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Coalition in Westminster

This caught my eye

"We will examine the balance of the EU’s existing competences and will, in particular, work to limit the application of the Working Time Directive in the United Kingdom."

Hmm. Does it mean junior doctors going back to 80 hours a week?

Great news though on scrapping the ID card scheme, and libel review (though that was belatedly on Labour sights also).

High speed rail networks were also announced by the previous government, but I think they're a long way off.
 
richardm said:
Besides, the AV system falls quite a way short of what the Lib Dems have been after for years and years; I can't see what it gains them to go for that now.
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Half a loaf is better than no bread. Alternatively, "politics is the art of the possible." The Lib Dems will come out considerably ahead under AV, which makes this a typical political compromise. No one gets everything they want, everyone gets something they want.

If the Lib Dems had held out for immediate full PR, they would simply have gained nothing out of this parliament....
 
The Libdems have sold their soul. They have won virtually no concessions, just promises to "consider" things such as AV and scrapping trident. We all know what "consider" means.

Ok, not entirely nothing. Cuts for inheritance and married couple taxes have been blocked, and a shift of plane taxation from per plane to per passenger has been promised. Encroachments upon civil liberties will be reversed, or so they say.

Not entirely nothing, but depressingly little. Vote Labour, next time round.
 
At the next election, assuming the Tories & the Libs are no longer in coalition, the LibDems will be in the interesting position of having to campaign against their own government record.
 
richardm said:
Besides, the AV system falls quite a way short of what the Lib Dems have been after for years and years; I can't see what it gains them to go for that now.
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It gains them a more-or-less guaranteed balance of power in the next set of negotiations to form a coalition government, in which they can use their continued leverage to get more of their preferred policies adopted. It'll also protect them from the perception that a LibDem vote is a wasted vote, because anyone who wants to keep out the Conservatives can simply list Labour as second choice and Monster Raving Loony as third, and get the same effect.

Dave
 
drkitten said:
Half a loaf is better than no bread. Alternatively, "politics is the art of the possible." The Lib Dems will come out considerably ahead under AV, which makes this a typical political compromise. No one gets everything they want, everyone gets something they want.

If the Lib Dems had held out for immediate full PR, they would simply have gained nothing out of this parliament....
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They're still going to starve to death on that half loaf, though; I don't think they're going to come out much better off under AV anyway, but particularly because:

Dave Rogers said:
It'll also protect them from the perception that a LibDem vote is a wasted vote, because anyone who wants to keep out the Conservatives can simply list Labour as second choice and Monster Raving Loony as third, and get the same effect.
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The idea that Labour voters might vote Lib Dem tactically in future is likely to fall on very stony ground indeed, if the first time they get within a sniff of power they side with the Tories.
 
richardm said:
The idea that Labour voters might vote Lib Dem tactically in future is likely to fall on very stony ground indeed, if the first time they get within a sniff of power they side with the Tories.
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I kind of hope people realise that it was a bit more complex than that. How was any other coalition apart from Labour/Conservative going to survive its first contentious vote? The choice before the LibDems wasn't between siding with Labour or siding with the Conservatives, it was between a government and a mess.

And all this is predicated on the black-and-white, politics-as-a-football-match thinking that's the bane of any kind of consensus thinking in this country. As a nation, we need to grow up a bit.

Dave
 
Dave Rogers said:
I kind of hope people realise that it was a bit more complex than that. How was any other coalition apart from Labour/Conservative going to survive its first contentious vote? The choice before the LibDems wasn't between siding with Labour or siding with the Conservatives, it was between a government and a mess.

And all this is predicated on the black-and-white, politics-as-a-football-match thinking that's the bane of any kind of consensus thinking in this country. As a nation, we need to grow up a bit.

Dave
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Well, the Tories could have set up a minority government and worked on consensus for individual issues. That seems to be working tolerably well in Scotland. They didn't have to forge a coalition at any cost in order to do this, and the Lib Dems certainly didn't need to support them.

Edit again: I have no idea what I was driving at with this sentence, so I've killed it.
 
