Amanda Knox guilty - all because of a cartwheel

[capealadin]

Bruce: What Amanda did was LIE to the police many times, over MANY different things.

 

[shuttlt]

A few posts back Charlie mentioned:

Sometimes it's the black guy who doesn't leave any DNA but gets convicted anyway. But this guy is lucky compared with a lot of others. He has supporters who know he didn't do it. They won't ever abandon him, and eventually, they'll get him out. Ditto Amanda and Raffaele.

I've done a bit of digging on how frequent it is for there to be no DNA evidence, and found the following:

"The DNA testing and evidence only occurs in a situation where the assailant leaves biological evidence behind. For the most part, we are talking about rape cases where there is semen left that can be tested. There are occasionally non-rape cases where the assailant may have left behind hair fragments or fingernail fragments that are of a sufficient quantity that they can be tested for DNA. But if no biological evidence is left behind, which is what occurs in most cases in the criminal justice system, no DNA testing can occur. The second qualifier is: even among those cases where there is biological evidence left behind that can be tested, if it is not gathered and collected and preserved properly, you will end up with a false test.

So I think the possibilities with DNA testing are immense in terms of being able to exonerate certain people, or on the other hand, definitively indicate that they were the perpetrator. But it still will not be available in somewhere between 70 and 75 percent of the cases in the criminal justice system, perhaps even more. So it is not the silver bullet that is going to solve our criminal justice system problems."

Ellen Kreitzberg, JD, Professor of Law at Santa Clara University
http://deathpenalty.procon.org/view.answers.php?questionID=001189

 

[BobTheDonkey]

Amanda was with Raffaele at his apartment. She told the police this many times.

Sure. She also told the Police that she was at the cottage while Meredith was being brutally raped/murdered.


Regardless of that (because I'm sure you'll argue that it was under duress - both times that she made the claim, and for the entire 2 weeks after when she didn't acknowledge that Lumumba had had nothing to do with this entire affair - but whatever), Raffaele disagreed. In fact, he clearly stated that their original alibi was untrue (rubbish, etc depending on translation). He even went so far as to suggest that not only could Amanda have disappeared from his apartment for a few hours that night, she also might be responsible for giving his kitchen knife to the killer.


So why should we believe Amanda when the evidence and Raffaele (her alibi) contradict her statements?

 

[Bruce Fischer]

You need to back that up Bruce. Do you have anything beyond mere assertion? What a strange burglar with no criminal record.



How would he have known? Is he clairvoyant? Could he read minds? Was the information beamed down to him from the mother ship? How could he possibly know exactly who was going to be where and when? Is there any evidence for this 'casing out'?

Also, casing out for what? What was the prize for such an investment of time, energy and risk? Was a rare world famous priceless diamond stashed in the cottage that we don't know about? Lost Nazi gold? A missing Rembrandt?

Your losing your temper again, relax.

If Rudy spoke with the guys downstairs he most likely would have had information telling him where people might be that night. There are no absolutes here.

Can you prove to me that Rudy was wearing pants on the night of the murder? How about shoes? Shirt? Underwear?

Well we don't have those items so I guess with your logic in regard to the possibility of gloves, Rudy must have been completely naked.

Once again, I briefly mentioned the possibility of gloves. We do not know these things for sure.

 

[capealadin]

Amanda admits to watching shows like *CSI*. That's why she said she knew Meredith *fffffff* bled to death. Knowing that your calls are being recorded is a given.

 

[Fulcanelli]

There is no proof that two knives were used. Nothing whatsoever. The knife that left the imprint on the bed could have made all of the wounds on Meredith. Where is the murder weapon? Where is the knife that left the imprint on the bed?

Yes there is Bruce, the wounds were created by two completely different sized knives. One wound was only 4 cm deep and that was the length of the knife because the the blade went in hilt deep..that's because the imprint of said handle is on the outside the wound. The other wound was much deeper and therefore couldn't possibly have been made with a 4 cm blade. There were two knives, at least.

Rudy did have marks on his body consistent with an assault using a knife.

Knife wielders hold the handle. And the cut to his hand could have happened any time, anywhere and in fact was probably self inflicted, in order to support his story of fighting off an attacker. None of his blood was found at the scene. That seals it for me.

 

[Bruce Fischer]

Sure. She also told the Police that she was at the cottage while Meredith was being brutally raped/murdered.


Regardless of that (because I'm sure you'll argue that it was under duress - both times that she made the claim, and for the entire 2 weeks after when she didn't acknowledge that Lumumba had had nothing to do with this entire affair - but whatever), Raffaele disagreed. In fact, he clearly stated that their original alibi was untrue (rubbish, etc depending on translation). He even went so far as to suggest that not only could Amanda have disappeared from his apartment for a few hours that night, she also might be responsible for giving his kitchen knife to the killer.


So why should we believe Amanda when the evidence and Raffaele (her alibi) contradict her statements?

There is no evidence to contradict her statement that she was at Raffaele's.
If you ask Raffaele where Amanda was on the night of the murder, he will say that she was with him at his apartment.

Amanda was defended in court by Raffaele's attorneys. There is no disagreement between Amanda and Raffaele about their whereabouts on the night of the murder. They were together at Raffaele's on the night of the murder.

 

[Dan O.]

A potential burglar can't see the latch isn't done up, the latch is on the inside. They would close, just not tightly enough to apply the latch. To all looking it it would have appeared the shutters were shut fast.

[qimg]http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/gallery/image.php?album_id=21&image_id=77[/qimg]

These look shut tight to me...and those aren't new shutters.

