Who started both World Wars?

[9/11-investigator]

Where would we be if it were not for Nein11 confabulator to re-invent history?

There was no RC in Lithuania, Muscovy, Bulgaria, Serbia and a number of other places.

Nitpicker. You are refering to mainly Orthodox Christian backwaters where never was a reformation. Europe = Catholicism.

Misconception. Hussites and Baptism preceded Luther.

Again, nitpicking. Wikipedia:

The Protestant Reformation was the European Christian reform movement that established Protestantism as a constituent branch of contemporary Christianity. It began in 1517 when Martin Luther published The Ninety-Five Theses, and concluded in 1648 with the Treaty of Westphalia that ended years of European religious wars.[1]

Tip: edit the wikipedia Protestant Reformation page tonight to correct this 'error' and push your Hussites in. It will be removed within an hour.

Fail. The Republic of the Seven United Provinces became a republic in 1581 with the Act of Abjuration. Or a few years later when Anjou, the brother of the French king, proved a failure. The influx of Marranos started end 16th century. "Guaranteed freedom of religion" is too strong a word. There was no constitution, except for the Union of Utrecht. The first Dutch (and European) constitution that guaranteed freedom of religion dates from 1796. It is true that de facto, the Republic tolerated religions of all stripes, as long as they didn't show outward signs on their buildings. Jews were allowed to build recognizable synagogues from the 1630s.

Ddt is very eager to show how much (irrelevant facts) he knows about history (or able to google it up, we will never know). I pinpointed 1648 as a republic that was essential Protestant. That was not the case in 1581.

Why doesn't the Polish-Lithuanian commonwealth feature in your "historical overview"? At the same time as the Dutch republic, they also grantedd Jews the right to practice their religion, and many Jews migrated to Poland/Lithuania.

Because I am only interested in showing how the Sefardic Jews ended up in Anglosphere avant la lettre: via Holland, both Britain and America.

And you still haven't found a shred of evidence that the name Rossocampo actually existed?

I gave you a reasonable explanation including genealogy. You produced nothing to hold against mine.

Do you see the contradiction? First you claim that Claes Roosevelt was a Jew, and he immigrated to NYC in 1649 at the latest. Now you say the first Jews arrived in 1654. Silly deniers can never get their story straight.

It is you who comes up with 1649, silly! Do you ever read your own posts?
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6242032&postcount=2429

You really slept through teh Dutch history classes, didn't you? The year was 1688.

I was refering to the Glorious Revolution. Wikipedia: Date 1688–1689

That's for a first installment. Grade: F-.

That's an A for pedantry. Wrong on all accounts.

And now explain what your problem is with Jews. Why do you see a world-wide conspiracy? Did you have a Jewish kid in class who was smarter than you? Unless you had a lobotomy in the meantime, you then must have a grudge against a lot of groups.

Because I have eyes in my head. Why should world history solely being made by WASPs, Muslims, Germans, Soviets, Americans, British... and the Jews only sell carpets, right? Even 'regulars guys' like Mearsheimer and Walt can tell you that the Iraq war was engineered by Jews. And once you have concluded that it is not a very big step to Pearl Harbor, WW2 and Bolshevism.

Considering the vehemence of your defence... are you a Jew, ddt?

 

[ddt]

Nitpicker. You are refering to mainly Orthodox Christian backwaters where never was a reformation. Europe = Catholicism.

The Grandduchy of Muscovy a backwater? Don't tell Ivan IV, he'll chop off your head. Lithuania a backwater? You realize it extended to the Black Sea?

Ddt is very eager to show how much (irrelevant facts) he knows about history (or able to google it up, we will never know). I pinpointed 1648 as a republic that was essential Protestant. That was not the case in 1581.

It was in 1581 "essentially protestant". The cities - even Amsterdam - had replaced their city councils with pro-protestant ones, and the leader of the Revolt was a calvinist Prince.

Because I am only interested in showing how the Sefardic Jews ended up in Anglosphere avant la lettre: via Holland, both Britain and America.

Because the majority of American Jews is Sephardic. Do we see here a narrowing down of your conspiracy theory?

I gave you a reasonable explanation including genealogy. You produced nothing to hold against mine.

No, you quoted a British-Israelist nutjob. IOW, you provided zilch, nada.

It is you who comes up with 1649, silly! Do you ever read your own posts?
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6242032&postcount=2429

Read the reference I gave, and you'll see that Claes van Rosevelt's first child, Christiaen, was baptised in NY in 1650.

I was refering to the Glorious Revolution. Wikipedia: Date 1688–1689

The revolution itself was 1688. 1689 was only mopping up the last resistance. And you didn't even mention the name.