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lionking said:
I'm at a bit of a loss. The Lib-dems are left of Labour, or am I misreading things? And they can form a coalition with the Tories?

They must be on a promise of proportional representation, which I can't see being honoured. Another election within 12 months is my prediction.
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Left and right are misleading labels when talking of the modern parties front benches and policies. Backbench torys tend to be centre-right to mid-right, back bench labour mid-left to far left and backbench lib-dem tend to be centre to centre-left, but front benches of each have a mix of policies.

Lib-dems and torys have a surprising amount in common, particularly when it comes to the less "blue sky thinking" lib-dem policies.

richardm said:
I can't quite see how it is going to hang together. I'd like to think that genuine compromise with the Lib Dems would temper the worst of the Tory instincts, but why do I have such a nasty feeling that they're going to roll over and take whatever the Tories offer just in order to keep their ministerial seats?

I also wonder about the numerous Tory MPs who were fondly expecting to become ministers or cabinet ministers, and who now find themselves on the back benches instead. Are they going to be muttering darkly about Dave and his New Friends, to the detriment of all?

Edit: Proportional representation is a key policy for the Lib Dems. The Tories aren't offering them that, just a referendum on Alternative Vote which isn't the same thing. They have also apparently amended some of their tax plans to suit the Lib Dems better. We shall see what actually transpires, though.
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I agree and think this could be a genuine "all star" government, with Lib Dems and the Tory's each curbing the others worst excesses - toff-tax-break tendancies, euroscepticism (to a happy median of sceptical cooperation hopefully), environmental policies ("clean" coal is a joke, but nuclear is necessary) etc.

They also have near identical schools policies and hopefully Lib-dem university policy will prevail. Torys have better grasp of reality in terms of economics, but will benefit from some the Lib-Dem initiatives.

Basically, PROVIDED they dont descend into bickering and keep their eye on the prize this could be an incredible government.
 
Lallante said:
this could be a genuine "all star" government, with Lib Dems and the Tory's each curbing the others worst excesses
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I'd like to think so - but I'm also reminded that Blair said that by siding with Bush he'd be able to curb his worst excesses and I'm not sure how well that worked out.
 
richardm said:
I'd like to think so - but I'm also reminded that Blair said that by siding with Bush he'd be able to curb his worst excesses and I'm not sure how well that worked out.
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Blair and Bush had many of the same weaknesses, and Blair was too busy sucking up to do much curbing. I dont think you'll see that problem with Cleggster.
 
We've had coalition governments for the last umpteen years. Both Labour and Conservatives are coalitions of people with widely divergent views (Blair/Brown, Major/Eurosceptics, Maggie/"Wets" ). In the end enlightened self interest makes them work and I suspect it will be the same this time.

Steve
 
I think the LibDems know full well this coalition will fall apart in a few months, and all the "concessions" they made to the Tories was nothing more than stall time while they prepare for the next election.

If the Tories are smart, they'll realize this too.
 
commandlinegamer said:
Great news though on scrapping the ID card scheme.
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As German living (happily!) in the UK, I am still amazed about the British's reluctance for something like ID cards, or a proper residence registration system, while they are happy to live in the most CCTV-observed country in the world and have a heightened fear of identity theft.
 
Yogzotot said:
As German living (happily!) in the UK, I am still amazed about the British's reluctance for something like ID cards, or a proper residence registration system, while they are happy to live in the most CCTV-observed country in the world and have a heightened fear of identity theft.
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I'm not happy about those either.
 
martu said:
An awful lot of grown up talk about working together for the good of the country but I can’t believe them. They’re politicians after all. I give it 6 months until the Lib Dem back benchers vote with the opposition on an important bill and then it gets really messy.
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It is going to need more than that. Add up the Tories and the 20 LibDems who are members of the government and you have a majority given that SF won't take their seats.

So it would need all of the Lib Dem backbenchers plus either some Tories or some Lib Dem's willing to resign from government for the coalition to actually lose a vote.
 
I think the Lib Dems have been the party of opposition for so long that now they actually have some real power they don't know what the hell to do.
 
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