Continuation - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

[Kevin_Lowe]

Rudy said a lot of things, but since he's a lair, rapist and murderer I don't think anything he says should be taken for the truth.

With that said there is no evidence that he was already in the apartment when Meredith arrived home around 9. If he did break in before 9 he would have stolen something from Filomena's room, after all stealing is the object here. Jewelery, cash, anything that could fit in his pockets.

I don't think we can take that as Gospel truth. It's not a law of nature that Rudy has to grab something in every room he enters before he is allowed to leave, and by his own admission he raided the fridge and went to the toilet. I think he was taking his time and enjoying the rush of housebreaking right up until Meredith got home.

Since nothing was stolen it makes more sense that Meredith was already home and he threw the rock sometime after 9. By the time she walked into Filomena's room to investigate the noise was already inside and he attacked her. Thus her room was "a big mess" but nothing was taken.

This scenario pushes back the time of the attack and has Rudy on the toilet after the stabbing. With a very short timeline, again, seems highly improbable with one person, very probable with three.

Sorry, but even adding up everything you've mentioned I don't think it's remotely unreasonable to think that Rudy did it all in an hour.

My incredulity is that the claim is being made that the autopsy report says the time of death is between 9 and 9:30 when it's a fact that the attack didn't even begin until at least 9:05.

That's how scientists work. They say "According to the stomach contents, this person died between 9:00 and 9:30". If factors other than the stomach contents limit the time of death further that's useful, but it's not the business of the guy or gal doing the autopsy. Their job is just to relay what the state of the corpse can tell us.

I think you mean Meredith. How can it be hard evidence when the early side of the estimation has her dead five minutes before she was even attacked?

Yes, I meant Meredith sorry. As for how it can be hard evidence, like I said, that is just how science works. Every proper measurement has error bars. In this particular case we have reasons external to the corpse to restrict the time of death to a little bit later than 9pm, but that doesn't in any way cast doubt on the validity of the scientific evidence.

What exactly do you mean by "on the computer"? Was it turned on? Was it connected to the Internet? Was it running a program? My computer is on right now, I'm on the Internet. World of Warcraft is running in the background and I have Word open. If I leave it like this and go out and murder someone I can't use my computer as alibi that I was at home.

According to this source someone opened and closed a "cartoon file" (it could mean an image but I imagine an animated movie is more likely) at 9:46pm, when Meredith had almost certainly been dead for some time.

I'm sure a sufficiently savvy person who had premeditated a murder could set up their computer to do such a thing automatically, and then erase all trace of the automated behaviour, but since there's no evidence of such premeditation I tend to take this evidence at face value and say it places Raffaele and Amanda at Raffaele's house at 9:46pm, well after the latest possible time of death for Meredith based on her stomach contents.

I think my drug-crazed murder pile-on theory is much more plausible than the existing prosecution narratives. I don't however, think it was premediated and I think that while she was present, Amanda didn't participate in the killing.

Has such a drug-crazed pile-on ever happened in the history of the world? Outside movies like Reefer Madness? I mean, at least Mignini for his sins could point to incidents like the Manson gang murders as evidence that deranged murder cults existed. They're vanishingly rare compared to sex killings triggered by a burglary gone wrong, sure, and there's absolutely no evidence that Rudy, Amanda and Raffaele were part of such a cult, but at least such cults have actually existed.

Whereas drugs that make two ordinary students gleefully join in on a bloody murder and sexual assault don't, so far as I know, even exist. Unless I see some evidence you might as well assert that they stabbed Meredith with a unicorn horn because they were high on fairy dust that The Grinch sold them.

 

[Malkmus]

Wow. Just having skimmed the part of the report which describes Rudy's previous brushes with b&e, I can see that it's going to create a lot of discussion. Generally speaking, reading about Rudy's other burglary attempts reveals almost identical evidence and scenarios to the Kercher murder, including threatening a male resident of a house he had broken into when he found he could no longer exit through the front door. It's eerily enlightening, and casts even more doubt on the break-in being staged.