Because I have eyes in my head. Why should world history solely being made by WASPs, Muslims, Germans, Soviets, Americans, British... and the Jews only sell carpets, right? Even 'regulars guys' like Mearsheimer and Walt can tell you that the Iraq war was engineered by Jews.

And now you're back projecting the current Israel lobby, which was virtually absent before 1967. What did Eisenhower do in the Suez crisis? How many Jews found refuge in the US during the Third Reich? And apart from the topic of Israel, what differentiates American Jews from the average Joe? AIPAC is just a lobby group like the NRA, the PETA or the ACLU.

And once you have concluded that it is not a very big step to Pearl Harbor, WW2 and Bolshevism.

Once you "see" one conspiracy, you see lots of them. Do you check thoroughly under your bed before you go to sleep?

Considering the vehemence of your defence... are you a Jew, ddt?

Does it matter? I'm a Dutchman and I have an interest in history.

 

[9/11-investigator]

Does it matter? I'm a Dutchman and I have an interest in history.

Evasive answer, as expected.

But shall we skip discussing the precise details of the Glorious Revolution and Reformation and Hussites and all that jazz and go back on topic please?

Is there anybody who wants to come up with a counter list to the one I produced a few posts ago that is substantially different from this provocatively formulated one that I put in your mouths:

Official story v1.0; picture an Anglo guy chewing on gum while saying: Well you see, we have Brits, Yanks, Frogs and Russians basically minding their own business, while all over sudden these darned Krauts tried to conquer the whole world twice. Today Germany, tomorrow ze wurld, you know what I am saying? The second time they killed 6 million Joos in gas chambers and stuff for no reason at all! Can you imagine that? Fortunately the Allies sticked together and taught those evil Germans a lesson. Twice.

Or is that intellectually too challinging for my opponents (as I suspect it is)?

Or to put it more friendly... do you guys have any questions about the New Explanantion concerning the genesis of both world wars? I mean, the long term consequences for your standing in the world is rather bleak if larger groups of people start to understand what really happened.

You should not feel ashamed for asking questions! Heck when I started this thread after having read Buchanan I thought that the Brits were the real villains. Now I know better, thanks to Mark Weber and Schultze-Rhonhof and Stefan Scheil and Walter Post.

 

[9/11-investigator]

... Somewhere in the universe, a black hole was created by the sheer density of the stupid in your post.

You must be very proud of yourself that you refuted my theory in only one sentence...

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

You must be very proud of yourself that you refuted my theory in only one sentence...

Wasted a lot of words. "Silly" would have done nicely.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Good plot for Dan Brown maybe.

 

[dafydd]

... Somewhere in the universe, a black hole was created by the sheer density of the stupid in your post.

I live on the Dutch/Belgian border.I would love to meet Nein11,just to see if he can actually find his own backside in the dark.

 

[TheRedWorm]

[Thinner] 9/11, you know as much about history as I do about turbine engines.[/Thinner]

 

[9/11-investigator]

Here is Suvorov and his message (German).

According to Egon Bahr, it would not make a difference if Suvorov was right. Unbelievable... It looks like that the entire German Polit class is afraid that the German population is going to find out about the truth earlier than other nations. It is only the non-German nations who can liberate the Germans, just to prevent Anglo bombers firing their engines again... So, Dutch, British, French, Russians, Euro-Americans, it is up to us if we want to save our civilization in the last moment...

Here a German documentary in the spirit of Suvorov (8 parts) --> "Den Krieg nach Deutschland tragen".

Question: if we found out what really happened during Barbarossa, the largest armed conflict in human history, full 70 years later, could it not be that we have been sold lies about the holocaust as well?

 

[CptColumbo]

Has he/she cut and pasted the entire internet yet?

 

[9/11-investigator]

Has he/she cut and pasted the entire internet yet?

The only one here who has brains stays silent.
He probably realises that the debate is lost.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

The only one here who has brains stays silent.

Obversely, you post a heck of a lot.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Speechless with wonder, or just gone to bed.

 

[Belz...]

Unbelievable... It looks like that the entire German Polit class is afraid that the German population is going to find out about the truth earlier than other nations.

Ah, yes. If it's like those other "truths" that are "about" to be discovered, I won't hold my breath. Remember 9/11, and the supposedly imminent unmasking of the conspirators ?

 

[ddt]

Evasive answer, as expected.

Why should I tell more about myself? You won't either.

But shall we skip discussing the precise details of the Glorious Revolution and Reformation and Hussites and all that jazz and go back on topic please?

