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VP Debate Thread

The CNN strip chart of uncommitted Ohio voters really cracked me up. What kind of creepy focus group is that? Did they hook electrodes up to them? Have them squeeze the ball harder when they are aroused?

I get the feeling that Palin watched way too much 'Mr Rogers' when she was young. It's a beau-ti-ful day in the neighborhood...
Despite her voice being like dragging fingernails on a chalkboard - I thought she generally did a good job. She kept the focus on McCain, didn't screw up, and kept Biden on the defense. She's playing a role that echoes a popular American myth - that anyone born here could grow up to be president someday, even you. McCain Strategy: "So here's what that looks like." As long as she does not do anything startlingly crazy we are willing to cut her slack. Hitting too hard could even backfire.

She says nuke-u-lar like Bush. I don't think I can take more years of that.
 
corplinx said:
The problem with the polls is, this debate wasn't about who won unless it was Palin. The narrative we were working with is "how badly will Joe beat her". The fact that he didn't clobber her makes it a defeat for him. He gained nothing. He underperformed his expectations.
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I don't know man.....

Biden 46%
Palin 21%
Tie 33%

Palin didn't beat the tie number and Biden more than doubled her in points on this poll. I don't know about you but to me that is pretty clearly the answer to "how badly will Joe beat her."
 
As they say, 'she didn't suck'.

Course we could bring in a chrome bumper and see if that changes things.
(Sorry Tricky, I couldn't resist). :D
 
Oliver said:
No. At least she didn't use the word "without" in the context of healthcare.

ETA:

Palin: "But it wasn't just that experience tapped into, it was my connection to the heartland of America. Being a mom, one very concerned about a son in the war, about a special needs child, about kids heading off to college, how are we going to pay those tuition bills? About times and Todd and our marriage in our past where we didn't have health insurance and we know what other Americans are going through as they sit around the kitchen table and try to figure out how are they going to pay out-of-pocket for health care? We've been there also so that connection was important."
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Yeah that. I'm finding that very hard to swallow.
 
corplinx said:
Once again, the winner is MattusMaximus who instead watched House MD. To be fair though, someone watching Quincy probably wins as well.
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:egglaugh:

rdaneel said:
What's bugging me is that her folksiness is reminding me of a character, but I can't think of her name. Almost always ended her sentences with "Doncha know"
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SezMe said:
The waitress Flo from the TV series Mel's Diner or something like that?
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Flo had a southern accent. He's probably referring to the Sheriff in Fargo.
 
Boo said:
I thought Biden's response to gay marriage was pretty good, in that he clearly defined marriage as a religious issue and that the government was not in the business of redefining a religious designation.
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It was a good political answer and it defuses the controversy, but I still say that anybody whos says this (including Biden or Obama) is full of crap. Marriage is not a religious issue. I'm married and I'm an atheist. Nobody has ever questioned if I have the right to be married. I have a marriage certificate from the government.

The word "marriage" may have some religious origins, I honestly don't know, but by todays usage it has little... make that nothing... to do with religion. The reason for not calling gay unions "marriage" is nothing but pandering to the religious conservatives and fear of being demonized by the church.

Yeah, I know. Politicians have to pander to certain very powerful groups. It still sticks in my craw.
 
not_so_new said:
I don't know man.....

Biden 46%
Palin 21%
Tie 33%

Palin didn't beat the tie number and Biden more than doubled her in points on this poll. I don't know about you but to me that is pretty clearly the answer to "how badly will Joe beat her."
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He got 46 percent, he didn't break 50. Even his ticket is breaking 50 in the polls right now. Scoring double but not even breaking half isn't exactly a pounding.

79 percent though he won or tied. 54 percent though she won or tied. Biden was expected to whip her about like an insect.
 
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Tricky said:
It was a good political answer and it defuses the controversy, but I still say that anybody whos says this (including Biden or Obama) is full of crap. Marriage is not a religious issue. I'm married and I'm an atheist. Nobody has ever questioned if I have the right to be married. I have a marriage certificate from the government.

The word "marriage" may have some religious origins, I honestly don't know, but by todays usage it has little... make that nothing... to do with religion. The reason for not calling gay unions "marriage" is nothing but pandering to the religious conservatives and fear of being demonized by the church.

