Medicare Advantage to the regular Medicare system. The Medicare Advantage program costs the government about 18% more per person than regular Medicare, but doesn't provide improved care.

It's good politics to say you are going to restore Medicare coverage to seniors. But it's a strawman argument because the bill did not drop anyone from Medicare.
 
Whiplash said:
Ahh, but that just translates down into the same stupid thing lefties say EVERY TIME THEY LOSE AN ELECTION.

And that is that the populace is just stupid.
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Stupid is strong word. I would substitute one or more of (in no particular order)

Gullible
Short sighted
Impatient

Here in Colorado, people actually believed the lies told to them by the Republican candidates. They actually believed health care had been nationalized, Obama raised taxes, seniors were dropped from Medicare, and they no longer had their choice of Doctors.

Now that I think about it, people who believe that are stupid.
 
T.A.M. said:
Spoken like a legitimate conservative person, as opposed to a politician....and in that lies the problem. I think most americans on all sides want comprehensive health care....but the conservative politicians are thinking about their pockets, and those that fill them.

TAM:)
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So you would rather the government fill there pockets.

Spoken like a true liberal.
 
logger said:
So you would rather the government fill there pockets.

Spoken like a true liberal.
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ummm....no. My point was sarcasm. I believe that Wild Cat, like many conservative CITIZENS actually want real health care, but that the problem is that the REPUBLICAN POLITICIANS, those in power, could care less about it...they care only about filling their pockets with lobby money from Health Insurance companies.

Sorry if I made it sound unclear, and yes, I am a TRUE LIBERAL, and proud of it.

TAM:)
 
logger said:
So you would rather the government fill there pockets.

Spoken like a true liberal.
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By your last sentence I take it you mean his spelling and punctuation were correct, unlike your own. Damn liberal elite spellers!
 
T.A.M. said:
ummm....no. My point was sarcasm. I believe that Wild Cat, like many conservative CITIZENS actually want real health care, but that the problem is that the REPUBLICAN POLITICIANS, those in power, could care less about it...they care only about filling their pockets with lobby money from Health Insurance companies.

Sorry if I made it sound unclear, and yes, I am a TRUE LIBERAL, and proud of it.

TAM:)
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I think they care about letting me pay for my own healthcare

Get your own, I don't want to pay for you.

Maybe Sarah Palin could lend you some money, since you can't afford it

Or maybe you should just get a job
 
Ausmerican said:
By your last sentence I take it you mean his spelling and punctuation were correct, unlike your own. Damn liberal elite spellers!
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Again sorry about the spelling. I 'am told about that constantly this site.

Is that all you know how to do, spell
 
logger said:
I think they care about letting me pay for my own healthcare

Get your own, I don't want to pay for you.

Maybe Sarah Palin could lend you some money, since you can't afford it

Or maybe you should just get a job
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I have a job. I make a decent amount of money. I have healthcare in my country (not yours by the way) courtesy of the taxes I pay, of which I pay a disproportionate amount compared to people who make much less then me who also avail of the govt run health care...I am ok with it.

Even if my health care wasn't paid for, as a Physician, I could get one of my colleagues to help me out.

Maybe you should not assume so much.

TAM:)
 
T.A.M. said:
I have a job. I make a decent amount of money. I have healthcare in my country (not yours by the way) courtesy of the taxes I pay, of which I pay a disproportionate amount compared to people who make much less then me who also avail of the govt run health care...I am ok with it.

Even if my health care wasn't paid for, as a Physician, I could get one of my colleagues to help me out.

Maybe you should not assume so much.

TAM:)
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I'll assume what I want

And I still don't want to pay for you or anyone else

Have you ever thought of coming to the US,

I'm sure you could make a lot more:D
 
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