"Black face" skit on Australian variety show

[Foolmewunz]

Skeptic Brethren(and Sistren)...

Can someone give me a link to this study that shows that 40% of the country is of non-European origins? I'm not real comfortable with that figure unless it's counting any percentage of that person's make-up, AT ALL, as meaning that person is not Western European. Last study I saw, the figure was more like less than 15%, but that was from a decade ago.

 

[Legend]

And it's an international bruhaha about an Australian show, where the whole "blackface" bears apparently nowhere near the meaning that Connick put across, which I maintain was what I said through the syllogism I put forward before.

And FTR, I know some people can get take things personally on this forum and others. You should know I hold nothing against anyone here and this is merely a culture/opinion clash in which I have learnt a lot and shifted many of my views and approaches to this matter.

Alex.

 

[lionking]

Skeptic Brethren(and Sistren)...

Can someone give me a link to this study that shows that 40% of the country is of non-European origins? I'm not real comfortable with that figure unless it's counting any percentage of that person's make-up, AT ALL, as meaning that person is not Western European. Last study I saw, the figure was more like less than 15%, but that was from a decade ago.

Post #193

Since World War II ,
approximately 6 million immigrants from over 150 countries
have settled in Australia. According to the 2006 Census,
24 per cent of Australians were born overseas, and an
additional 20 per cent have either one or both parents born
overseas. These percentages are among the highest in the
developed world.

I'm not sure anybody has said 40% non-European, if they did it's not correct. But Australia is one of the more culturally diverse countries in the world.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Well many Australians weren't too happy with him. What an outrage!

We have many stupid Americans, too. There a vast numbers of stupid Chinese. Quite a few stupid blacks, even.
Since when did populism decide a skeptical/sceptical discussion?

You'd never understand, you're not Australia.

Nor am I Antartica, nor Lithuania.

Furthermore, it is not my "entire argument" at all. It was an addition to the body of my "argument".

Sorry, but you opened with a post on how outrageous his behaviour was, didn't you? (or was that your second post in the thread? whatever!) But the behaviour you find outrageous is not Connick's, it's your extrapolation of what he said.

And I don't care whose culture is whose, what GreyICE is trying to do is fundamentally problemed because he's comparing an apple with an orange.
Alex.

There are certain similarities between apples and oranges. They're both fruits, of a sort, they're both round or roundish, they're both tasty.... I'm not here to defend GreyIce - he's more than capable of doing that for himself, I'm sure. I was trying to discuss your posts and comments.

Oh, and I just saw your latest post while previewing this one. I concur that there's nothing personal about this. I'm just curious why you are taking such a hard line on this.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Post #193



I'm not sure anybody has said 40% non-European, if they did it's not correct. But Australia is one of the more culturally diverse countries in the world.

Thanks LK. I saw Damien's post (that young whippersnapper said 40% non-European in #219) and thought he was repeating yours, which I couldn't find. You never said non-European - the numbers you show make sense.

 

[UnrepentantSinner]

Post #193

I'm not sure anybody has said 40% non-European, if they did it's not correct. But Australia is one of the more culturally diverse countries in the world.

Thanks LK. I saw Damien's post (that young whippersnapper said 40% non-European in #219) and thought he was repeating yours, which I couldn't find. You never said non-European - the numbers you show make sense.

Looks like Damien not only needs to quiet down his laughing dog, but should get ready to enjoy some crow. Bold mine.

Oh yeah, we're homogeneous all right. Or at least if you take away the 40% of our population who aren't from North-Western Europe we are, anyway.

But thanks for showing you know absolutely nothing about Australia.

 

[Legend]

Oh, and I just saw your latest post while previewing this one. I concur that there's nothing personal about this. I'm just curious why you are taking such a hard line on this.

I often play Devil's Advocate, or at least say some things that I don't 100% agree on for the sake of it.

That said, of course, most of this comes as an honest opinion, some of it, particularly what came later on, perhaps wasn't as said with as much conviction as other things.

Alex.

 

[GreyICE]

Well many Australians weren't too happy with him. What an outrage!

You'd never understand, you're not Australia.

Furthermore, it is not my "entire argument" at all. It was an addition to the body of my "argument".

And I don't care whose culture is whose, what GreyICE is trying to do is fundamentally problemed because he's comparing an apple with an orange.

Alex.

I'm sorry, it kind of stings, doesn't it? Even though you think I'm not serious (am I? Maybe I do think you rapist-loving Australians are that bad).

As for their act, it's like me showing up in tacky shorts with a beer gut hanging over the waistband, saying 'G'day' and 'mate' and 'crikey' a lot, complain about how hard it is to wrassle Alligators, and how all my friends are thieves and crooks because of who they're descended from.

I'm not making fun of Australia. I'm mocking Steve Irwin! I can't get how you Australians can't take a joke, what with the fact that I look nothing like him, act nothing like him, but am obviously a characture of an Australian!

There were lots of things to make fun of about Michael Jackson. They chose to make fun of his race.

 

[Legend]

I don't think you understood my sarcasm in that post?

Maybe you did.

And they weren't making fun of his race at all, and I think those holding opposite views to most of what I've posted would even concede that.

I know what you're doing, and no, it doesn't affect me at all because I know you're being facetious. If you weren't being facetious, I'd be for the most part hardly affected. My earlier reaction was the progeny of what I thought was you having a pathetically corrupt premise to an argument that was baseless. It all makes sense. I hope you understand. Your point would be a valid one if what they did on Hey Hey was anything near what you're doing (even though it is theoretical or didactic).

