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CIT Fraud Revealed

You have not shown any dishonesty (on CITs part, that is). You have made false allegations.

You know where the other witnesses were: Much further away from the blue line than Paik and Morin.

It's actually very simple, that's why it's so dangerous and the spinners are in heavy rotation.
 
How about we plot a line for every single witness who claims to have seen the plane fly over and display them, not just CIT's witnesses. What would that look like?
 
You have not shown any dishonesty (on CITs part, that is). You have made false allegations.

You know where the other witnesses were: Much further away from the blue line than Paik and Morin.

It's actually very simple, that's why it's so dangerous and the spinners are in heavy rotation.

CE

Despite the glaringly obvious attempt at deceipt from CIT, that we all see, can you comment on why it is that you believe them? Which part of their 'investigation' clinches it for you?
 
That's not true.

It doesn't help btw if you start treating every single testimony as if it were the absolutely exact truth. They are all in range of expectable exactness for witnesses, the closer the plane was to them, the better.

The corroboration is the point which renders the blue line, where nobody saw the plane flying, moot.

CIT are using 13 eyewitnesses that put the plane north of the CITgo. You mean to tell me that those 13 eyewitnesses, placing the plane in a different flightpath than the official story, negate the official flightpath? Yet when I try and use 8 of the 13 to negate (or draw into question) the flight path of the 5 "over the annex" eyewitnesses, it's different?

Why can't I use the same methodology/criteria that CIT does to question the 13 eyewitness flightpaths? Why do 8 eyewitnesses show north on the annex while 5 show over the annex?
 
You have not shown any dishonesty (on CITs part, that is). You have made false allegations.

You know where the other witnesses were: Much further away from the blue line than Paik and Morin.

It's actually very simple, that's why it's so dangerous and the spinners are in heavy rotation.

I'm curious of what your opinion is on the witnesses that say they witnessed flight 77 crash into the Pentagon.

Doesn't that make the CIT witnesses irrelevant?
 
CE,

The dishonesty is crystal clear -

Firstly, Edward Paik say in the CIT interview that the wings were over the road, CIT choose to ignore this and show a reconstruction of the plane flying completely over the navy annex.

Morin also says to Ranke that the plane was only over the edge of the annex, CIT choose to ignore this and fraudulently show a reconstruction of the plane flying completely over the annex.

This cant be any clearer. CIT are misrepresenting witness accounts to support their north of citgo claim. It is dishonest and it should not be condoned. You must be able to understand this.
 
The corroboration is the point which renders the blue line, where nobody saw the plane flying, moot.

Another question CE. If not one person out of the hundreds that were out and about that day in that area DID NOT SEE the plane fly the official flightpath, why does CIT only have 13 eyewitnesses? How many people did they interview?
 
Another question CE. If not one person out of the hundreds that were out and about that day in that area DID NOT SEE the plane fly the official flightpath, why does CIT only have 13 eyewitnesses? How many people did they interview?

Craig has said that he has talked to dozens of witnesses. Oddly enough only 13 are part of their "evidence". I would bet a large sum of money that they talked to plenty of people who put the plane on the "official" flight path.
 
Fish in a barrel...

Ya think?

Yes, mudlark has linked to the Balsamo/Desideri paper many times. Several of us have pointed out that pages 1 and 4 of that paper contain mistakes. Instead of addressing the math, mudlark's been telling us to take it up with Balsamo, whose 11.2g/10.14g/2223g/58g calculations were off by a factor of 5 to 1000+ and have become a running joke.

Oh dear: mudlark appears to be telling fibs.
:rolleyes:

Several people here have provided links to legitimate mathematics that refute mudlark's and/or Balsamo's assertions. It is mudlark who has steadfastly refused to discuss mathematics or physics here.

Smith, you keep SAYING that the math has been debunked but

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5489387&postcount=647

Smith said:
¨Unfortunately, you have also given the impression of denying those logical consequences of your argument. Hence it would be a waste of time for PfT or us or anybody to run the math on those specific 8 or 9 flight paths. Your logical inconsistency already refutes your argument.¨

You wanted specific parameters from witness testimonies.
You asked for the impossible yet Balsamo tried to compensate by running various witness compatible flightpaths AND at the official 540mph speed.

You want to argue math with somebody who has already admitted that it would be above their head on the technicalities but you haven´t the cojones to argue your point with the people who actually presented the math.
You mention the 11.2 g in the full knowledge that Pilotsfor911truth have publically admitted their mistake.