Proving my point. The police have no intentions of opening and closing those shutters every day and they need to secure the crime scene. They would have pulled the shutters closed against the friction of the sill and latched them, possibly even wiring the latch closed for extra security. Filomena could not latch the shutters because they were not closed when she left the morning of the murder.

 

[capealadin]

No answer as to how Raff knew nothing was missing , Bruce???

 

[Fulcanelli]

[qyote="Bruce Fisher"]The Massei report is not evidence. It is an interpretation of the evidence. Anyone who believes that Amanda and Raffaele have been wrongly convicted obviously disagrees with Massei's interpretation.

Showing the Massei report to Charlie will not change his interpretation of the evidence.[/quote]

No Bruce, this is where you are wrong. The report contains the evidence. Massei is quite meticulous in reporting every relevant piece of evidence, the prosecution arguments for it and the defence arguments against it. You may not agree with his conclusions, but the report contains all the evidence before he makes his conclusions.

 

[Fulcanelli]

Actually, it would have been just 4 more years if I am not mistaken.

You are mistaken. They were facing life. A reduction from that to 26 years is a huge reduction indeed.

 

[Bruce Fischer]

Well, it was YOU that asserted that Rudy cased the cottage out beforehand. Are you now arguing that he didn't?



Yes there is Bruce, the wounds were created by two completely different sized knives. One wound was only 4 cm deep and that was the length of the knife because the the blade went in hilt deep..that's because the imprint of said handle is on the outside the wound. The other wound was much deeper and therefore couldn't possibly have been made with a 4 cm blade. There were two knives, at least.



Knife wielders hold the handle. And the cut to his hand could have happened any time, anywhere and in fact was probably self inflicted, in order to support his story of fighting off an attacker. None of his blood was found at the scene. That seals it for me.

You need to study up on "knife wielders"

It is very common for "knife wielders" to cut themselves on the knife when they attack.

One knife made all of the wounds on Meredith. Your information is incorrect.

Please study up on knife attacks before you state that "knife wielders" hold the handle of the knife.

 

[BobTheDonkey]

Bruce:

The "experienced burglar" Rudy (again, where is the criminal record?) was experienced enough to case out the cottage for occupants - but foolish enough to not pay attention to the few items of value contained therein?

Again, we get to this logical gap: "Rudy was a very accomplished burglar, except when he wasn't".

Experienced burglars don't carry weapons - why not? Because then it's not just "Grand Theft"...it becomes "Armed Burglary". Very different when it comes to sentencing. But, there I go, making assumptions. See how that's a baseless assumption? I don't really have any evidence of this - but it sure sounded good at the time I stated it and seems like common sense/logic would support it.

 

[LiamG.]

Over 60 recorded phone calls and the police were inable to find anything incriminating about Amanda Knox.

If she had anything to do with the murder, she surely would have said something to someone during all of those secretly recorded calls.

Look at this:
/watch?v=4dMOiBkneV8&feature=related
At 1:45 Barbie N. says they (the police) intercepted a phone call between Rs and Ak after the murder, in which she said: "I can`t take it anymore"

What did she mean?

LiamG.

(plz place the youtube URL before /watch?v... im not yet allowed to post URLs)

 

[BobTheDonkey]

It is very common for "knife wielders" to cut themselves on the knife when they attack.

Evidence?

One knife made all of the wounds on Meredith. Your information is incorrect.

Evidence?

Please study up on knife attacks before you state that "knife wielders" hold the handle of the knife.

Evidence?

ETA: Interestingly, every time I've ever used a knife, I've wielded it by the handle. I'd be a bit surprised if the wielder were to use the blade to hold the knife. I mean, that's just a ridiculous assertion.

 

[capealadin]

Bruce: Amanda said she was at Raff's apartment. However, You cannot didpute that Raff said she WASN,T. Therein lies the rub. And, I will not ask again, how Raff knew nothing was stolen. Your non answer says it all.

 

[Amazer]

Amanda was with Raffaele at his apartment. She told the police this many times.

I'd like to see some evidence that backs up her claim. She and Raffaele just have too many differences in their account of that night. As a result I cannot just take her word for it.

 

[BobTheDonkey]

There is no evidence to contradict her statement that she was at Raffaele's.
If you ask Raffaele where Amanda was on the night of the murder, he will say that she was with him at his apartment.

Amanda was defended in court by Raffaele's attorneys. There is no disagreement between Amanda and Raffaele about their whereabouts on the night of the murder. They were together at Raffaele's on the night of the murder.

Do you have a quote of Raffaele's last statement in regards to the night of the murder?

The last statement from Raffaele that I've seen clearly states that while he was at his apartment, he couldn't vouch for Amanda's whereabouts.

And of course the Defense teams worked together. Their clients' futures were inextricably linked together being as they were each other's alibis - i.e. if Amanda was Raffaele's alibi, and she is proven guilty...then there goes Raffaele's alibi. It was, therefore, in his Defense team's best interest of it's client that it present a united front with Amanda's Defense team.

 

[Bruce Fischer]

Amanda admits to watching shows like *CSI*. That's why she said she knew Meredith *fffffff* bled to death. Knowing that your calls are being recorded is a given.

Do you really think that Amanda was aware that her calls were being recorded?

Was it really a stretch for Amanda to believe that Meredith bled to death?

You really have a grasp on all of the old refuted guilter talking points. You must have taken notes. Good work.

 

[Bruce Fischer]

I'd like to see some evidence that backs up her claim. She and Raffaele just have too many differences in their account of that night. As a result I cannot just take her word for it.

Every single person in Perugia that was either alone at home or with only one other person on the night of the murder would all have no alibi.