 

[Alt+F4]

"The following considerations add a further element of uncertainty to using the criterion of gastric emptying: Meredith’s friends, in speaking of an afternoon meal on November 1, 2007 that was eaten with Meredith, stated that no alcoholic substances were consumed; they drank only water. According to statements by Dr. Lalli, based on the toxicological tests, the presence of ethyl alcohol in a concentration of 0.43gram/litre was found (Lalli report page 54); Professor Cingolani declared that it was a quantity equivalent to about a glass of beer or wine. During the autopsy, Dr. Lalli discovered a vegetal fragment in the oesophagus, apparently a piece of mushroom (page 46, Lalli report). In relation to this data, it is possible that Meredith, arriving home around 21:00 pm, ate something to accompany this meal – the last one of her life – with a bit of wine or a beer. This eventuality, with regard to hypothesising based on the above-mentioned objective elements, adds a final uncertainty to the notion of using the criterion of gastric emptying to determine the time of death with any certainty."-

If he is correct and Meredith did eat a few mushrooms and had a bit of wine or beer when she got home then the attack couldn't have happened shortly after 9. How long might that take to have this snack, 10 minutes? So now the time of the attack is pushed back to 9:15 making the timeline even shorter.

 

[Chris C]

Listen to this:

"The following considerations add a further element of uncertainty to using the criterion of gastric emptying: Meredith’s friends, in speaking of an afternoon meal on November 1, 2007 that was eaten with Meredith, stated that no alcoholic substances were consumed; they drank only water. According to statements by Dr. Lalli, based on the toxicological tests, the presence of ethyl alcohol in a concentration of 0.43gram/litre was found (Lalli report page 54); Professor Cingolani declared that it was a quantity equivalent to about a glass of beer or wine. During the autopsy, Dr. Lalli discovered a vegetal fragment in the oesophagus, apparently a piece of mushroom (page 46, Lalli report). In relation to this data, it is possible that Meredith, arriving home around 21:00 pm, ate something to accompany this meal – the last one of her life – with a bit of wine or a beer. This eventuality, with regard to hypothesising based on the above-mentioned objective elements, adds a final uncertainty to the notion of using the criterion of gastric emptying to determine the time of death with any certainty."- Translated Massei Report

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?p=53735#p53735

Also, the Massei report states the possible time ranges for Time Of Death between 18:50, Nov. 1 and 04:50, Nov. 2.

So what happened to the food she ate at 6pm? It was still in her stomach. There was no food in her small intestines which means her stomach hadn't processed the food completely at time of death. Therefore she died before he stomach could finish processing the food. Thats what places her death at 2 to 3 hours. Sure she could have eaten again later. However at 10pm that food she had eaten at 6pm would be in her small intestines. Since this isn't the case then she couldn't have died between 11 and 12 like the prosecution states.

 

[Chris C]

The timing and direction of travel combined with knowing that all the other cottage occupants were elsewhere at that time make it very unlikely that the person in that video is anyone else.

Knox and Sollecito would have been coming from that direction. They where not recorded.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

meaning of the word summons; credibility of the police

This isn't evidence of police lying. Try again. I'm afaraid it doesn't count as being summoned if....you weren't.
How was she summoned? Is there a paper trail? How can one be summoned without knowing it? What difference does it make? Amanda's lies made a very big difference...like Lumumba spending a fortnight in jail and subsequently losing his means to support his family.

Bucketoftee,

Are you claiming that sworn testimony is not evidence?

I can see some grounds for a misunderstanding over the meaning of the word summons. To me, Amanda was summoned when Dr. Giobbi gave the order. Transmitting the order is another matter, and it is possible that this was not carried out. To you, if Amanda was not told she was supposed to come in, then (perhaphs) she was not summoned. If that is your position, then fair enough.

However, the police still lied by omission by failing to acknowledge that Dr. Giobbi gave the order, and I have given my reasons for finding it to be important in my previous comment. Do you accept that the police lied about other things, as Charlie and others listed? If so, then where is the credibility of ILE?

 

[Kestrel]

Knox and Sollecito would have been coming from that direction. They where not recorded.

This camera doesn't record all the time. It's triggered by a proximity sensor in the garage and records for some time after being triggered. So it's possible for someone to walk to the cottage and not be recorded by this camera.

