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Merged Continuation - 9/11 CT subforum General Discussion Thread

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According to debunkers there should be thousands of recordings of any sounds claimed on 9/11. If you can't find at least 500, they must not have happened.

Sorry.

I love truthers with poor reading for comprehension skillz. u need to do bettr investagoogling.

No one claims that "should be thousands of recordings of ANY sounds claimed on 911."

Now if there were explosions necessary to cut steel beams, they would be at over 140 DB. That would be on any and ALL video near ground zero.

Massive fail.
try again.
 
No I did not know as much. In fact that line of thinking seems to me to be insane. If people heard explosions and claimed as much there is absolutely no way to determine exactly what they heard or how loud it was after the fact.

Did you not know that?

Yet again personal ignorance.

Got it.

How many things explode in common fires? I can think of 10 to 20 things that would be in normal office buildings which would explode in office fires.

Now lets go back to BASIC science. REady? Before you make a claim of what something is, you need to be able to ELIMINATE everything that it is not.

Very simple. Very easy. Can you eliminate any of the 10 things which are present in office buildings which explode when on fire? Yes or no?
 
And what? I can't find an architect who says different?

Here's a principle engineer at WTC who isn't surprised that the planes caused the towers to collapse.

Henry Guthard, engineer and one of [WTC designer] Yamasaki's original partners who also worked as the project manager at the [WTC] site, said, "For the airplane to hit the building, to disappear, to have pieces come out the other side, it was amazing the building stood. To defend against 5,000 (sic) gallons of ignited fuel in a building of 1350 feet is just not possible.


http://snurl.com/j54gc (Report From Ground Zero page 188​
 
How many things explode in common fires? I can think of 10 to 20 things that would be in normal office buildings which would explode in office fires.

Many years ago, my Boy Scout uniform was permanently stained when a can of beef stroganoff sauce exploded in the campfire.

True story.
 
aggle

I'm not suprised. I know people who have blown up beer keegs by throwing them into fires. I used to be a firemarshall (way back in the day) for part of my job, and one of the things we would do is take old fire extinguishers and throw them into a fire and then let them explode (we were behind a steel wall) to show that fires would cause fire extinguishers to explode.

Of course that leaves out
deodorant
perfume
plugged in computers
plugged in monitors
electrical transformers
electrical fuse boxes
water heaters
propane tanks
water pipes
AC units
batteries
copier toner
industrial cleaning supplies
any compressed gas items (like wd40, compressed air, etc)
the compressed air cylinders on the bottom of office chairs
bodies striking the ground
etc...
(and that is just off of the top of my head)
Now can HI/ algebra/ Profanz manage to eliminate ANY of those as the sources of the "explosions" people heard? No he can't. But he will try to say they were what cut the columns. Bad science. Yet again.
 
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A 110 story building was not collapsing at the same time in 93. And still, you claim the buildings collapsed from the plane crashes and fire. Look at the video of the plane crashes. It's not that loud from the perspective of the cameras recording it. How loud was the fire?

The collapse would have been around 100-110 Db. loud.

An explosive going off, well above 130 db.

Not going to cover it up. Not a chance in hell.

How loud was the fire?? Maybe 70 db??? Maybe?? WTH does it matter?
 
I think it is insane to claim for a fact what it is they heard. The building according to debunkers collapsed without any explosives. The building floors were an acre wide. So if explosives were in the core how far was that from the street? Once the building started to fail from hundreds of feet in the air and hundreds of feet into the core how many people would have heard these sounds as the building fell all the way down? Would they and their recorder still be alive? What does it matter?

My point is still that no one now can claim what anyone heard and what they didn't well after the fact.

So eloquently put Profanz. This issue has been discussed endlessly in these forums but I guess its worth starting a whole new discussion on them, since people reading this will have forgotten the other 122 threads in this forum that have discussed explosives or they may not be aware of the papers and articles on this issue that try and comprehensively evaluate both sides of the argument.

I cannot agree with Trutherslie that exploding perfume bottles brought down the twin towers. Our evidence is much stronger than that:

1. We have the evidence from the firemen that mentioned explosions. Unfortunately they are too afraid of authority or of being ridiculed by their fellow firemen to support our petition.