I have personally asked Rob balsamo if you are barred from the site and he said ´No´
He told me that you are more than welcome to argue your points with him. Either at the forum or in public.

Your excuse that you would be treated unfairly is a cop-out.
I´m here taking abuse and reading your and other´s snide comments but that doesn´t deter me.

Mudlark said:
Originally Posted by mudlark
You can't calculate where the shadow would be without knowing the altitude of the plane. If the plane "almost hit my roof" as Edward claimed and was "only about 3 feet above the Navy Annex" as claimed by Darius Prather there is no reason it couldn't have cast a shadow over Shinki's shop from the north path.
North of the Tropic of Cancer, it would be quite remarkable for any object's solar shadow to fall south of the object itself. I'm talking about planet Earth, of course; shadows may behave differently on TrutherWorld.
:p

What do you not understand about that post??
Are you telling me that a shadow could NOT have been cast on Ed Paik´s shop given the low altitude Ed paik described and NOT 450ft agl as suggested by BCR.
He claimed that he thought the plane was going to hit the ROOF.
What angle are you suggesting the sun was at that a shadow would have MISSED??

haha

It just tastes sweeter that you made a smartass comment to follow your illogical argument. Thanks. I knew i could count on you.

As an old friend, whatever his name is, used to say
kthxbye
 
Craig has said that he has talked to dozens of witnesses. Oddly enough only 13 are part of their "evidence". I would bet a large sum of money that they talked to plenty of people who put the plane on the "official" flight path.

Is there a list of all the people he talked to? Does he give a location were these witnesses were located that day?
 
Is there a list of all the people he talked to? Does he give a location were these witnesses were located that day?

The Douche-Bag Duo have yet to release the entire list of those they spoke with. The ones they interview give their locations.
 
Is there a list of all the people he talked to? Does he give a location were these witnesses were located that day?

The only ones I am aware of are in their retarded videos. But given that there are only 13, and that Craig says he talked to dozens, one would think they are hiding something.
 
CE,

I understand that Paik and Morin's recollections are not exactly on the official path but CIT have fraudulently represented their accounts to support a north of citgo claim. This is thoroughly dishonest.

If they were honest researchers they would have included Paik and Morin as south of citgo witnesses but note that they were placing the plane north of the official path.

Who drew this path? Craig? Aldo?

paikmap-2.jpg


The very fact that Morin placed the plane over the Annex is contradictory to the official story.
Elsewhere on these threads, BCR claimed that NOBODY saw a Navy Annex flyover. That if the FDR/RADES say it didn´t then it didn´t.
Among the 19 Navy Annex flyover witnesses whose testimony has been discarded by him Terry Morin is the most specific.

¨MORIN: WHEN THE PLANE WENT RIGHT OVER THE TOP OF ME I WAS WITHIN 10 FEET OF THE EDGE OF THE WING (OF THE ANNEX)

CRAIG : SO YOU WERE KINDA IN BETWEEN THEM (THE WINGS OF THE ANNEX)

(...)

MORIN: I WAS INSIDE..FLEW OVER THE TOP OF ME¨

(...)
¨CRAIG: WHAT ARE THE CHANCES THAT THE PLANE FLEW ON THE SOUTHSIDE, SOUTH OF COLUMBIA PIKE?

MORIN: NO FRICKIN´ WAY. IT FLEW OVER THE TOP OF ME¨

(...)

¨I HAD NO SIDE-VIEW. IF I HAD HAVE HAD A SIDE-VIEW I WOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO SEE THE STRIPES AND IDENTIFY IT AS AN AMERICAN AIRLINES JET..I DIDN´T SEE THE STRIPES, ALL I COULD SEE WAS THE BELLY¨

Those words are from the horse´s mouth. Not from Craig. Not from Aldo.

Others here have also claimed that the Navy Annex witnesses´ perspective may have made them BELIEVE what they saw.
They ignore this testimony constantly.

So who´s being dishonest?
 
The only ones I am aware of are in their retarded videos. But given that there are only 13, and that Craig says he talked to dozens, one would think they are hiding something.

They have talked to many. The main witnesses in the video presentation are ALL of the witnesses within the ANC/Citgo area.
 


Why are you lying? The National Security Alert vomit does NOT give the list of those they spoke with. You know this. Liar.

Is see the sock changed his story:

mudlark said:
The main witnesses in the video presentation are ALL of the witnesses within the ANC/Citgo area


Interesting. When will we hear from all the others? Well?
 
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