No Obamacare for Obama

Shalamar said:
What the hell are you talking about?
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This citizen and veteran is feeling the 'death by a thousand cuts', and am just showing my frustration with the slow, incremental loss of personal freedom in exchange for social justice and government involvement in, and control of, more and more aspects of daily life.
 
Kodiak said:
This citizen and veteran is feeling the 'death by a thousand cuts', and am just showing my frustration with the slow, incremental loss of personal freedom in exchange for social justice and government involvement in, and control of, more and more aspects of daily life.
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Move out while you still have that freedom.
 
Kodiak said:
Why don't I just mail my f***ing check to DC now and get it over with!?! Levin, Stabenow, and Obama can provide...



serenity now...
serenity now...


SERENITY NOW!!!...
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Ok, you get points for that. You're not in computer sales, are you? :)

Anyway, does your current insurance cover pediatrics and maternity?
 
Kodiak said:
This citizen and veteran is feeling the 'death by a thousand cuts', and am just showing my frustration with the slow, incremental loss of personal freedom in exchange for social justice and government involvement in, and control of, more and more aspects of daily life.
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What freedoms are you losing?

And I see you've taken up the Glen Beck cry that 'Social Justice' is somehow evil. What is wrong with ensuring that everyone within the USA has access to affordable, and comprehensive health care?
 
joobz said:
What's with these increasingly stupid arguments?
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Obviously, as the health care reforms draw nearer and nearer, the opponents grow more and more desperate:D.

And I see you've taken up the Glen Beck cry that 'Social Justice' is somehow evil. What is wrong with ensuring that everyone within the USA has access to affordable, and comprehensive health care?
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Probably the same problem they have with treating criminals like human beings. What the problem is, of course, I have absolutely no idea.
 
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So, the law says that any qualified health plan must offer maternity care and pediatrics. You yourself say that your plan offers maternity care and pediatrics.

From what you posted, the law doesn't say you have to take those options, just that a qualified health plan has to offer them. Yours does.

Where's the problem?
 
Shalamar said:
For the most art, people who have insurance, are not affected.
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Geeze … the dishonesty ...

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/03/21/us/health-care-reform.html

March 21, 2010

You can keep your current plan— or —you can buy coverage through new state-run insurance marketplaces, called “exchanges,” starting in 2014.

If you are insured and pay on your own

If you keep your current plan

Within six months, the plans will have to stop some practices, like setting lifetime limits on coverage and canceling policy holders who get sick. They will also have to allow children to stay on their parents’ policies until they turn 26 and cover children with pre-existing conditions, but can still deny adults with medical problems until 2014.
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And what do you think will be the consequence of those changes will be? Will insurance companies be able to keep rates the same as now? Of course not. Don't be silly.

Premiums for individual policies will be 10 to 13 percent higher by 2016 than the average premium that year under current law, according to Congressional estimates.
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Promises promises. Keep in mind that those *estimates* came from people (and are reported by people) who were trying to sell this bill to the public and who are trying to put a happy face on what has happened. Keep in mind those estimates are coming from the same sort of people who promised Medicare would only cost $12 billion in 1990 (it ended up costing $98 billion).

I predict the reality will be even higher increases than that … that is for people who don't get the *insurance* for free. And the increases will not only be in terms of increased premiums but higher taxes and lower gdp growth. Afterall, someone has to pay for all the free (subsidized) health care that the government will be handing out (especially to democrat constituents).


But most people would qualify for subsidies, meaning they might pay less than they do now.
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Except there is no such thing as a free lunch. Someone eventually has to pay for the health care those people will receive. It won't be only those who don't get subsidies. It will show up in higher taxes for everyone, because companies will pass on their higher health care costs to the public via higher prices. And democrats are going to force our children to pay far into the future (through the increased debt) for the health care that democrat constituents will be getting now.

