The "Nakba" Myth

[Skeptic]

Is there some sort of moral imperative to judge all cultures (or ideologies) as equal, never saying that one culture (or ideology) is better than another? Of course not, otherwise we'd still be living in the stone age, since it too is a culture -- and who says it's worse than western civilization?

 

[Skeptic]

LOL the best? The best in Climate destruction.

Well, in that and in democracy and human rights and women's suffrage and the scientific revolution and the medical and technological revolution and in the establishment of secular society and in the idea of a citizen as opposed to a king's subject and in the the idea of a constitution and in lower child mortality and in environmentalism (primitive societies and cultures destroy the environment just as much as non-western ones, only nobody there cares about it), and a few other things I could mention.

 

[bigjelmapro]

Hindu and Buddhist Culture.

We are spending money that we canot pay back in our livetime, thus its up to the next generation to pay it back.

What does Western culture and debt have to do with freedoms and rights?

Its an issue of spending beyond ones means and some how you think that this negates Western values overall? Explain your reasoning.

I would understand the issue of materialism when it comes to the core beliefs of Hinduism and Buddism and how this would be 'superior' (in the lightest sense of the term), but overall rights and freedoms for the general populace? Very doubtful.

Here's an interesting paper on the Buddism and human rights/freedoms explaining how, in the general sense, that Buddism has recently developed the concept of individual human rights based on Western culture:

Are There "Human Rights" in Buddhism?

Touches up a bit on Hinduism, but not much. Individual human rights and freedoms also lack in that belief system. Its a general misconception in modern times that these two belief systems were 'superior' to Western cultures of today and somehow preached an improved version of individual rights and freedoms that the movement in the last century. Couldn't be further from the truth....

 

[Mycroft]

but the people are not talking about paintings they are talking about cultures...

Thunder types "some cultures are inferior"? to which Pardalis replies "absolutely".

so I ask Pardalus which ones.....which are the inferior culture. He starts backpeddling under cover of your diversion....

if you want to talk about productivity, gay and minority rights or freedom of the press please go ahead....but lets not confuse that with bigot speak about "inferior" cultures.

The differences between Turkish coffee and Korean coffee are subjective. You and I might simply have different tastes in what we prefer. But restricting the rights of women, minorities and gays is objective, it can be measured. We can certainly measure cultures by these standards.

And more importantly, once it's recognized that these measures are important and cultures can be judged by them, work can be done to improve these cultures that fall short by these standards so that someday in the future you could add Saudi Arabian culture to that list of yours and someone would have just as difficult time ranking it with Australian culture as they do Canadian and British culture. (American culture, of course, will always lead the way.)

 

[Lamafarmer]

from that logic, Christian cultures are superior to Jewish culture [...]

haaa!!!

one would think that supporters of Israel [...]

Christian British culture is clearly superior to Jewish Israeli culture.

[...] American Jewish culture is superior to the Israelis.

Israel represents a regression of Jewish culture.[...]

Yes, yes, we know you hate Israeli and the Jews and all that, Hitler Hitler!

see lol, you also cant say it with a straight face.

LOL you're so WRONG! LOL!

 

[Thunder]

Yes, yes, we know you hate Israeli and the Jews and all that, Hitler Hitler!

why would you accuse me of hating Jews?

I am a Jew. And proud of it.

 

[Virus]

In Hindu culture widows are considered unclean and so widows are kicked out of the home by male relatives and forced to beg on the streets. Society considers them scum. There are millions of widows on the street in India because of this superstition.

 

[Thunder]

In Hindu culture widows are considered unclean and so widows are kicked out of the home by male relatives and forced to beg on the streets. Society considers them scum. There are millions of widows on the street in India because of this superstition.

clearly then, Hindu Indian culture is inferior to White Anglo-Saxon Protestant culture.

 

[a_unique_person]

Is there some sort of moral imperative to judge all cultures (or ideologies) as equal, never saying that one culture (or ideology) is better than another? Of course not, otherwise we'd still be living in the stone age, since it too is a culture -- and who says it's worse than western civilization?

No. You can improve your culture without judging someone else's as being inferior or superior.

 

[Thunder]

I clearly view certain practises as being immoral, inhumane, and wrong.