 

[Kevin_Lowe]

Listen to this:

"The following considerations add a further element of uncertainty to using the criterion of gastric emptying: Meredith’s friends, in speaking of an afternoon meal on November 1, 2007 that was eaten with Meredith, stated that no alcoholic substances were consumed; they drank only water. According to statements by Dr. Lalli, based on the toxicological tests, the presence of ethyl alcohol in a concentration of 0.43gram/litre was found (Lalli report page 54); Professor Cingolani declared that it was a quantity equivalent to about a glass of beer or wine. During the autopsy, Dr. Lalli discovered a vegetal fragment in the oesophagus, apparently a piece of mushroom (page 46, Lalli report). In relation to this data, it is possible that Meredith, arriving home around 21:00 pm, ate something to accompany this meal – the last one of her life – with a bit of wine or a beer. This eventuality, with regard to hypothesising based on the above-mentioned objective elements, adds a final uncertainty to the notion of using the criterion of gastric emptying to determine the time of death with any certainty."- Translated Massei Report

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?p=53735#p53735

That doesn't work as an explanation unless Meredith vomited up her pizza before it got to her small intestine, because otherwise it would have been in her small intestine when she died. If she ate a mushroom with a bit of wine or beer when she got home that wouldn't magically make the pizza she ate earlier vanish from her digestive tract.

Also, the Massei report states the possible time ranges for Time Of Death between 18:50, Nov. 1 and 04:50, Nov. 2.

One of the reasons I wasn't awaiting the translation of the Massei report with anything other than mild curiosity was that we already know Massei's conclusions and we already know that they contradicted the hard facts of the case.

I think the guilters were holding on to the fantasy that all sorts of wonderful hard evidence or knock-down arguments were in there, that somehow everyone had missed up until now, and that as soon as it was translated there would be incontrovertible proof that Knox and Sollecito did it. Yet since the translation there's been dead silence where this incontrovertible proof ought to be, which is exactly what I'd expect if there was nothing new in there.

If Massei handwaved away the stomach contents evidence that just means Massei isn't very good at joined-up thinking. The evidence doesn't go away just because Massei ignored it.

 

[Alt+F4]

I think the guilters were holding on to the fantasy that all sorts of wonderful hard evidence or knock-down arguments were in there, that somehow everyone had missed up until now, and that as soon as it was translated there would be incontrovertible proof that Knox and Sollecito did it. Yet since the translation there's been dead silence where this incontrovertible proof ought to be, which is exactly what I'd expect if there was nothing new in there.

Kevin, it's only been available for a couple of days, the report is 400 pages long and people do have other things to do.

 

[Kestrel]

That doesn't work as an explanation unless Meredith vomited up her pizza before it got to her small intestine, because otherwise it would have been in her small intestine when she died. If she ate a mushroom with a bit of wine or beer when she got home that wouldn't magically make the pizza she ate earlier vanish from her digestive tract.

The stomach contents were consistent with the pizza Meredith ate earlier in the evening. See page 115 of the PMF translation of the Massei report:

stomach containing 500 cc alimentary bolus, green brown in which were recognizable caseosis (mozzarella?) and vegetable fibre ... empty duodenum

 

[Chris C]

This camera doesn't record all the time. It's triggered by a proximity sensor in the garage and records for some time after being triggered. So it's possible for someone to walk to the cottage and not be recorded by this camera.

Thanks didn't know that about the camera's. First time i've heard that mentioned.

The stomach contents were consistent with the pizza Meredith ate earlier in the evening. See page 115 of the PMF translation of the Massei report:

Even the Massei report acknowledges the stomach contents. Now I previously posted an url in a previous post. It shows that its impossible for Meredith to have died at the prosecutions ToD if she ate pizza at 6pm. So if her friend is TELLING THE TRUTH, then Meredith died around 9pm. If the Massei report is gonna believe that Meredith died between 11pm and 12pm like Mignini claims, then there should have been an investigation into why her friends lied about when she ate pizza and why she has alcohol in her system. After all you can't ignore the last person to have seen meredith alive if her testimony is in direct contradiction of the prosecutions facts. If the prosecution is gonna stick with someone helped Rudy, then you have to choose the friend that walked her home. You have to put her on the list of suspects since her claims put the ToD at a different time. Her claims give Knox/Sollecito an alibi. Her claims give Meredith's ToD a 1 hour window inside a very large window given by the Massei report. (18:50, Nov. 1 and 04:50, Nov. 2) Its 1 of 2 things that hard physical evidence that narrows the time frame inside that large window. The 2nd hard physical evidence would be the phones that where dumped in the garden before 10:13. Thats 2 hard facts that have not been refuted. Now you have 0 physical evidence that can narrow down the ToD after 10:13. All you have are eye witnesses that place Knox/Sollecito somewhere other than that apartement between 10:00pm and 12:15am.

 

[Kevin_Lowe]

The stomach contents were consistent with the pizza Meredith ate earlier in the evening. See page 115 of the PMF translation of the Massei report:

Thank you very much Kestrel. Good stuff.

Kevin, it's only been available for a couple of days, the report is 400 pages long and people do have other things to do.