High-income earners — families making more than $250,000 — will pay several thousand dollars more in Medicare payroll taxes starting in 2013. Their unearned income, now exempt from the payroll tax, would also be subject to a 3.8 percent levy.
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Bet you it works out to more than that. And how many fewer jobs will those *high-income earners* (mostly people who own small businesses) create as a result? Bet it's not only the upper class who end up paying something in the end. The lower income class may pay in terms of higher unemployment.

If you are insured through your employer

If you keep your current plan

Within six months, the plans will have to stop some practices, like setting lifetime limits on coverage and canceling policy holders who get sick. They will also have to allow children to stay on their parents’ policies through age 26 and cover children with pre-existing conditions, but can still deny adults with medical problems until 2014.
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Same comments as before. Expect premiums, taxes and prices of most everything to go up as a result of this largess. But heck, according to Shalamar, we won't be affected. :rolleyes:

Insurers will have to pay a 40 percent excise tax on high-value group plans – those in which premiums for families are $27,500 or more, for instance – starting in 2018. Experts say the tax will likely be passed on to employees through higher premiums or lower benefits and wages.
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Of course, many democrat union supporters (friends of Obama) got an exemption written into the law so they won't have to pay this. That only means that the rest of us wil see even higher premiums and lower benefits/wages.

Starting in 2013, flexible spending accounts, which allow users to escape taxes on many medical expenses now, will be limited. There will be a $2,500 maximum on accounts that typically carry $4,000 or $5,000 limits now, and you will no longer be able to use the accounts for over-the-counter medicines.
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No, we won't be affected. :rolleyes:

High-income earners — families making more than $250,000 – would pay several thousand dollars more in Medicare payroll taxes starting in 2013. Their unearned income, now exempt from the payroll tax, would also be subject to a 3.8 percent levy.
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Not affected in the least. :rolleyes:

I predict that many companies that currently offer health insurance are going to stop doing so … thus effectively throwing people onto the government plan. I predict that many companies are going to have to cut back on the number of employees to pay for what the government is now going to require companies to give the government to fund all those new healthcare freebie handouts. And I predict the government run plans will be just as cost effective as ... Medicare (which Obama recently told us is threatening to bankrupt the country). Care to make a wager?
 
I've even heard that Obama is exempt from unemployment benefits! Utterly disgraceful.
 
Shalamar said:
What freedoms are you losing?

And I see you've taken up the Glen Beck cry that 'Social Justice' is somehow evil. What is wrong with ensuring that everyone within the USA has access to affordable, and comprehensive health care?
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Please don't lump me in with that butt head. Besides the fact that health care is not a right, how is punishing those who wish to not take part "access"?

If you truly want health care to be affordable, we should ban all firearms, alcohol, and cigarettes, tax the obese and drug addicted, and euthanize all nonproductive elderly.

And why stop there? Lets end racism through mandatory interracial marriages, and end poverty with a 50% tax on everyone earning $100,000+...
 
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Kodiak said:
Please don't lump me in with that butt head. Besides the fact that health care is not a right, how is punishing those who wish to not take part "access"?
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And those who DO want Health care, but cannot afford it? Or who cannot access it due to 'pre-existing conditions'? Or those that HAVE Health care, only to have their insurance drop them, because they get too expensive? Or those that have Health Care, but still accumulate a massive debt anyways?


If you truly want health care to be affordable, we should ban all firearms, alcohol, and cigarettes, tax the obese and drug addicted, and euthanize all nonproductive elderly.
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Just like every other first world country?

And why stop there? Lets end racism through mandatory interracial marriages, and end poverty with a 50% tax on everyone earning $100,000+...
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Now this.. is just stupid.
 
Shalamar said:
And those who DO want Health care, but cannot afford it? Or who cannot access it due to 'pre-existing conditions'? Or those that HAVE Health care, only to have their insurance drop them, because they get too expensive? Or those that have Health Care, but still accumulate a massive debt anyways?
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Offer medicare to these individuals and leave the rest of us alone.
 
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