At any rate I advertise my previous post regarding FoolMeWunz.

Alex.

 

[Damien Evans]

This is ironic, given that you know nothing about the rest of the world. But hey, isn't racism fun when it's applied to you and all the rest of the lazy, ignorant, and backwards Australian morons who have nothing better to do than exclaim 'crikey' and drink lousy beer?

Yes, I don't know much about the world outside Australia. But unlike you, I at least don't pretend I do then insult other countries based on my own lack of knowledge.

Oh, and here's a newsflash: I'm not ignorant or backwards, I don't drink lousy beer and I never say crikey. I'll grant that I am lazy though.

 

[Damien Evans]

So it would be OK if those guys had dressed up as the "Abo 5" in blackface and wigs and playing digeridoos while throwing boomerangs at a stuffed kangaroo and falling down in mock drunkeness?

Because that's how offensive the routine is from an American POV.

No, it wouldn't have been, because being in Australia they would be expected to know that was offensive.

I understand how, as an American, you can see the routine as offensive, but we don't have that cultural background. We don't find the same things offensive that you do, and until Connick said his piece, many (probably most) Australians wouldn't have realised how that would be offensive to an American or from an Americans point of view, given we don't have the history of blackface routines here. It was a (presumably) innocent mistake, which, now it has been called out, is unlikely to be repeated.

 

[Damien Evans]

When Legend thought I was serious, he was angry. Why? It's not any fun when someone makes stupid assumption and bad jokes based on your color or country of origin. Is it? When they assume you're stupid, lazy, uneducated, inexperienced, just because of what you look like or where you come from.

Unless it's done in blackface, of course.

Ah. In that case, very well played indeed.

 

[Damien Evans]

My posts rarely make sense and are never worthwhile - if you're as dumb as an Australian! Zing! Oh man, hope I don't get on TV and mock you ignorant Aussies, god, that would be hilarious.

ETA: Ooh, let me translate that into Aussie so Aussies have a shot at understanding.

Ooh, Crikey mate, my here postin on this forum ain't gonna make sense if youse an alligata wrasslin homie from down under. Ain't that a burn, mate? Crikey my show here ain't so gosh gee good that I don't get on the Teh-Veh and make fun of youse here Aussies in the down under, cause that would be hee-larioaus. Crikey!

Actually, I understood the non-aussie far better.

 

[Damien Evans]

Post #193



I'm not sure anybody has said 40% non-European, if they did it's not correct. But Australia is one of the more culturally diverse countries in the world.

I did say 40% non North-Western European. (By which I meant British Isles, France and Germany)

ETA: Here are the figures, at least if you can figure out how to find them (It being 1am on a Sunday, I cannot):
http://www.abs.gov.au/websitedbs/c3...72d63376a903a452ca2572650016785c!OpenDocument
http://www.abs.gov.au/websitedbs/D3310114.nsf/home/census+data?opendocument#from-banner=LN
I'm sure the correct data is in one of those two links somewhere though.

 

[WildCat]

You are allowed to say "smartarse" Alex. The auto-censor isn't Australianised.

You can also say the American "smartass".

 

[WildCat]

No, it wouldn't have been, because being in Australia they would be expected to know that was offensive.

I understand how, as an American, you can see the routine as offensive, but we don't have that cultural background. We don't find the same things offensive that you do, and until Connick said his piece, many (probably most) Australians wouldn't have realised how that would be offensive to an American or from an Americans point of view, given we don't have the history of blackface routines here. It was a (presumably) innocent mistake, which, now it has been called out, is unlikely to be repeated.

So why does everyone have their panties in a knot over Connick's reaction? The attitude of several Aussie posters here seems to be "it was hilarious, get over it".

 

[EvilSmurf]

I understand how, as an American, you can see the routine as offensive, but we don't have that cultural background. We don't find the same things offensive that you do, and until Connick said his piece, many (probably most) Australians wouldn't have realised how that would be offensive to an American or from an Americans point of view, given we don't have the history of blackface routines here. It was a (presumably) innocent mistake, which, now it has been called out, is unlikely to be repeated.

Don't try and tell me that a worldly man like Red Symons wouldn't understand the cultural implications of blackface. I think even Darryl Somers would have known at least something.

 

[Damien Evans]

So why does everyone have their panties in a knot over Connick's reaction? The attitude of several Aussie posters here seems to be "it was hilarious, get over it".

Dunno, it didn't seem over the top to me.

I was laughing pretty hard, but I was laughing at the performers, not with them. They looked ridiculous, they couldn't sing or dance, they were pretty much an abject failure. And they were making themselves look stupid on national television. That's what I found funny about it.

 

[Damien Evans]

Don't try and tell me that a worldly man like Red Symons wouldn't understand the cultural implications of blackface. I think even Darryl Somers would have known at least something.

I'd think Symonds probably would understand it. Somers, not so much.

 

[Legend]

Ah. In that case, very well played indeed.

Seriously?

Is what GreyICE did actually all that impressive? His "cleverness" is nothing more than taking something completely out of context and exaggerating it into something it is not. The Hey Hey skit was not a group of people sitting there stereotyping black people, or pointing out faults and generalising, which is what GreyICE is doing. They did not call black people "rapist-loving" or "lazy" or "uneducated" or even put on an accent. I'm scoffing at this, while you guys are praising it.

I don't understand what's so impressive about something that just doesn't fit with fact.

Alex.