Yeah, I know. Politicians have to pander to certain very powerful groups. It still sticks in my craw.
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Mine too. Again, this was one area where I was pretty let down by Biden. We might just be ready for a black president but gays are still out of bounds, I don't like that at all. We have a long way to go in this nation.
 
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corplinx said:
He got 46 percent, he didn't break 50. Even his ticket is breaking 50 in the polls right now. Scoring double but not even breaking half isn't exactly a pounding.

79 percent though he won or tied. 54 percent though she won or tied. Biden was expected to whip her about like an insect.
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In our polarized and fairly equally divided country, a 25% difference is a pounding. A severe pounding.

Didn't Bush claim a "mandate" after winning by two percent?
 
Tricky said:
In our polarized and fairly equally divided country, a 25% difference is a pounding. A severe pounding.

Didn't Bush claim a "mandate" after winning by two percent?
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Beat me too it.... good post, just what I was thinking.

In a race where we are talking about an 8 point lead in Florida as an out-lier poll number 25% is, as Tricky said, a severe pounding.
 
not_so_new said:
Mine too. Again, this was one area where I was pretty let down by Biden. We might just be ready for a black president but gays are still out of bounds, I don't like that at all. We have a long way to go in this nation.
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I know. It is deflating. A couple of years ago, my company had a "diversity and inclusion" day. People could, and did, talk about how their "group" was treated in the workplace. There were single mothers, blacks, Asians, alcoholics, young people, old people, handicapped people.

The one group nobody signed up for was "gay". I know at least three gay people who were in the room, but not a one was willing to be identified as gay to the general public. The prejudice is too strong.

Of course, you could be even more unelectable. You could be a gay atheist.
 
Oliver said:
On the day before election day.
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That'll be too late. With Iraq, Katrina and the present crisis, I can't believe the Republicans are getting out of these debates relatively unscathed.

Until then, Palin is going for McCains jugular. :p
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Are you suggesting they are having an affair? :eek:
 
Tricky said:
In our polarized and fairly equally divided country, a 25% difference is a pounding. A severe pounding.
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Its expectations. You have a 46/33/21 split in one poll. However, going in my guess is it was expected to be 60/30/10 or so.

A pounding in this case is relative.
 
Tricky said:
I know. It is deflating. A couple of years ago, my company had a "diversity and inclusion" day. People could, and did, talk about how their "group" was treated in the workplace. There were single mothers, blacks, Asians, alcoholics, young people, old people, handicapped people.

The one group nobody signed up for was "gay". I know at least three gay people who were in the room, but not a one was willing to be identified as gay to the general public. The prejudice is too strong.

Of course, you could be even more unelectable. You could be a gay atheist.
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True, the only thing worse than being gay is being an atheist (a black gay atheist would be about as bad as it could get). I think being an atheist is partly why I relate to minorities as I do.

Funny thing is I work in an architectural firm, many of the guys are gay so I get a little skewed viewpoint on 'gays in the workplace.'

;)

Sorry for the off topic everyone.
 
Whiplash said:
I noticed Biden repeatedly saying "John" for McCain, as Obama did.. is this a strategy of some kind? To lower his importance? To personalize things? I don't think Biden said "McCain" once. Just "John". Any clues? ...
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No, I see nothing sinister there, its because they both KNOW the man, and call him "John."

Though no doubt some pundit the argument that some people are SO stupid that unless they see a "John" on the ballot they will vote for Obama or some such noise, but that is really grasping.
 
corplinx said:
Its expectations. You have a 46/33/21 split in one poll. However, going in my guess is it was expected to be 60/30/10 or so.

A pounding in this case is relative.
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Fair enough.

There is a good bit of "we didn't lose as bad as we planned so that means we won" going on which always seems like a flat out political move over a logical one to me but hey, they (and we) all do it.

At the end of the day, I don't think Palin did anything to cost McCain the election tonight but she didn't come close to making a dent in the other direction either.

At BEST from the McCain side it's a wash and as I said in the Obama McCain debate, a wash for Obama / Biden is as good as a win strategically (there now I am doing it as well...)

:D
 
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