2. We even have a few firemen who mentioned flashes, but unfortunately there were no photographs of these flashes. So they presumably occured deep in the building since most of the windows were filmed and photographed.

3. Then there is the missing sound of the explosions. But I like your idea that the explosions were deep in the building. I guess the drywall kept in the noise.

4. But what about that big explosion at the start of the collapse. I particularly like our slide that says "Does this look like a gravitational collapse"? Well of course it looks like an almighty explosion to me. Its not that difficult to believe that a very large and quiet explosive device survived the impact and also survived the fires before it was detonated. So we were either very lucky that the explosives were located at the impact level or you need to put some credibilty in the radio controlled plane theory. It would have been really obvious and embarrassing if the plane hit the tower lower down and the collapse started 20 floors above.

5. And then we have all these squibs. Flashless explosions during the collapse sequence. This might even be a new form of explosives developed by the military. But what strange patterns they laid them in... and how did the explosives just blow out a single window in some cases and a whole wall in others. I guess it was just to throw us of the scent.

With all this evidence its not surprising that it takes a visionary like Richard Gage to see how these are all connected.
 
So eloquently put Profanz. This issue has been discussed endlessly in these forums but I guess its worth starting a whole new discussion on them, since people reading this will have forgotten the other 122 threads in this forum that have discussed explosives or they may not be aware of the papers and articles on this issue that try and comprehensively evaluate both sides of the argument.

I cannot agree with Trutherslie that exploding perfume bottles brought down the twin towers. Our evidence is much stronger than that:

1. We have the evidence from the firemen that mentioned explosions. Unfortunately they are too afraid of authority or of being ridiculed by their fellow firemen to support our petition.

2. We even have a few firemen who mentioned flashes, but unfortunately there were no photographs of these flashes. So they presumably occured deep in the building since most of the windows were filmed and photographed.

3. Then there is the missing sound of the explosions. But I like your idea that the explosions were deep in the building. I guess the drywall kept in the noise.

4. But what about that big explosion at the start of the collapse. I particularly like our slide that says "Does this look like a gravitational collapse"? Well of course it looks like an almighty explosion to me. Its not that difficult to believe that a very large and quiet explosive device survived the impact and also survived the fires before it was detonated. So we were either very lucky that the explosives were located at the impact level or you need to put some credibilty in the radio controlled plane theory. It would have been really obvious and embarrassing if the plane hit the tower lower down and the collapse started 20 floors above.

5. And then we have all these squibs. Flashless explosions during the collapse sequence. This might even be a new form of explosives developed by the military. But what strange patterns they laid them in... and how did the explosives just blow out a single window in some cases and a whole wall in others. I guess it was just to throw us of the scent.

With all this evidence its not surprising that it takes a visionary like Richard Gage to see how these are all connected.

Please tell me you're joking.
 
aggle

I'm not suprised. I know people who have blown up beer keegs by throwing them into fires. I used to be a firemarshall (way back in the day) for part of my job, and one of the things we would do is take old fire extinguishers and throw them into a fire and then let them explode (we were behind a steel wall) to show that fires would cause fire extinguishers to explode.

Of course that leaves out
deodorant
perfume
plugged in computers
plugged in monitors
electrical transformers
electrical fuse boxes
water heaters
propane tanks
water pipes
AC units
batteries
copier toner
industrial cleaning supplies
any compressed gas items (like wd40, compressed air, etc)
the compressed air cylinders on the bottom of office chairs
bodies striking the ground
etc...
(and that is just off of the top of my head)
Now can HI/ algebra/ Profanz manage to eliminate ANY of those as the sources of the "explosions" people heard? No he can't. But he will try to say they were what cut the columns. Bad science. Yet again.

The company I work for manufactures foam packaging. A few years ago, one of our plants caught fire. It started in the electrical system and quickly spread to our product.

One of the employees, as soon as she realized there was a fire, ran to one of the dock doors as fast as she could. Before she could jump, she was thrown into the parking lot by an exploding propane can on one of the forklifts.

Steel frame building, burned completely to the ground. There's nothing left but a concrete slab now.
 
Please tell me you're joking.