I must admit that despite my previous remarks, the Massei report is being useful already, thanks to Kestrel.

If the food in her stomach was definitely pizza, then she definitely died not far off 9pm. If her phones were being moved at 10:13pm then the murderer(s) had definitely finished up and moved out by then. I haven't seen a single good reason to discount those points on the timeline.

Barring premeditation, and some kind of cunning computer setup that could remotely execute commands and then erase all trace of itself, Amanda and Raffaele couldn't have gotten to the murder house any earlier than 9:51pm, and that assumes they clicked on the cartoon at 9:46pm and then bolted out the door immediately afterwards. I think that pretty much squelches Alt+F4's theory that they helped Rudy Guede out with the crime, because there's no remotely plausible scenario where Rudy killed Meredith with Amanda and Raffaele's drug-crazed help at 9:51pm or later.

I think that pretty much leaves the simplest and most boring explanation: Amanda and Raffaele were at Raffaele's house at 9pm or shortly thereafter when Meredith was murdered by Rudy, they were still at home at 9:46pm when Rudy was washing himself off, stealing valuables and so forth, and they were almost certainly still at home when Rudy carried the phones away from the house around 10:13pm before dumping them shortly afterwards.

Now we can play whack-a-mole until the cows come home with the rest of the prosecution case but it doesn't matter one iota. If Amanda and Raffaele weren't there, they didn't do it. At that point all the rest of the evidence against them is good for is an object lesson in how much spurious "evidence" a motivated and sufficiently unethical prosecution team can jack up out of nothing with confirmation bias, sleazy arguments and media leaks.

 

[katy_did]

This Perugia police claimed early in the case that this image clearly showed Amanda returning to the cottage at 20:41. The prosecution also claimed that the camera time was 10 minutes ahead of actual time, indicating that the time stamp probably said 20:51, not 20:41. Unfortunately, the only version of this video released is the one you see with the time stamp cropped out of the image.

But the problem in trying to figure out what time the woman was seen at is that we don't know what the actual timestamp of the video is...

That video Charlie posted gives the time as 20.53, as does this TG.com article of the same date (September 08). This article from la Nazione about two weeks later states that the postal police arrived at 12.25, and also claims that the police 'discovered' the CCTV was ten minutes fast in "the days after the murder" (guess they just forgot to mention it till a year later when - on an entirely unrelated note - they also found the CCTV didn't match reports given by Battistelli on his arrival time). Obviously the time in that footage had been adjusted for the 'ten minutes fast' theory. Had the time in the footage from two weeks before that been adjusted, too? If so, that puts the CCTV time at 21.03, meaning the actual time was 21.13-21.14! What about the one from a week and a half after the murder, or the one reported in the trial? Without the actual timestamp on the footage it seems impossible to know, and it doesn't seem that the police ever released footage which showed that timestamp.

• 12.11.07 First reports of the figure on the CCTV, police claim it's Amanda. The time given is 20.43
• 24.09.08 The media report the image is of Meredith, and that the time is 20.53.
• 07.08.08 First 'official' claim that the CCTV camera is 10 minutes fast, in relation to the postal police arrival time. The police claim they knew this by examining the camera in the 'days after the murder'.
• 13.03.09 The prosecution present the footage in court and say it's Meredith. The time reported in the papers is 20.41.

 

[Alt+F4]

According to this source someone opened and closed a "cartoon file" (it could mean an image but I imagine an animated movie is more likely) at 9:46pm, when Meredith had almost certainly been dead for some time.

That's it? Hardly evidence that they were at his apartment.

9:46 p.m. Rafaelle opens and closes a cartoon file on his computer, per his celeb lawyer Giula Buongiorno.

 

[Charlie Wilkes]

Many thanks to the scholars of PMF for their fine translation of Massei's opus. I can see why it took so long. How can anyone translate something that is incomprehensible? This document contains some of the most tangled, convoluted, excruciating prose I have ever read. It is packed with long-winded nonsense like the following:

In this regard, one cannot simply disregard the fact of the bloodstains that were undeniably abundantly present in Meredith's room, from which easily, or indeed inevitably, they must have been exported to other parts of the house by anyone who, coming out of Meredith's room, went into these other parts. This was seen for the footwear belonging to Rudy Guede which marked their owner’s footsteps along the corridor towards the exit from the house; it was seen for the traces found in the bathroom; it should be considered that also happened for the traces found in Romanelli's room, in Knox's room, in the corridor, and it should be pointed out that two of these traces give a mixed biological profile of Amanda and Meredith, and the others the biological profile of Amanda alone. She, it must therefore be held, with her bare feet washed of Meredith’s blood, but on the soles of which some residue of blood must have remained, went into her own room, into Romanelli's room and passed through the corridor, and in several points in the room where she had passed, she left the traces which were discovered.