Says the one who bounces through countries and history faster than a pinball machine. Actually: no. Those Hussites did the first Prague Defenestration, did you know - ties in with our previous discussion on Czech history. And those Baptists are not unimportant either, they're one of the biggest religious denominations in the US now - much and much larger than the Jews you ascribe so much influence to.

Is there anybody who wants to come up with a counter list to the one I produced a few posts ago that is substantially different from this provocatively formulated one that I put in your mouths:

Or is that intellectually too challinging for my opponents (as I suspect it is)?

I guess I could try to get the discussion to an higher intellectual level by posting this:

Or to put it more friendly... do you guys have any questions about the New Explanantion concerning the genesis of both world wars? I mean, the long term consequences for your standing in the world is rather bleak if larger groups of people start to understand what really happened.

Your CT is still not quite clear. Is it a conspiracy of all Jews, or just Sephardic Jews?

You should not feel ashamed for asking questions! Heck when I started this thread after having read Buchanan I thought that the Brits were the real villains. Now I know better, thanks to Mark Weber and Schultze-Rhonhof and Stefan Scheil and Walter Post.

Oh, one simple question: do you prefer Zuidlaren, Wolfheze, Santpoort or Den Dolder?

 

[ddt]

Has he/she cut and pasted the entire internet yet?

Curiously, he seems to miss a couple of sites, like Nizkor and the Holocaust History Project. He hasn't found Metapedia either yet - he would make a great editor there.

 

[Belz...]

Your CT is still not quite clear. Is it a conspiracy of all Jews, or just Sephardic Jews?

Most CTs eventually get to a point where everyone's in on it, except them.

Doesn't reflect well on the CTers when they're the only ones not entrusted with the dark truths...

 

[aggle-rithm]

WW2: direct consequence of WW1, Hitler came to power on a program to reverse the harsh treaty of Versailles and on anti-Jewish-Bolshevism. That triggered all alarm bells in Jewish controlled Washington and the Roosevelt government started to prepare to bring a war about in Europe. The Americans (read Jews) saw their chance to ignite a war around the Danzig issue. The British war garantee was ordered by Washington as well as pushing the Poles against any compromise.

You left out the part where the Poles attacked Germany. It was the Poles who attacked, right?

Oh, that's right...the Germans attacked. But it was the allies fault, right? Surely we can't hold the Germans responsible for their own actions?

Let's look at a little analogy. Say a person, call him Mr. A, walks up to someone on the street (Mr. B) and makes a completely reasonable request: He asks him for the time, for instance.

Mr. B refuses this reasonable request.

If Mr. A were to pull out a machete and slice off Mr. B's arm, would this be considered an appropriate response? After all, the request was REASONABLE. There was NO REASON for Mr. B to refuse it!

In a civilized world, it doesn't matter. Mr. B is not obligated to tell Mr. A the time, and Mr. A's reaction is completely out of proportion to the situation.

Now let's take it a step further: Say a bystander, Mr. C, calls out from a distance and tells Mr. A he will intervene if the attack doesn't stop. Mr. A responds by saying, "If you can convince Mr. B to tell me the time, I will not only stop slicing off his limbs, I will actually GIVE HIM BACK the one I already sliced off, so he can have it re-attached...at his own expense, of course."

Now, tell me in what Bizzaro world Mr. A would be considered the victim, and Mr's B and C the aggressors?

The Soviets had an agenda of their own and prepared for the attack in mid 1941.

By imprisoning or executing most of the officers in the Soviet military?!?

This forced Hitler to attack the USSR first. Roosevelt engineered Pearl Harbor to obtain the main price: war in Europe.
So who wanted world war 2: American (Jews) and Soviets.

Your conclusions do not follow from you premises. In fact, your premises don't even make sense.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

We have a positive result! I sent a link to this thread to a friend on was fence-sitting on the issue. After reading 9/11's material he's convinced that ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ started the war.

 

[Matthew Ellard]

Here is Suvorov and his message.

Could it not be that we have been sold lies about the holocaust as well?

Yes Suvrov has lied just like holocaust deniers. The BT-7 came after the German PAK 35/36. Suvrov took care not to cite any sources but he couldn't change actual dates. He was debunked through basic research.

The majority of those purged were, in fact, not military personnel at all. Because everyone important in the militarized state carried military ranks, simply enumerating the generals, commanders, etc. who were killed leaves one with the incorrect impression that the army was beheaded.

Suvrov didn't mention the second purge of 1941 of Red Airforce officers as it ruins his initial premise. Suvrov lied on purpose.