He has to be.

4. But what about that big explosion at the start of the collapse. I particularly like our slide that says "Does this look like a gravitational collapse"? Well of course it looks like an almighty explosion to me. Its not that difficult to believe that a very large and quiet explosive device survived the impact and also survived the fires before it was detonated. So we were either very lucky that the explosives were located at the impact level or you need to put some credibilty in the radio controlled plane theory. It would have been really obvious and embarrassing if the plane hit the tower lower down and the collapse started 20 floors above.

No one argues their position by pointing out flaws in their own theory. That's what handwaving is for.
 
So eloquently put Profanz. This issue has been discussed endlessly in these forums but I guess its worth starting a whole new discussion on them, since people reading this will have forgotten the other 122 threads in this forum that have discussed explosives or they may not be aware of the papers and articles on this issue that try and comprehensively evaluate both sides of the argument.

I cannot agree with Trutherslie that exploding perfume bottles brought down the twin towers. Our evidence is much stronger than that:

1. We have the evidence from the firemen that mentioned explosions. Unfortunately they are too afraid of authority or of being ridiculed by their fellow firemen to support our petition.

I took at the parts that I will not address, because they are just dirt dumb.

Listen Telltale Tom, you wanna call us cowards, please stop by 10 House in NYC and tell them that to their face.

Firefighters stand by one another. 100%, all the time, without fail. We trust each other with our lives. For you to even post that "we're afraid of authority" is just ******* stupid. You basically just called firefighters everywhere cowards.

Telltale Tom, please explain, if we are such cowards, how in the **** do we do our jobs?? How does a COWARD run INTO a burning building, to rescue a PERFECT STRANGER, but wouldn't stand up for the MURDER of 343 of our own family?!?!?!?! How the **** do you get to that conclusion???

Please, I beg you, take me up on this.

I will PERSONALLY pay for your trip to NYC to visit 10 House, and you tell THEM that they are "afraid of authority" and are helping "cover up" the murder of 343 of their brothers. I DARE you. My only requirement, is that you let me put it on YouTube and GoogleVideo.

OMG, I would be an INTERNET GOD!!

BTW, one last thing. You are the coward. You idiots in the TM sit there, day after day, month after month, year after year, blabbing your bull**** about new investigation....blah blah blah.

What the hell have you dolts done to start your OWN new investigation??
With all those "Architects and Engineers" and their deep pockets, why haven't you done your OWN investigation??

WTF is stopping you??

Its because you are all COWARDS.

Mods: I will take my yellow card with a smile on my face.
 
Answers in bold.

So eloquently put Profanz. This issue has been discussed endlessly in these forums but I guess its worth starting a whole new discussion on them, since people reading this will have forgotten the other 122 threads in this forum that have discussed explosives or they may not be aware of the papers and articles on this issue that try and comprehensively evaluate both sides of the argument.

I cannot agree with Trutherslie that exploding perfume bottles brought down the twin towers. Our evidence is much stronger than that:

He didn't say that. HE says that in fire, bottles can burst, making an explosive noise.


1. We have the evidence from the firemen that mentioned explosions. Unfortunately they are too afraid of authority or of being ridiculed by their fellow firemen to support our petition.

There is no firemen that describes a noise consistent with man-made demolition. None. Zip. Nada. "Consistent " would be loudness, timing and brisance. None.


2. We even have a few firemen who mentioned flashes, but unfortunately there were no photographs of these flashes. So they presumably occured deep in the building since most of the windows were filmed and photographed.

Here are some flash explosions of the type that likely happened at WTC. Man-made demolition had nothing to do with them.

Con Edison power transformer explosion.

Transformer explosion - not as visually dramatic but you can hear the gunshot-like burts.




3. Then there is the missing sound of the explosions. But I like your idea that the explosions were deep in the building. I guess the drywall kept in the noise.


The 1993 bombing, 1,000 pounds of TNT, wasn't large enough to do any structural damage yet it was heard all over the 24 acre plaza and adjoing streets and up and down both towers.

The truck bomb was parked in the parking lot which was 6 floors deep. That beats you "sheetrock" fantasy.