Massei seems to be saying that anyone who had been in Meredith's room could not have avoided getting blood on their feet, as Guede did. Therefore, the luminol traces can only have been made with blood.

The first problem I have with this is the logic it imposes - how does the presence of blood in Meredith's room preclude luminol stains in other parts of the house being made with some other substance at some other time, as presumably was the case in Raffaele's apartment, where luminol stains were also found?

Second, how is it Guede left visible traces, but the other defendants did not?

But the most significant problem here is that Massei has his facts wrong. None of the bare footprints detected with luminol revealed Meredith's DNA. The only traces of Meredith's DNA associated with the luminol stains were in Rep 176 and Rep. 177, luminol reactions in Filomena's room, which had no shape but were spread over a wide area, and Rep. 183, which was a shoe print.

My jaw did not really drop, however, until I got to the discussion about the footprint on the bathmat and saw that it was analyzed using "the grid of L.M. Robbins."

Crime buffs will understand why it is stunning to see this reference, offered without caveat, in a court report dated 2010. But for those who don't know about this woman, Google "Louise Robbins junk science" and scan the first few hits. We now have a formal, documented link between this investigation and the legendary Nicarico case, in which Robbins' role is summarized as follows:

One detective, who resigned because he believed the wrong people had been charged, explained:

The first lab guy says it's not the boot. . . . We don't like that answer, so there's no paper [report]. We go to a second guy who used to do our lab. He says yes. So we write a report on Mr. Yes. Then Louise Robbins arrives. This is the boot, she says. That'll be $10,000. So now we have evidence; See Barry Siegel, Presumed Guilty: An Illinois Murder Case Became a Test of Conscience Inside the System, L.A. Times, Nov. 1, 1992 (Magazine), at 18, 20.

http://smithforensic.blogspot.com/2009/03/louise-robbins-and-cinderella-when.html

 

[RoseMontague]

If he is correct and Meredith did eat a few mushrooms and had a bit of wine or beer when she got home then the attack couldn't have happened shortly after 9. How long might that take to have this snack, 10 minutes? So now the time of the attack is pushed back to 9:15 making the timeline even shorter.

It's a good point and the reason the defense wanted that piece tested. They believe it is a piece of apple from her apple crumb dessert eaten along with the pizza. The prosecution did not test it. The appeal is asking for it to be tested.

 

[LondonJohn]

The stomach contents were consistent with the pizza Meredith ate earlier in the evening. See page 115 of the PMF translation of the Massei report:

Exactly. And the reason why the state of the stomach contents (and lack of chyme in the duodenum) can be so relatively precise in estimating time of death is that there is reliable testimony that Meredith was alive up until 9pm. The state of Meredith's gastro-intestinal system actually implies that death occurred at any time between around 8.00pm and 9.30pm - given that a small/moderate sized meal of pizza was eaten by Meredith at around 6.00-6.30pm. But her friend Sophie Purton testified that she saw Meredith alive as they parted company at around 8.55pm (or possibly a few minutes earlier).

So if Sophie Purton's recollection and veracity are both to be accepted (and there's no reason why they shouldn't be, except perhaps for a possible small discrepancy in the timing), then this 8.00-9.30pm window can clearly be narrowed down to 9.00-9.30pm, (giving at least an extra five minutes for Meredith to arrive home, since it's been established that Meredith's attack started within her room).

Of course, if Meredith were attacked very shortly after returning home, then - given the nature of her injuries - it's likely that her gastro-intestinal systems would have shut down within 10-15 minutes, and brain stem death would have occurred within 20-25 minutes. So I contend that she was very possibly confronted by 9.05, stabbed by 9.10, her stomach stopped functioning by around 9.20-9.25 (completely in line with the later end of the ToD range indicated by the stomach contents), and she was dead at the brain stem level by 9.30-9.35. Given that Meredith would have almost certainly been totally unconscious within 10-15 minutes or so of the stabbings (9.20-9.25pm in this scenario), any lone attacker would have had ample time (in my view) to clean himself up, move Meredith's body, go through her belongings, and leave via the front door (using Meredith's keys) by 10pm - far in advance of the car breaking down outside the house.