But saying that a whole culture is evil, or immoral, inhumane, or even saying "inferior"...is going waaaay too far.

Such an attitude leads to Segregation, Apartheid, and the Warsaw Ghetto.

 

[Virus]

I clearly view certain practises as being immoral, inhumane, and wrong.

But saying that a whole culture is evil, or immoral, inhumane, or even saying "inferior"...is going waaaay too far.

Such an attitude leads to Segregation, Apartheid, and the Warsaw Ghetto.

No it doesn't. Refusing to accept cultural relativism doesn't make you a Nazi.

 

[Pardalis]

But saying that a whole culture is evil, or immoral, inhumane, or even saying "inferior"...is going waaaay too far.

But it's OK to call Americans stupid because of a few individuals?

 

[Thunder]

No it doesn't. Refusing to accept cultural relativism doesn't make you a Nazi.

it is bigotry to believe that one culture is superior to another. sorry to say.

yes, only a bigot would say "Jewish culture is superior to Arab culture".

 

[Pardalis]

only extremists and bigots believe that one culture is superior to another. sorry to say.

It depends on the criteria. If you criteria is personal freedoms and civil rights, then it is perfectly reasonable to call some cultures inferior.

Do you deny that some cultures are more oppressive and inhumane than others?

 

[Virus]

it is bigotry to believe that one culture is superior to another. sorry to say.

yes, only a bigot would say "Jewish culture is superior to Arab culture".

Are you an atheist Jew Thunder? In Arab countries, atheists get beaten up, killed or thrown in jail for expressing their beliefs. Their opinion of Jews is even less.

Which culture is better, the culture that would have you killed, or the culture that wouldn't?

 

[The Fool]

The differences between Turkish coffee and Korean coffee are subjective. You and I might simply have different tastes in what we prefer. But restricting the rights of women, minorities and gays is objective, it can be measured. We can certainly measure cultures by these standards.

And more importantly, once it's recognized that these measures are important and cultures can be judged by them, work can be done to improve these cultures that fall short by these standards so that someday in the future you could add Saudi Arabian culture to that list of yours and someone would have just as difficult time ranking it with Australian culture as they do Canadian and British culture. (American culture, of course, will always lead the way.)

come on Mycroft you are teasing us....telling us all you can perform a double backsummersault with pike from the highboard...

time to dive...

which is the inferior culture. Use whatever damn criteria you like...

American
Canadian
British
Australian


stop tapdancing around telling us you can judge inferiority...just do it. Would it be a lot easier for you if I threw some muslim arabs into the list?

 

[The Fool]

I already told you, you don't want to listen.

I judge cultures and societies mainly on moral grounds, meaning which ones cause the least unnecessary harm to their people, and how much freedom they allow.

I'm not talking about art, I'm not talking about coffee, I'm not talking about gastronomy or anything else. I'm talking about individual freedoms, and unnecessary harm.

If a culture allows very few civil rights and freedoms, then I judge it as inferior to the ones that offer more civil freedoms, on that basis alone. Or if you don't like the word 'inferior', you could say they are less evolved culturally, and need to work on it.

If you can't understand that, that's your problem.

Now I ask again, can you recognize that some cultures are less free than others?

jesus christ on a pogo stick....stop telling us how you can do it and just %^&$*&^ do it ok?

here is the list..

American
Canadian
British
Australian


stop telling us how it can be done and demonstrate it please....

 

[bit_pattern]

^^ I lol'd at Mycroft's quote. I wonder what of the liberties and freedoms of the people Israel has been occupying for the last forty years

 

[Virus]

come on Mycroft you are teasing us....telling us all you can perform a double backsummersault with pike from the highboard...

time to dive...

which is the inferior culture. Use whatever damn criteria you like...

American
Canadian
British
Australian


stop tapdancing around telling us you can judge inferiority...just do it. Would it be a lot easier for you if I threw some muslim arabs into the list?

I give them all five stars.

 

[Virus]

^^ I lol'd at Mycroft's quote. I wonder what of the liberties and freedoms of the people Israel has been occupying for the last forty years

Who's fault is it they're occupied again? If Egypt and Jordan didn't start a war against Israel they'd still have those territories.

Arabs wanted war.
Arabs started war.
Arabs lost the war.
Arab's fault.