4. But what about that big explosion at the start of the collapse.

What "big explosion at the start of the collapse" ? Please show us all the video that captured the sound of this explosion.


I particularly like our slide that says "Does this look like a gravitational collapse"? Well of course it looks like an almighty explosion to me. Its not that difficult to believe that a very large and quiet explosive device survived the impact and also survived the fires before it was detonated. So we were either very lucky that the explosives were located at the impact level or you need to put some credibilty in the radio controlled plane theory. It would have been really obvious and embarrassing if the plane hit the tower lower down and the collapse started 20 floors above.

5. And then we have all these squibs. Flashless explosions during the collapse sequence.

Compressed air blowing smoke out of windows. A real blasting charge would blow all the windows out of the side of the building.

This might even be a new form of explosives developed by the military. But what strange patterns they laid them in... and how did the explosives just blow out a single window in some cases and a whole wall in others. I guess it was just to throw us of the scent.

Pointless conjecture.

With all this evidence its not surprising that it takes a visionary like Richard Gage to see how these are all connected.

Your honor, the prosecurtion has presented no evidence in support of the claims.
 
1. We have the evidence from the firemen that mentioned explosions. Unfortunately they are too afraid of authority or of being ridiculed by their fellow firemen to support our petition.

No. They know you petition is based on claims of things that didn't happen.

Tell it to a fireman.
 
Please tell me you're joking.

Come on there is nothing that I am saying that is inconsistent with the ae911truth truth. I am not joking, I am very serious. I take my lead from Richard Gage and ae911truth, but I am not afraid to explore some of the small inconsistencies in our claims and some of the implications of what we are saying. The more honest discussion the better.

Nor do I mind that we have no support from the structural engineering community or from the fireman of NYC. Afterall they can be expected to understand these issues.

But look at it from the perspective that the towers were demolished by explosives; which means that either the fireman were in on it, or they are covering it up especially if they saw and heard the explosions, and we know they did.
 
The truth is in bold.

Come on there is nothing that I am saying that is inconsistent with the ae911truth truth. I am not joking, I am very serious. I take my lead from Richard Gage and ae911truth, but I am not afraid to explore some of the small inconsistencies in our claims and some of the implications of what we are saying. The more honest discussion the better.

There are no inconsistencies that are solved by adding man-made explosives or thermite. Adding either or both creates more new inconsistencies that would have to be solved. Hijacking a plane and crashing it is easier and actually happened.


Nor do I mind that we have no support from the structural engineering community or from the fireman of NYC. Afterall they can be expected to understand these issues.

They do. They do.

But look at it from the perspective that the towers were demolished by explosives; which means that either the fireman were in on it, or they are covering it up especially if they saw and heard the explosions, and we know they did.

There is absolutely no evidence for or argument for man-made demolition at WTC.
 
According to debunkers there should be thousands of recordings of any sounds claimed on 9/11. If you can't find at least 500, they must not have happened.

Sorry.

But nobody has found any videos with the sound of man-made demolition. In any case, any blast sound recorded by only one camera at WTC wouldn't be loud enough to be a demolition explosion.

IN 1993, the blast was heard all over the plaza and adjacent streets and up and down both towers and yet did no structural damage.
 
Come on there is nothing that I am saying that is inconsistent with the ae911truth truth. I am not joking, I am very serious. I take my lead from Richard Gage and ae911truth, but I am not afraid to explore some of the small inconsistencies in our claims and some of the implications of what we are saying. The more honest discussion the better.

Nor do I mind that we have no support from the structural engineering community or from the fireman of NYC. Afterall they can be expected to understand these issues.

But look at it from the perspective that the towers were demolished by explosives; which means that either the fireman were in on it, or they are covering it up especially if they saw and heard the explosions, and we know they did.

You're a complete liar, and full of ****.
 
But look at it from the perspective that the towers were demolished by explosives; which means that either the fireman were in on it, or they are covering it up especially if they saw and heard the explosions, and we know they did.

Were the explosions caused by magic man-made demolition explosives only heard by your alleged cowardly firemen?

Firemen were in the minority at until after the two towers had collapsed and then there were all those video cameras, none of which recorded any blast consistent in timing, loudness or brisance with man-made demolition.
 
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