I seriously cannot comprehend how Meredith's autopsy findings regarding her gastro-intestinal contents can possibly support the prosecution's (and Massei's) time of death of 11.30pm. This implies that the pizza still had not been broken down by the stomach acids and enzymes over five hours after it had been ingested. And this is - as far as I know - completely at odds with all existing knowledge of the speed of transit through the stomach.

For a meal of that size and contents, consumed by a healthy young woman with no underlying gastro-intestinal disorders, who had a relatively sedentary period following the meal, the pizza should have been completely converted into chyme (from which the original constituent elements - cheese, vegetable matter etc would have been unrecognisable) between 90 minutes and 3 hours after ingestion. And the chyme would then have been progressively passed out of the stomach, into the duodenum, then further down the small intestine. Yet nothing was found in Meredith's duodenum or upper small intestine...

 

[RoseMontague]

From the PMF translated Massei report:

...at the hearing of October 9, 2009 the Defences articulated requests for expert reports
according to the provisions of Article 507 of the Criminal Procedure Code.
particular, a medico-legal expert report was requested, with the aim of
ascertaining in terms of greater practicability in respect of the indications furnished:
the time of death of Meredith Kercher (once a time band narrower than that
indicated by the technical consultants of the Prosecutor or of the panel of experts
under the preliminary investigations judge [the GIP], it would be possible to verify
whether Raffaele Sollecito had interacted with his PC within a more precisely
defined timeframe); the dynamics of the action of the murder, also in reference to the
infallibility of the presence, or otherwise, of a number of agents; the repetition of the
genetic investigations, or at least the revaluation of the traces with reference to
Exhibits 165B and 36, the procedures/methodology of the gathering of the exhibits
undertaken by the genetics expert of the Scientific Police, Dr Stefanoni, who carried
out the verifications, having been questioned; an expert audiometric test was sought,
to be undertaken to establish whether the witness Nara Capezzali, on the premise of
the presence in her dwelling of double-glazed windows, was able to hear the noises
and the screams of which she had given an account in her deposition; an expert
report on the computers of the accused was requested, the memories of which were
found to have been damaged at the time of the analysis of the supports carried out
by the Postal Police, such that the hard drives could not be duplicated/cloned for
subsequent examination.
The Court disallowed all the requests, on the grounds that the additional expert
reports requested did not appear necessary, since the very ample dialectic
contribution from the expert witnesses of the private parties offered sufficient
material to take a position without additional expertise.

The appeals are asking these things again from what I gather from those documents. My question is regarding the ruling on the computers. How can you have "sufficient material to take a position without additional expertise" on the damaged computers. I understand the reasoning behind denying some of these other requests although I don't agree with it. However, the computers were obviously damaged by the police experts and there could be information of importance to the case that was not able to be revealed after that damage. This appears to me to be a reasonable, common sense request that should have been granted.

The audiometric test also seems to me to be just as reasonable. How can the experts have "sufficient material to take a position" without knowing if it was even possible for her to hear what she claimed she heard.

The other requests revolve around areas of great dispute that the appeal court should consider but these two being disallowed do not make any sense at all to me.

 

[Alt+F4]

It's a good point and the reason the defense wanted that piece tested. They believe it is a piece of apple from her apple crumb dessert eaten along with the pizza. The prosecution did not test it. The appeal is asking for it to be tested.

They think it's not mushrooms but rather apple?

 

[Alt+F4]

So I contend that she was very possibly confronted by 9.05, stabbed by 9.10, her stomach stopped functioning by around 9.20-9.25 (completely in line with the later end of the ToD range indicated by the stomach contents), and she was dead at the brain stem level by 9.30-9.35.

And the sexual assult, when do you think that happened? My belief is that he stabbed her because she resisted his advances so the whole thing being over in 5 minutes is highly unlikely...unless more than one person was involved.

If the report is correct and Meredith had alcohol in her system (her blood alcohol was 0.43) that means she had a drink when she got home, as her friends said everyone only had water with the pizza. There was no unfinished drink in the apartment or broken drinking glass so she had enough time to not only finish her drink but put the glass away. A reasonable amount of time to get the drink, pour it, drink it, wash the glass and put it away is about 15 minutes.

So I contend she was attacked no earlier than 9.20. The sexual assult and stabbing probably took about another 20 minutes. I think it took this long because I strongly believe she put up a struggle ("characteristics of non-cooperation of the young woman") and also because of all the bruises.